How much will I gain from taking my case prep to the next level
- Thread starter slvdout
- Start date
Weight sorting brass is quick and easy on a digital scale. I found good results on group sizes.
I'm in the process of building an annealer so I'm excited to see results of that combined with the weight sorting.
I have neck turned only my 308 brass in the past before I did any other extra prep work. I struggled with it and results were not detectable at that time. I am a much better shooter now and have access to a range where results are much more noticeable so may have to try it again.
I'm in the process of building an annealer so I'm excited to see results of that combined with the weight sorting.
I have neck turned only my 308 brass in the past before I did any other extra prep work. I struggled with it and results were not detectable at that time. I am a much better shooter now and have access to a range where results are much more noticeable so may have to try it again.
I'm shooting a stock savage F-class in 6.5 x 284. Its a 1/2 MOA gun and I rarely shoot past 300m with it. This is a pic from my last range trip.
Well then it may be worth your while for sure, what brass are you currently using? Also if you buy Lapua or Nosler Custom brass it can save you some of the case prep work as it is match quality and already been weight sorted and primer flash holes cleaned up.
I guess I'm asking if I sort the cases, turn the necks and neck size instead of FL sizing. Will i see a noticeable difference in my groups or do you think I'm approaching the limits of my rifle? Maybe I'm at the limit of my skill? What's the next logical step to improvement?
- Location
- West Quebec
Good thread .. tagged
I'm lazy with case prep.
I clean, size, chamfer, load and go. I weigh every charge to .02 on a good quality scale.
This has got me in to the .5moa challenge.
It's also got me .181moa at 300, my personal best.
I don't anneal, my brass is going on 15 loads, and I've never weighed a case.
I clean, size, chamfer, load and go. I weigh every charge to .02 on a good quality scale.
This has got me in to the .5moa challenge.
It's also got me .181moa at 300, my personal best.
I don't anneal, my brass is going on 15 loads, and I've never weighed a case.
I started with simple 2 die set a long time ago. Progressed over the years acquiring new rifles. Reloading was always for me to get better precision.
Now I got myself a rifle that is capable for LR.
I fixed myself a 5" 5 rounds group at 1 km. Don't know if I will acheive it, but it is surely fun to try ! That LR thing is still new to me.
Mush
Annealing isn't about accuracy. It's about increasing case life. And it's only done when one case, usually the mouth, cracks.
The rest of it is mostly bench rest loading and won't increase accuracy out of a typical hunting rifle. Especially if that rifle has a stock barrel and trigger.
I very much doubt using over priced factory brass will make any difference. That target at 300? If it is, your rifle is way sub-half minute.
A small group at 1,000 is 10". One MOA.
The rest of it is mostly bench rest loading and won't increase accuracy out of a typical hunting rifle. Especially if that rifle has a stock barrel and trigger.
I very much doubt using over priced factory brass will make any difference. That target at 300? If it is, your rifle is way sub-half minute.
A small group at 1,000 is 10". One MOA.
arcticcathonda
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Southern Alberta
Depends, are you happy with your groups or not? Is that the practical limit of your rifle? Have a shooter better than you shoot your rifle and loads....
After a while, it becomes a game of largely diminishing returns. I found going from any lower than the 0.4-0.3 MOA range is not worth it for me, and investing time into reading the wind by shooting more and reloading less tightened my long range groups.
All depends on your goals!
Your asking about case prep on a stock factory rifle with a standard size SAAMI chamber, so here is something that was said "humorously" by the late Jim Hull of the Sierra test lab and compeditive shooter who was a strong advocate of full length resizing.
"I get my best accuracy when the cartridge fits the chamber like a rat turd in a violin case".
Now remember this, perfectly made cartridge cases are a scarce as hens teeth, meaning you will almost always have cases with unequal case wall thickness that will warp when fired.
A full length resized cartridge case is supported by the bolt face and the bullet in the throat of the chamber. Meaning the body of the case and neck never touch the chamber walls and cause any misalignment with the bore.
Below, the rear of the case is supported by the bolt face.
And the front of the case is supported by the bullet in the chamber throat, and the body and neck of the case has no influence on centering the bullet in the chamber.
Weight sorting cases only applies to cases from the same lot number of of cases, and does not work well with mixed brass of the same manufacture because the internal volume of the cases differ so much. Meaning the internal volume of the case H2O weight is what controls chamber pressure and not the weight of the case. Trust me, I had three five gallon buckets of once fired .223/5.56 cases given to me that I tried sorting by weight and then checked the case capacity on and it was all over the place. This type brass is OK for shooting an AR15 carbine but my bolt action rifles use better quality brass from the same lot.
Many of the competitive shooters at http://www.accurateshooter.com/ buy Lapua brass and do nothing to the brass prior to shooting. So your question really deals with the quality of the brass and its uniformity and sorting and prepping standard off the shelf brass can be more trouble than its worth.
Below Kevin Thomas of Team Lapua USA knew Jim Hull and also shares his full length sizing sentiments and uses Lapua brass for all his shooting
Bottom line, the average off the shelf factory rifle with a standard SAAMI chamber will normally not show much improvement by doing a lot of brass prep, BUT good quality brass will always shoot better than second rate brass.
Meaning good quality brass needs minimal work done to it to shoot well and average brass can drive you up the wall trying to make it better.
"I get my best accuracy when the cartridge fits the chamber like a rat turd in a violin case".
Now remember this, perfectly made cartridge cases are a scarce as hens teeth, meaning you will almost always have cases with unequal case wall thickness that will warp when fired.
A full length resized cartridge case is supported by the bolt face and the bullet in the throat of the chamber. Meaning the body of the case and neck never touch the chamber walls and cause any misalignment with the bore.
Below, the rear of the case is supported by the bolt face.
And the front of the case is supported by the bullet in the chamber throat, and the body and neck of the case has no influence on centering the bullet in the chamber.
Weight sorting cases only applies to cases from the same lot number of of cases, and does not work well with mixed brass of the same manufacture because the internal volume of the cases differ so much. Meaning the internal volume of the case H2O weight is what controls chamber pressure and not the weight of the case. Trust me, I had three five gallon buckets of once fired .223/5.56 cases given to me that I tried sorting by weight and then checked the case capacity on and it was all over the place. This type brass is OK for shooting an AR15 carbine but my bolt action rifles use better quality brass from the same lot.
Many of the competitive shooters at http://www.accurateshooter.com/ buy Lapua brass and do nothing to the brass prior to shooting. So your question really deals with the quality of the brass and its uniformity and sorting and prepping standard off the shelf brass can be more trouble than its worth.
Below Kevin Thomas of Team Lapua USA knew Jim Hull and also shares his full length sizing sentiments and uses Lapua brass for all his shooting
Bottom line, the average off the shelf factory rifle with a standard SAAMI chamber will normally not show much improvement by doing a lot of brass prep, BUT good quality brass will always shoot better than second rate brass.
Meaning good quality brass needs minimal work done to it to shoot well and average brass can drive you up the wall trying to make it better.
My goal when I started was to shoot 1/2 minute groups and I'm averaging that now. The only thing left is to complete the challenges over in the precision forum, which I hope to do shortly. Now I'm hoping to hear from some guys that maybe started out with low to mid range equipment and simple loading procedures and since taken it to the next level. When did you decide to start turning necks etc? When should I upgrade my rifle? How much of a difference does any of it make?
Some interesting info in there, thanks. that all goes against what I read about lots on this forum. I guess that in a sense is what I'm trying to sort out. FWIW I am using Lapua brass.Your asking about case prep on a stock factory rifle with a standard size SAAMI chamber, so here is something that was said "humorously" by the late Jim Hull of the Sierra test lab and compeditive shooter who was a strong advocate of full length resizing.
"I get my best accuracy when the cartridge fits the chamber like a rat turd in a violin case".
Now remember this, perfectly made cartridge cases are a scarce as hens teeth, meaning you will almost always have cases with unequal case wall thickness that will warp when fired.
A full length resized cartridge case is supported by the bolt face and the bullet in the throat of the chamber. Meaning the body of the case and neck never touch the chamber walls and cause any misalignment with the bore.
Below, the rear of the case is supported by the bolt face.
And the front of the case is supported by the bullet in the chamber throat, and the body and neck of the case has no influence on centering the bullet in the chamber.
Weight sorting cases only applies to cases from the same lot number of of cases, and does not work well with mixed brass of the same manufacture because the internal volume of the cases differ so much. Meaning the internal volume of the case H2O weight is what controls chamber pressure and not the weight of the case. Trust me, I had three five gallon buckets of once fired .223/5.56 cases given to me that I tried sorting by weight and then checked the case capacity on and it was all over the place. This type brass is OK for shooting an AR15 carbine but my bolt action rifles use better quality brass from the same lot.
Many of the competitive shooters at http://www.accurateshooter.com/ buy Lapua brass and do nothing to the brass prior to shooting. So your question really deals with the quality of the brass and its uniformity and sorting and prepping standard off the shelf brass can be more trouble than its worth.
Below Kevin Thomas of Team Lapua USA knew Jim Hull and also shares his full length sizing sentiments and uses Lapua brass for all his shooting
Bottom line, the average off the shelf factory rifle with a standard SAAMI chamber will normally not show much improvement by doing a lot of brass prep, BUT good quality brass will always shoot better than second rate brass.
Meaning good quality brass needs minimal work done to it to shoot well and average brass can drive you up the wall trying to make it better.
