BE CAREFUL- A- reminder
- Thread starter FORTUNA
- Start date
- Location
- Over the rainbow
Tl;dr: Guy uses 40 gr of Titegroup instead of Varget, leaving rifle, scope and finger on right hand in poor state of repair.
*NSFW* for some gore.
I'm less than a year into reloading, but one thing that still totally befuddles me is why on earth manufacturers use similar sound names and numbers, and similar looking packages for their powders. There are only a few major companies making powder; how hard would it be to agree on a universal colour scheme? Like black for rifle, red for pistol, green for shotgun or whatever.
And stop with the easily confused numbers. Get the damned marketing department to come up with a name that is easy to remember and distinguish.
*NSFW* for some gore.
I'm less than a year into reloading, but one thing that still totally befuddles me is why on earth manufacturers use similar sound names and numbers, and similar looking packages for their powders. There are only a few major companies making powder; how hard would it be to agree on a universal colour scheme? Like black for rifle, red for pistol, green for shotgun or whatever.
And stop with the easily confused numbers. Get the damned marketing department to come up with a name that is easy to remember and distinguish.
You do realize that some powders are used in rifles,shotguns and handguns?
If a person is very easily confused, perhaps they shouldn't reload?
I have been reloading for around 40 years, and I have never mixed up powders. It's not rocket science, and the people that mix up powders, will likely do it, no matter how the powders are labelled.
New Camper
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Lurking in the woods near SFRC.
Ouch... He is fortunate to have sustained only that damage.... and a wrecked rifle.
A reminder to us all and the fortunate/unfortunate man, the obvious reason why it is recommended and good practice to have only one powder on the bench while reloading.
I fail to see how it is difficult to distinguish between powder labels: In this case, there are the names written in big block letters "TITEGROUP" and "VARGET" (and VARGET is in red) and with two distinctly different and easy to recognize names. Numbers make more sense though, if they have some relevance to the burn rate or rank compared to other powders. Some numbered names appear random: For example, H380 - the powder received it's name for the 38.0gr Bruce Hodgdon used in 22-250 to proper a 52gr bullet. Previous to that, it was an experimental spherical powder with no name.
Labeling and naming powders has worked for decades for everyone: Changing this to something "simpler" is akin to putting all way stops at every intersection because one guy might or has caused a crash by running (out of ignorance or intentional) through the traditional (and correct) two way stop sign. I can't think of a product where the manufacturer would be most prudent in being clear and concise as those of gunpowder.
A reminder to us all and the fortunate/unfortunate man, the obvious reason why it is recommended and good practice to have only one powder on the bench while reloading.
I fail to see how it is difficult to distinguish between powder labels: In this case, there are the names written in big block letters "TITEGROUP" and "VARGET" (and VARGET is in red) and with two distinctly different and easy to recognize names. Numbers make more sense though, if they have some relevance to the burn rate or rank compared to other powders. Some numbered names appear random: For example, H380 - the powder received it's name for the 38.0gr Bruce Hodgdon used in 22-250 to proper a 52gr bullet. Previous to that, it was an experimental spherical powder with no name.
Labeling and naming powders has worked for decades for everyone: Changing this to something "simpler" is akin to putting all way stops at every intersection because one guy might or has caused a crash by running (out of ignorance or intentional) through the traditional (and correct) two way stop sign. I can't think of a product where the manufacturer would be most prudent in being clear and concise as those of gunpowder.
Ouch! That's one costly (health wise) mistake made there and hope the guy recovers well. A sobering reminder that there's little room for second guessing or making assumptions of anything when reloading. The difference between Titegroup and Varget is as clear as black and white so for this guy to not clue in when he was reloading says he's either new to reloading, just started using these two powders or absentminded.
There is no room for complacency in reloading. If you are easily distracted or absentminded, stick to factory ammo and save yourself a potential catastrophic mistake you will only do once. One simple guideline to follow is that only ONE type of powder container is allowed on the reloading bench at any time when working and that is what is in the powder measure. If you reload multiple calibers with the same powder, don't rely on your memory on the usual loads, check your charts before you begin. All it takes is one brain fart.
There is no room for complacency in reloading. If you are easily distracted or absentminded, stick to factory ammo and save yourself a potential catastrophic mistake you will only do once. One simple guideline to follow is that only ONE type of powder container is allowed on the reloading bench at any time when working and that is what is in the powder measure. If you reload multiple calibers with the same powder, don't rely on your memory on the usual loads, check your charts before you begin. All it takes is one brain fart.
I started reloading around 1960. I load for Rifle, pistol and shotgun. I load a lot of ammo each year.
I have yet to choose the wrong powder to load any of these. [ I will admit once pouring a small amount of powder back into the "Wrong" tin. Caught it immediately, however.]
Nevertheless, over the past 50 years, I have seen 7 rifles that resembled the one in the picture linked. One of these was from a double charge of a light load in a pre-64 M70 Winchester in 300 H&H mag. [What a waste!] The others were all from use of the wrong powder.
I have a cardinal rule: I double check before I start charging, and NEVER have more than one powder container on my bench at a time.
If I am weighing individual charges, I use 2 scales, one to verify the other. [I prefer my RCBS chargemaster, though]
I am anal when loading light charges for my handguns. Do not want any "double" charges to plague me.
It pays to be careful. This fellow in the picture will always have a reminder of his "faux pas"
Be safe with our hobby, all you reloaders out there!! Dave.
I have yet to choose the wrong powder to load any of these. [ I will admit once pouring a small amount of powder back into the "Wrong" tin. Caught it immediately, however.]
Nevertheless, over the past 50 years, I have seen 7 rifles that resembled the one in the picture linked. One of these was from a double charge of a light load in a pre-64 M70 Winchester in 300 H&H mag. [What a waste!] The others were all from use of the wrong powder.
I have a cardinal rule: I double check before I start charging, and NEVER have more than one powder container on my bench at a time.
If I am weighing individual charges, I use 2 scales, one to verify the other. [I prefer my RCBS chargemaster, though]
I am anal when loading light charges for my handguns. Do not want any "double" charges to plague me.
It pays to be careful. This fellow in the picture will always have a reminder of his "faux pas"
Be safe with our hobby, all you reloaders out there!! Dave.
For all of those who think it can't happen to you...
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/969637-LE-No-1-blowup-or-how-not-to-dissemble-a-Lee-Enfield-(Update-post-97)?highlight=lee+enfield+blow+up
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/969637-LE-No-1-blowup-or-how-not-to-dissemble-a-Lee-Enfield-(Update-post-97)?highlight=lee+enfield+blow+up
It can happen to anybody. That is why you put in place QA/QC processes along the way, so that the odds are infinitesimal. Steps like looking up the load, again, in both your loading manual, and your notebook. Twice.
Steps like only having the one powder container you are using open and on the bench. One. only.
Steps like verifying the name on the can against the open loading manual and notebook, AGAIN.
Steps like verifying that the scale is zero'ed, set at the correct charge for the powder in question, AGAIN.
And, lastly, a quick visual powder level check in each charged case before seating the bullet.
Yup, it can still happen, but I kinda like my odds. Not a bad idea to keep the wobbly pops in the other room, un-opened, until the loading is done, I have no patience for "background music" while concentrating on detail, and kids, spouses, and buddies should sit in the corner and be quiet - not bad advice at anytime, but certainly when dispensing powder!
A few seconds verifying before you start can save years of adapting to shooting with the rude finger, or worse.
Steps like only having the one powder container you are using open and on the bench. One. only.
Steps like verifying the name on the can against the open loading manual and notebook, AGAIN.
Steps like verifying that the scale is zero'ed, set at the correct charge for the powder in question, AGAIN.
And, lastly, a quick visual powder level check in each charged case before seating the bullet.
Yup, it can still happen, but I kinda like my odds. Not a bad idea to keep the wobbly pops in the other room, un-opened, until the loading is done, I have no patience for "background music" while concentrating on detail, and kids, spouses, and buddies should sit in the corner and be quiet - not bad advice at anytime, but certainly when dispensing powder!
A few seconds verifying before you start can save years of adapting to shooting with the rude finger, or worse.
I've reloaded over 30 years and I haven't mixed up powders, ever. I'm careful, maybe even anal about checking the powder, the charge weight, and my reloading recipe prior to starting a reloading session.
The colour coding idea is pure safety nazi silliness - which is to say it doesn't fix anything but makes people who don't understand feel like they accomplished something. You can get in just as much trouble by using the wrong rifle powder as you can get by using pistol powder in a riifle cartridge or vice versa. YOU SILL HAVE TO READ THE LABEL EVEN IF IT WAS COLOUR CODED.
Anyone who does want to colour code could do it themselves with a trip to the dollar store. They have duct tape in different colours. Knock yourself out, but you still have to read the label unless you only have one powder of each type. LOL.
Reloaders need to be capable of focusing on the task in hand. If you can't focus on what you're doing then you shouldn't be reloading. It's like driving a car - distractions cause accidents. This is not rocket science. People who screw up might make excuses but the bottom line is they screwed up.... and whether they reloaded for 1 year or 50 years has no bearing whatsoever.
There are hundreds of thousands of reloaders that haven't hurt themselves and never will. This guy got complacent. Too bad for him, I hope he learned something but i don't plan to change my reloading habits simply because he screwed up.
The colour coding idea is pure safety nazi silliness - which is to say it doesn't fix anything but makes people who don't understand feel like they accomplished something. You can get in just as much trouble by using the wrong rifle powder as you can get by using pistol powder in a riifle cartridge or vice versa. YOU SILL HAVE TO READ THE LABEL EVEN IF IT WAS COLOUR CODED.
Anyone who does want to colour code could do it themselves with a trip to the dollar store. They have duct tape in different colours. Knock yourself out, but you still have to read the label unless you only have one powder of each type. LOL.
Reloaders need to be capable of focusing on the task in hand. If you can't focus on what you're doing then you shouldn't be reloading. It's like driving a car - distractions cause accidents. This is not rocket science. People who screw up might make excuses but the bottom line is they screwed up.... and whether they reloaded for 1 year or 50 years has no bearing whatsoever.
There are hundreds of thousands of reloaders that haven't hurt themselves and never will. This guy got complacent. Too bad for him, I hope he learned something but i don't plan to change my reloading habits simply because he screwed up.
Last edited:
The guy with the sore hand said he has reloaded for 30 years.
He also said that a week ago, he would have said Can't happen to me.
The guy with the sore hand said he has reloaded for 30 years.
He also said that a week ago, he would have said Can't happen to me.
I 20 odd years now and have made one mistake. I used Winchester 760 in pistol instead of Winchester 231!! Did not check properly! My bad. Did not shoot any but spent a couple of days taking apart about 500 rounds of 45ACP!
kids, that why you always check and double check everything.
its like in a laboratory, one error and you unleach the plague, you got to follow a strict protocol.
people that go fast and carelessly had it happen.
he made a mistake, he got the result. that his fault, dont try to blame the color of the bottle.
its like in a laboratory, one error and you unleach the plague, you got to follow a strict protocol.
people that go fast and carelessly had it happen.
he made a mistake, he got the result. that his fault, dont try to blame the color of the bottle.
I've done this but only when the can is obviously empty, and then the label comes right off the can and duct tape goes around it, with the powder type, lot number, and the exact until weight written on the duct tape. I then also write the powder type on the lid, just so I can look at them from the top and know I'm right. When that can is empty, duct tape comes off and new tape on, if I need that can and don't have other empties
