80% lowers - ATF determination letter

sewktbk

sewktbk

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I simply thought it was informative, so decided to share.

h ttps://www.polymer80.com/assets/images/AFT%20Letters/AR15%20P80%20Determination%20Letter.pdf?referer=mailid:75
 
sewktbk said:
Its not a grey area at all. Canadian gun manufacturers have been making and selling 80% lowers for years. No licence required for purchase.
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agreed and Canadian laws even give you the steps to take to register your project once complete.
it's certainly not a grey area.
 
ShawnC6 said:
Yes it is legal, but there is also no technical point where it goes from being a piece of plastic to being a firearm either
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yes there is ..... the second it is operational

the term "80%" is a American term .

here it either operates as a firearm or doesn't .

in other words it could be a "99.999%" receiver and not function as a firearm and not be a firearm
 
ShawnC6 said:
Yes it is legal, but there is also no technical point where it goes from being a piece of plastic to being a firearm either
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um..... ya there is ..... once it's capable of loading and firing ammunition...... you have 30days to have it verified and registered if it is a restricted firearm.
the laws are actually quite clear for those who care to read thru them ;)
 
45ACPKING said:
um..... ya there is ..... once it's capable of loading and firing ammunition...... you have 30days to have it verified and registered if it is a restricted firearm.
the laws are actually quite clear for those who care to read thru them ;)
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And Sweetheart will affirm that the '30 days' is an illusion because the police will charge you if they find you with it unregistered regardless of if you are at day 1 or day 29. (they will assume you are at day 31)

I think, perhaps, what Shawn is getting at, (and keep in mind, I have actually registered homemade ar15 and ar10 lowers made/started from solid blocks of aluminum) is that the RCMP SFSS will not give you a firm point at when it must be registered other than 'when it is capable of discharging a round' (their words). While that may seem straightforward, you have to remember that your opinion of when it can discharge a round may not jive with their opinion on when it can discharge a round. ie. you may think that 'safely' would be a criteria whereas they think that even if it self destructs after one round, that counts :)

Also, for people buying '80% lowers', pay special attention to the fire control group pocket. I have seen people trying to sell 80% lowers that were cut for an autosear, and the RCMP will consider that a Full-auto lower even if you don't drill the hole or actually have an autosear
 
If they are not guns in the States until completed and not guns in Canada until operable or close to it and registered, does that mean I can buy a couple in the States and bring them across the border? Or are they still ITAR controlled items?
 
Ebola said:
If they are not guns in the States until completed and not guns in Canada until operable or close to it and registered, does that mean I can buy a couple in the States and bring them across the border? Or are they still ITAR controlled items?
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Don't think they're ITAR controlled. I believe they are considered to be just a piece of metal/polymer.
 
Most of the manufacturers use raw forgings from the same supplier. ITAR controls the export of military technology, and that includes raw parts. The 80% pieces being sold here are coming from a licenced exporter or are made here.
 
tiriaq said:
Most of the manufacturers use raw forgings from the same supplier. ITAR controls the export of military technology, and that includes raw parts. The 80% pieces being sold here are coming from a licenced exporter or are made here.
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Well actually, the company who posted the ATF letter makes polymer lowers, so we can't really be talking about forgings, as they are not metal.
 
80% lowers are ITAR controlled, though Im not sure if they sneak under if they're cheap enough?

Anyways, do a google search for 'canada 80% lower' and buy one locally instead.
 
*MALICE* said:
And Sweetheart will affirm that the '30 days' is an illusion because the police will charge you if they find you with it unregistered regardless of if you are at day 1 or day 29. (they will assume you are at day 31)

I think, perhaps, what Shawn is getting at, (and keep in mind, I have actually registered homemade ar15 and ar10 lowers made/started from solid blocks of aluminum) is that the RCMP SFSS will not give you a firm point at when it must be registered other than 'when it is capable of discharging a round' (their words). While that may seem straightforward, you have to remember that your opinion of when it can discharge a round may not jive with their opinion on when it can discharge a round. ie. you may think that 'safely' would be a criteria whereas they think that even if it self destructs after one round, that counts :)

Also, for people buying '80% lowers', pay special attention to the fire control group pocket. I have seen people trying to sell 80% lowers that were cut for an autosear, and the RCMP will consider that a Full-auto lower even if you don't drill the hole or actually have an autosear
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Good points. Some people think the 80% lower issue is simple. Its not.
 
There is no value limit on ITAR.

Doubt that the material makes any difference.
Get products that have been exported by a licenced exporter.
 
Re this---anyone know where I can purchase a good universal jig in Canada? Looking at getting one from a couple of different US companies and of course each one says theirs is the best for different reasons.....would like to buy in Canada if possible.
 
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