IPSC is awesome for pistol but for shotgun, rifle and pistol combined it's not like your typical 3gun. You can do it only as a tournament and all or even two different disciplines are never used in the same stage. So if you want to enjoy an excellent shotgun or pistol or rifle match you can do that with IPSC. If you want to enjoy a 3gun match where you can transition in same stage to different disciplines then IPSC is definitely not the way to go.
Critical differences between ipsc and 3 gun rules?
- Thread starter GR0M
- Start date
When it comes to safety and what practices/restrictions we're used to, when shooting some of the 3-Gun matches I've been to in the USA I've lost count of the number of times I've said:
"we could NEVER do this at home".
That said... Even with what we over regulated Canadians are used to I've never found anything we've shot in the US to be inherently more dangerous than what I see at home.
It's a lot more "big boy rules", but I don't have a problem with that at all.
- Location
- Fort St John B.C.
The problem is that we also have some stupid rules that have nothing to do with equality and safety, like dress codes. And just in case anyone in this thread tries to pull the Vince Pinto BS and say the dress codes are at the MD's discretion, when words "strongly discouraged" are used, most MD's just interpret them as "banned". Over the years, we became a big government with a big body of laws. We should consider cleaning up the rules in the future.
That is true. I've met a lot of great people in IPSC practices and the few matches that I've attended. Also I've met'em via forums, youtube and Facebook. The game is definitely fun (even though I'd definitely take the "P" out of the acronym lol) and I'll be shooting a lot more matches when I move to a different region.
While I'm against it being an absolute requirement, I think the course is more than worth the cost. While it's not strictly a shooting skills development course, it helps in that department and the amount of coaching is incredible. Also you get good feedback on the equipment you'll wanna run, rules of the game, gaming the stages and most importantly you meet a lot of good people while you're at it.
And?... You will be spending much more than that just in less than a few years if you will actually shoot IPSC, let alone to train to be winning.
Besides, out of these few hundred bucks, $25 is a course fee, $74 is an instructor fee (for spending two full days with you at the range and providing instruction, it is a real bargain) and the rest is your IPSC membership dues (which you will have to pay regardless of the course in order to participate in IPSC sanctioned matches all over the world).
These numbers are for IPSC Ontario and likely is different in other provinces, but you get the idea.
Show up at an ipsc match without having done a BB course and see how it goes for you... Lol.
I've never seen the BB course as "holster" training.
It's a class on how to play the game.
Safe deployment of a holstered pistol is just a natural consequence of the course.
I've never seen the BB course as "holster" training.
It's a class on how to play the game.
Safe deployment of a holstered pistol is just a natural consequence of the course.
- Location
- Halifax - NS
Canada is not the only country that requires a course and is in fact part of the majority that requires it.
It's a completely different discipline.
Nobody's forcing you to shoot IPSC, if you don't like the requirements to participate - we're ok with that. It's not for everyone.
Carry on with Service Pistol and the IPSC shooters like myself will wish you the very best at it.
The most critical difference is that ipsc sucks because its not a real 3 gun match
Hopefully ipsc can borrow the best aspects of 3gun nation and apply their experience to develop a good rule set, but im not overly optimistic it will be able to compete with 3gun nation.
The biggest problem with outlaw 3 gun and even 3gn at this point is fairness....lots of RO subjectivity when a rule doesnt exist....some match directors come from ipsc or uspsa and handle this aspect.quite well....others can sink your entire match with one bad call (depending on the scoring system)
Hopefully ipsc can borrow the best aspects of 3gun nation and apply their experience to develop a good rule set, but im not overly optimistic it will be able to compete with 3gun nation.
The biggest problem with outlaw 3 gun and even 3gn at this point is fairness....lots of RO subjectivity when a rule doesnt exist....some match directors come from ipsc or uspsa and handle this aspect.quite well....others can sink your entire match with one bad call (depending on the scoring system)
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Yep. Seen it....way too often. Folks show up, and have a background in this, background in that...etc. Then run around the range with there finger in the trigger guard, or even on the trigger, or sweep them selves, break 90...etc..etc. Its not even like it is one time occurence...
Point of fact though, of the military, ex military, RCmp, Corrections, etc that i have put through the Black Badge course, they had the most discipline for muzzle safety...and trigger control. You tell them once...they usually completed the course without incident. The safety rules are basically the same, of course except the movement and different scenarios.
- Location
- Halifax - NS
Don't hold your breath, IPSC executive has stated clearly they aren't interested in true 3gun (multigun?) and are happy leaving it to the other organizations.
IIRC there has been some buzz on GV about it.. At the time I was in favour, but on more reflection, I won't lose any sleep if it never gets implemented. From time to time I just wanna run with my AR without showing off my lack of handgun skills or total ineptitude with a shotgun, so it's good to have a venue where that can be done. The only bummer is that thanks to our libtard overlords, we've fostered a culture of "handgun is king, shotguns are serfs, rifles are pest animals" in our region. Discovering loopholes in our laws, combined with more 3gun events held out there resulted in a slight resurgence of rifle matches. I can't ignore the will and the hard work of EESA and Peterborough IPSC guys who held more matches with rifles last year than the entire section over the previous 4 years. On a good note, if we had a plethora of rifle matches in our section, chances are I would have never played 3gun, which resulted in having had a lot of fun and having met some great people
....and there is nothing wrong with that.
Love it or hate it IPSC does a very good job at what it does.
As with any large org it has hiccups and issues, but overall it's pretty well run... I mean personally, I've never been to an IPSC handgun match that totally sucked.
For the most part they are well organized, well run, well staffed and the standardization of rules, practices and processes work. Why mess with it?
For IPSC to take on what is essentially new/different discipline might be biting off more than it can chew or... At least could result in resources being spread too thin.
Not to contribute to thread drift too much, but why do you think that is? Some of these groups get accused of running scary unsafe ranges. There are bullet marks on our range walls and baffles attributed to them, fairly or not. Is it familiarity with moving with a loaded firearm or the fact that they listen to direction? I suspect it is the latter.
IPSC and 3Gun are totally different. I shoot IPSC and would love to shoot some more multigun or 3gun and accept different sports have different rules. When we put on a multigun or rifle match we invariably modify and have unique rules. It would be like trying to impose NASCAR rules on Formula 1.
As for the lawyers with guns criticism that is totally on the individual competitor to what level they want to 'game' the game. Yes, it's a game. You can show up and just concentrate on shooting and having fun and being safe. If you run on the edge that's your decision. If you want to contest hits and stage setups, again that's on you if you think it's important to your score and ranking. I know people who barely bother to skim the scores at the end of the day and are just happy they got a chance to play the game.
Maybe my region is laid back but I've never heard of a costume issue coming up. Maybe all our MDs are sane, common sense people. The only costume issue I would ever highlight is if it impinges on safety.
As for the lawyers with guns criticism that is totally on the individual competitor to what level they want to 'game' the game. Yes, it's a game. You can show up and just concentrate on shooting and having fun and being safe. If you run on the edge that's your decision. If you want to contest hits and stage setups, again that's on you if you think it's important to your score and ranking. I know people who barely bother to skim the scores at the end of the day and are just happy they got a chance to play the game.
Maybe my region is laid back but I've never heard of a costume issue coming up. Maybe all our MDs are sane, common sense people. The only costume issue I would ever highlight is if it impinges on safety.
A high-placed executive in our region made a forum post (on another forum) saying that if people dressed like they do for CQB matches, we shouldn't even consider attaching the word IPSC to the match and that "Whoever is going to be the match director needs to step up and enforce 5.3.1 to a decent degree." I'm sorry but I don't see what 5.3.1 has to do with competitor safety or equality in scoring. That's just a useless dress code rule. For you non-IPSC guys, 5.3.1 reads as follows:
When I raised the issue, a highly placed IPSC executive (globally) told me that camo isn't really banned, but it's up to the MD's discretion if the MD thinks it's inappropriate. Getting lots of mixed signals there over this particular rule. I'd really like to know how this rule does anything to promote safety or fairness in our sport lol
