Need Progressive Press....But Which One?
- Thread starter c-fbmi
- Start date
Well, I went down this aft and ran through 100 45 ACP to see how she works.........it was not without it's trials........first, couldn't get primers to go into the primer pick-up tube. About 10 picked up and then she seized up solid, pokered them ones out and removed a burr I could see in the tube and tried again to no avail. Picked up about 10 and seized up again, pokered them ones out and threw the tube across the room and grabbed my RCBS ones and loaded the priming tube on the machine.
Set up the powder thrower to throw my load and all went very smooth there, filled the case feeder with about 500 cases which didn't seem like too many and fired it up..........no rotation and no cases coming out. Checked everything over and found the bolts had not been tightened in the hub of the feeder wheel and was allowing it to rotate without turning the wheel.....fixed that.........got cases now. Started cranking the handle up and down and watching everything and it all seemed to be going smoothly for about 10 rounds and then seizure.........no more roundy round........got case wedged up with a high primer, obviously didn't get enough up pressure at the top of the stroke to seat the primer fully. Can't get the GD plate to turn, can't get the GD case out of the plate, can't get the GD plate to go back so I can hit it again. The harder I try to get the case out the stucker it gets, so I give it my best most determined reverse rotation thrust and then found out why it wouldn't go back..........because of the detent the little shell holder spring goes into as it is pushed down to accept a new case. I found that with enough reward force one can shear off the spring and rotate the shell plate back to the priming station. Oh well got 3 of them with the machine, down to 2 now. I had another little glitch and managed to get 5 cases without primers as I dicked around with the glitch doing partial ups and downs and watching something else. No primers but managed powder and bullets.......well sort of.....powder all over the show now and I have 5 lovely bullets seated into cases with no means of propelling them out........I f**king hate that !!!!!!! Then the case feeder quit giving me cases again, got whirring sound but no rotation.......HHHMMMMM, I have over come more complex problems, I'm sure. Remove feeder hopper and dump all the cases onto the bed, look and found that some cases had rolled up under the wheel and lifted it off of it's drive set up. No biggy, remove offending cases and reset feeder wheel, all looks good now...........Back to up-down, up-down, up..........f**k, now what, primer won't seat.......check alignment, all good......remove case and make sure it doesn't have a primer already or something stuck in the primer pocket.......all looks good, replace it in the shell plate and attempt to seat again..........no joy. Yank the case out again and am about to careen it across the room and realize that the pocket looks too small.......yep it's a small primer pocket brass. The guy I bought the brass from said there were none but apparently 4 (so far) slipped past his vigilance.........I'm having fun, in case you hadn't gleaned that from my dissertation thus far. I like problem solving, I'm good at it and don't generally break too much stuff during trouble shooting and resolution of the immediate issue at hand. In the end I loaded 100 rounds, I don't THINK I have any with no powder, I don't THINK I have any with double charges.........caught one that double charged while I was dicking around fixing something else, hope it was the only one. Ain't progressive loaders fun............I had forgotten how much FUN I had with my old C-H inline, but it's all slowly coming back to me........
Set up the powder thrower to throw my load and all went very smooth there, filled the case feeder with about 500 cases which didn't seem like too many and fired it up..........no rotation and no cases coming out. Checked everything over and found the bolts had not been tightened in the hub of the feeder wheel and was allowing it to rotate without turning the wheel.....fixed that.........got cases now. Started cranking the handle up and down and watching everything and it all seemed to be going smoothly for about 10 rounds and then seizure.........no more roundy round........got case wedged up with a high primer, obviously didn't get enough up pressure at the top of the stroke to seat the primer fully. Can't get the GD plate to turn, can't get the GD case out of the plate, can't get the GD plate to go back so I can hit it again. The harder I try to get the case out the stucker it gets, so I give it my best most determined reverse rotation thrust and then found out why it wouldn't go back..........because of the detent the little shell holder spring goes into as it is pushed down to accept a new case. I found that with enough reward force one can shear off the spring and rotate the shell plate back to the priming station. Oh well got 3 of them with the machine, down to 2 now. I had another little glitch and managed to get 5 cases without primers as I dicked around with the glitch doing partial ups and downs and watching something else. No primers but managed powder and bullets.......well sort of.....powder all over the show now and I have 5 lovely bullets seated into cases with no means of propelling them out........I f**king hate that !!!!!!! Then the case feeder quit giving me cases again, got whirring sound but no rotation.......HHHMMMMM, I have over come more complex problems, I'm sure. Remove feeder hopper and dump all the cases onto the bed, look and found that some cases had rolled up under the wheel and lifted it off of it's drive set up. No biggy, remove offending cases and reset feeder wheel, all looks good now...........Back to up-down, up-down, up..........f**k, now what, primer won't seat.......check alignment, all good......remove case and make sure it doesn't have a primer already or something stuck in the primer pocket.......all looks good, replace it in the shell plate and attempt to seat again..........no joy. Yank the case out again and am about to careen it across the room and realize that the pocket looks too small.......yep it's a small primer pocket brass. The guy I bought the brass from said there were none but apparently 4 (so far) slipped past his vigilance.........I'm having fun, in case you hadn't gleaned that from my dissertation thus far. I like problem solving, I'm good at it and don't generally break too much stuff during trouble shooting and resolution of the immediate issue at hand. In the end I loaded 100 rounds, I don't THINK I have any with no powder, I don't THINK I have any with double charges.........caught one that double charged while I was dicking around fixing something else, hope it was the only one. Ain't progressive loaders fun............I had forgotten how much FUN I had with my old C-H inline, but it's all slowly coming back to me........
lejarretnoir
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- 162km from Connaught
c-fbmi,
Sounds like your on your way. LOL
I did polish the primer feed and deburred it all before I even used it. No problems with it at all.
I also adjusted the pawls and called Hornady for some shims to tighten the powder measure as it kept getting loose.
Other than forgetting priming, double charging as I ran it through setup it's all working smoothly now. Already loaded a 1,000 rds.
Sounds like your on your way. LOL
I did polish the primer feed and deburred it all before I even used it. No problems with it at all.
I also adjusted the pawls and called Hornady for some shims to tighten the powder measure as it kept getting loose.
Other than forgetting priming, double charging as I ran it through setup it's all working smoothly now. Already loaded a 1,000 rds.
hillbros_96
Regular
- Location
- Nowhere BC
MMM I am watching this thread to see how Doug makes out to see which way I go, as I am just getting started in IPSC and i am hoping not to reload 1000's of rounds through my forester lol.
So last night I went down and changed it over to load 38 Spl, which meant changing everything including primer size..........it went smooth and was done quite quickly, didn't time myself and it was my first caliber and primer change out, but it still didn't seem like too much of an ordeal. Also adjusted the pawls for advancing as it was just a touch late on the indexing.......made a huge difference. Took a look at the spring shell retainer that I sheared off.........was able to fix it and get 'er back into service. My only real complaint is that f**king large primer pick up tube, but I have some 12" drill bits and some steel rods and 600 grit paper, so I'll fix that SOB. I have noticed an improvement I'm going to do right away here, I am going to take the priming tubes off the machine and counter bore them about 1/8" and then turn the outside ends of the pick up tubes to fit into the counter bored recess to align the tubes for the transfer of the primers from the pick up tube to the "on machine" primer tube. It's a little thing but I can see myself doing the "100 primer pick up" game in the near future if I don't.
Might run some 38 today and see how it goes.........I'll let ya'll know when I do.
PS...I bought 10 extra die bushings so I am able to just remove the existing set up dies, put them back into their die box (and they fit) and set up and adjust for a new cartridge without losing my settings on the previous cartridge.
Might run some 38 today and see how it goes.........I'll let ya'll know when I do.
PS...I bought 10 extra die bushings so I am able to just remove the existing set up dies, put them back into their die box (and they fit) and set up and adjust for a new cartridge without losing my settings on the previous cartridge.
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I am in the same boat debating which way to go.. One thing you guys never answered is how much it costs for both? I am looking to reload 9mm, 45, 223, and possibly 308 down the road.
What was your total setup cost to get going with your system?
What was your total setup cost to get going with your system?
With the LNL AP set up for 4 calibers, with case feeder.....................I already own the dies.............1600 bucks landed from Henry @Budget Shooters Supply, and he had everything in stock !!!!!!
lejarretnoir
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- 162km from Connaught
Just look up Henry's Budget Shooters site and price it out what you want.
I already own the dies, but Hornady LNL AP with one shellpate came to $637 plus taxes/shipping. You might save a few bucks elsewhere, but getting it in stock is the next question.
I'm into it for ~ $2,300 just for 9mm.
- used Dillon XL 650 with case feeder, powder feeder and dies for 9mm $1,200
- Mr BulletFeeder $600
- misc gauges, scales funnels, Vibra Prime, work lights ~$400
- custom bench ~$100 in materials
The Mr BulletFeeder is a really great add-on. Really increases the production rate and because it seats the bullet squarely each time, my rejects from case gauging have dropped to about 1 every 200 rounds or so.
- used Dillon XL 650 with case feeder, powder feeder and dies for 9mm $1,200
- Mr BulletFeeder $600
- misc gauges, scales funnels, Vibra Prime, work lights ~$400
- custom bench ~$100 in materials
The Mr BulletFeeder is a really great add-on. Really increases the production rate and because it seats the bullet squarely each time, my rejects from case gauging have dropped to about 1 every 200 rounds or so.
My LNL fired up with few issues.
I bought it to load a specific cartridge; 9x40 (very similar to 357sig- uses a 40 S&W case necked down to hold a 9mm bullet).
My only issue was the case feeder- even their paperwork that came with it said they are a problem for 40S&W. So I measured the Lee Pro1000 setup beside it to see what orifice sizes they used and drilled out the Hornady parts to match- it works great.
I added their computer and it works good but was not without it's issues; the primer level warning system, when full, the weight on the rod can get caught under the case feeder on the lever down stroke causing a real pile up... I put tape from the drop tube to the case feeder body to act as a guide and problem was solved. The rest was just tweaking the micro switch arms- standard setup fair.
**A primer tube vibratory filler is mandatory (I have a Frankford Arsenal and am happy with it)**
As for changing cartridges I found to do it quickly and to not screw with settings you really need a separate powder measure case activated lower assembly for every caliber- not cheap...
Another thing I noticed is that a powder check die isn't needed as I operate it (almost) left handed (I stand to the right of the machine- the complete unit is on my left) and the presentation of the case when dropping a bullet on it is perfect- your looking right down into the case.
And as for comparing progressives by rounds per hour- can we please drop this?
There is no standard to this measurement- no 2 people define it the same and at the honest rates the worst one still does is very quick.
We should rate them by:
Safety; Hornady LNL is excellent (as is Dillon). Primer handling on Lee sucks...
Ease of setup; No comment on Dillon, haven't set one up. Hornady LNL was minimal. I won't comment on Lee.
Ease of use/smoothness; Hornady LNL is extremely smooth (no powder spillage even with a very full case) and easy to use. Dillon owners are very loyal with theirs. Lee owners either upgrade or learn to live with them.
Ease/Cost of caliber conversions; Lee Pro1000 is cheap and quick, but it is a Lee Pro1000...Hornady LNL, either it is cheap and not quick or quick and not cheap. The Dillon is quick I'm told but the powder measure sucks IMO so this is subjective.
Precision; Hornady LNL is excellent and the powder measure is unequaled. Dillon is up there but put a Hornady powder measure on it...
Warranty; Dillon, hands down.
So who has the best press, well that depends on your priorities of the various criteria; for me the Hornady LNL was the clear choice and I'm happy with it.
Still, if I had some cash kicking around (not likely...) I wouldn't mind buying a 650 just for my own comparisons.
I bought it to load a specific cartridge; 9x40 (very similar to 357sig- uses a 40 S&W case necked down to hold a 9mm bullet).
My only issue was the case feeder- even their paperwork that came with it said they are a problem for 40S&W. So I measured the Lee Pro1000 setup beside it to see what orifice sizes they used and drilled out the Hornady parts to match- it works great.
I added their computer and it works good but was not without it's issues; the primer level warning system, when full, the weight on the rod can get caught under the case feeder on the lever down stroke causing a real pile up... I put tape from the drop tube to the case feeder body to act as a guide and problem was solved. The rest was just tweaking the micro switch arms- standard setup fair.
**A primer tube vibratory filler is mandatory (I have a Frankford Arsenal and am happy with it)**
As for changing cartridges I found to do it quickly and to not screw with settings you really need a separate powder measure case activated lower assembly for every caliber- not cheap...
Another thing I noticed is that a powder check die isn't needed as I operate it (almost) left handed (I stand to the right of the machine- the complete unit is on my left) and the presentation of the case when dropping a bullet on it is perfect- your looking right down into the case.
And as for comparing progressives by rounds per hour- can we please drop this?
There is no standard to this measurement- no 2 people define it the same and at the honest rates the worst one still does is very quick.
We should rate them by:
Safety; Hornady LNL is excellent (as is Dillon). Primer handling on Lee sucks...
Ease of setup; No comment on Dillon, haven't set one up. Hornady LNL was minimal. I won't comment on Lee.
Ease of use/smoothness; Hornady LNL is extremely smooth (no powder spillage even with a very full case) and easy to use. Dillon owners are very loyal with theirs. Lee owners either upgrade or learn to live with them.
Ease/Cost of caliber conversions; Lee Pro1000 is cheap and quick, but it is a Lee Pro1000...Hornady LNL, either it is cheap and not quick or quick and not cheap. The Dillon is quick I'm told but the powder measure sucks IMO so this is subjective.
Precision; Hornady LNL is excellent and the powder measure is unequaled. Dillon is up there but put a Hornady powder measure on it...
Warranty; Dillon, hands down.
So who has the best press, well that depends on your priorities of the various criteria; for me the Hornady LNL was the clear choice and I'm happy with it.
Still, if I had some cash kicking around (not likely...) I wouldn't mind buying a 650 just for my own comparisons.
Update please. I'm looking to load 9mm 45acp and maybe 223
Like you, my time is precious, so the old clunky RCBS and the rockchucker are too slow for production
I'm torn between blue and red and don't care either way. Although I've never really liked the Hoenady rifle dies...
Like you, my time is precious, so the old clunky RCBS and the rockchucker are too slow for production
I'm torn between blue and red and don't care either way. Although I've never really liked the Hoenady rifle dies...
Well Gate I just ran a batch of 45 ACP for 100 rds to set up and haven't run anymore since. I set up for 38 spl but haven't done a run yet..........So far I like what I see and it's a few bucks less than the blue. I think I'll be just fine with it when all is tuned, timed and running good. From my experience so far I'd be highly inclined to recommend it. I like the way the dies cam in to the top frame, good and solid and quick once adjusted in their bushings (which incidentally fit back into their die boxes complete) It is smooth and not complex at all IMHO.
- Location
- Quebeckistan
I'm using a Dillon 550 myself... simple, fast, reliable, flexible, and while not "cheap" by any standards, cost was reasonable
It's faster than I'd ever need it to be.
It's faster than I'd ever need it to be.
Thanks for the tip, no more duct tape to hold the pwr measure in place 
392485 WASHER 1.375x1x.005 SS FH QTY 1 $.00 EA
392363 SPRING CASE RETAINER LNL® AP QTY 1 $.00 EA
Just did a quick call, they knew exactly what I needed after mentioning the pwr measure twist out, need shim. Also got them to throw in another case retention spring. Got an email within half hour order is being processed.
392485 WASHER 1.375x1x.005 SS FH QTY 1 $.00 EA
392363 SPRING CASE RETAINER LNL® AP QTY 1 $.00 EA
Just did a quick call, they knew exactly what I needed after mentioning the pwr measure twist out, need shim. Also got them to throw in another case retention spring. Got an email within half hour order is being processed.
