Tight group and .357/38?

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Brianma65

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I want to load .357 and 38 special ,with 125g campro plated bullets. The onl powder I can find is tight group . Hodgdonreloading lists these 2 loads for this 357, and both are so far apart in pressure and FPS ? Can I use the Hornady XTP data for my campro plated?image.jpgimage.jpg
 

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That load data very similar to my Hodgdon manual for 125gn. Your first set of data is for 38 special lead bullet flat point round nose, the second 357 magnum coated. I load my 38 special with titegroup at a level similar to your first chart (lower). For range use and given tight powder supplies, why load to 357 magnum levels?
 
For a plated bullet, use the data for 125 grain, LRNFP. As Captainmike suggests, a slower powder will work better in 357, but Titegroup will work with this light bullet.

From: Hodgdon Reloading

38 Special. 125 gr. LRNFP: Min: 3.2 gr...........Max 3.8 gr
Note: 3.5 grains is a good, midrange load. (My load)

357 Mag 125 gr LRNFP : Min. 4.0 gr.......Max. 5.4 gr

Note: The minimum 4 gr works well. 4.5 is better (My loads)
 
Campros have a thick plating and can be loaded just like FMJ. I've used Titegroup + Campros for 357 loads with no problems though I prefer H110/W296 for Magnum loads.
 
Ganderite said:
That data is ok, but is also max.

For the 38 Spl, my guns like 4.5 to 5.0 gr for top accuracy.
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those 2 loads were taken of hodgdonreloading , using .357 mag ,125 g bullet, tight group powder. Those were the 2 loads it gave me. I'm using a S&w 686 ,5 inch barrel. Why would it give a load for .357 and a load for .38 (as some suggested) if I only entered .357 in the drop down BX?
 
Brianma65 said:
those 2 loads were taken of hodgdonreloading , using .357 mag ,125 g bullet, tight group powder. Those were the 2 loads it gave me. I'm using a S&w 686 ,5 inch barrel. Why would it give a load for .357 and a load for .38 (as some suggested) if I only entered .357 in the drop down BX?
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Since the 357 can shoot 38SPl loads, by giving you the 38 Spl data they are giving your the recipe for mild loads for a 357.

Titegroup is a good powder for accuracy loads.
 
To me it looks like the data on the left side is intended to replicate a not .38Spl load or a +P load in the magnum cases. The velocity and peak pressure listed are more along the lines of a +P than a Magnum load. I'm not sure why they'd list it at that level unless the cast bullet they listed tended to lead up the bore if used with higher pressures and velocities. Leading is, hopefully :d, something you would not see with the Campro bullets.

They show a few cast lead options for 125 and 130gn bullets. And I see that the peak pressure in all cases is held down to a rather mild level by Magnum standards. I'm guessing that this is due to the nature of cast lead bullets and how higher pressures will affect them. Again this means that the plated bullets might well be able to run at higher pressure and velocity without breaking down. It depends on the durability of the plating.

As for the powder choice look at the data for the hotter loads listed under the XTP jacketed bullet. You'll soon see that the slower powders like 4227, H110 and even IMR 4756 all produce the same or superior muzzle velocity for the same or less peak pressure. And one that isn't included because it's made by Alliant that also shares this "more with less" trait is 2400. So while Titegroup CAN be used for Magnum reloading I'd suggest that it's stretched at this application. I'd much rather use the other powders for such loads if I were doing a lot of them. In particular the ones that generate the same or more velocity with LOWER peak pressures are going to beat up the gun less than the higher peak pressures of Titegroup.

I haven't shot Campro plated bullets but I'd be carefull about sneaking up on the max power loads. I'd tend to shoot some in close at something like 8 or 10 yards with a target on a larger size cardboard backer. I'd look for little slices on the target and backing that indicate the plating being torn off due to pressure and velocity issues. If you don't get any than you're golden and can move on to checking for accuracy at various power loadings. This is the sort of thing that is either there or it isn't. So a single cylinder's worth will tell the story immediately.
 
In your original post, you commented that you wanted to load .357 and .38 Special, with 125 grain Campro bullets. Selecting: ".357" for your search criteria was too general. So, the Hodgdon Reloading's program would direct you to the data that most closely matched your query. In this case, to load data for .357 magnum, only. Both cartridges may use a common diameter bullet, but thats where the similarity ends. One set of .357 data is for a lead bullet. The other, jacketed. The C.O.L's of 1.580" to 1.590" indicate .357 magnum C.O.L.

In order to get specific data for either .38 Special or .357 Magnum, it is better to select the cartridge first, then narrow down your selection by bullet type and weight, powder type and charge, etc. It has been suggested in another post that Campro bullets have a thick enough plating to withstand jacketed bullet pressure and velocity. I have no personal experience with this bullet, so can't offer an opinion. But, most if not all loading sources recommend using the data for lead bullets only, when loading plated bullets. Hope this helps.
 
Plating is plating regardless of its thickness, plating is not a jacket. Use the cast bullet data.
Less mucking around if you load .357 cases to .38 velocities. Best to use a different bullet in one or the other to tell 'em apart. Or a different brand of brass.
 
I was thinking the same bullet for both , just to have less components, but I guess I could get the 148 for 38 special and 125 for .357.
 
Do you have a supply of both Titegroup and 700X? If so, try some test loads in both .357 Mag. and .38 Special with your plated bullets, using both powders, and see which one offers the best accuracy in your 686. If neither powder is a clear winner, use them up as you wish. Though neither of these two powders would be considered an ideal choice for .357 Magnum...both will work. Either will work just fine in .38 Special, though. If you are limited to just these two powders, I wouldn't sweat it. Load. Shoot. Enjoy.
 
Alex McK said:
Do you have a supply of both Titegroup and 700X? If so, try some test loads in both .357 Mag. and .38 Special with your plated bullets, using both powders, and see which one offers the best accuracy in your 686. If neither powder is a clear winner, use them up as you wish. Though neither of these two powders would be considered an ideal choice for .357 Magnum...both will work. Either will work just fine in .38 Special, though. If you are limited to just these two powders, I wouldn't sweat it. Load. Shoot. Enjoy.
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It's all I could find , but I haven't bought either yet. I have a few lbs of CFE pistol on hand but I want that for my 9 mm. As I won't have the gun until tomorrow and the dies until next wk, I'll keep looking for a more suitable magnum powder. I'll get some tight group and keep it for the 38 .
 
Makes better sense to stick with one common bullet weight. I shoot the same 125 grain LRNFP in .357 and .38 Special. Using the same powder, only different charge weights, in each. In this case, 231/HP38. I have used Titegroup in both cartridges though, with good results. I wouldn't consider Titegroup to be the best powder for the 125 grain bullet and .357, but it does shoot well. Same thing for 700X. Your gun will soon tell you what powder charge it likes. In .38 Special, I have always found Titegroup offers excellent accuracy.
 
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