Schuetzen on Mauser Action -- Help Needed ☺

jpc

jpc

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SUNNY SOUTHERN ONTARIO
Action Mauser M71 single shot
Weight 19 pounds (on the bathroom scale)
Bore 16mm
Barrel length 32 inches
Across the flats 1 3/8 inches

No makers name
All numbers match including stock.

I have not been able to find out much about this rifle or other big bore Schuetzen rifles.

Any information and help with this mystery is appreciated

Thanks and take care

jpc



Mauser%2071-84%20012.jpg
:)
 
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Do you have the tang mounted peep sight? it would fit into the square in the stock, they would remove them for transport so they wouldn't get damage. Also as a side note if it is a single shot it would be a M71 not M71/84 (which would be the one with the tubular magazine) just a little semantics for you.

It certainly is very pretty and would definitely be fun to try to get up and running again.
 
Eaglelord17 said:
Do you have the tang mounted peep sight? it would fit into the square in the stock, they would remove them for transport so they wouldn't get damage. Also as a side note if it is a single shot it would be a M71 not M71/84 (which would be the one with the tubular magazine) just a little semantics for you.

It certainly is very pretty and would definitely be fun to try to get up and running again.
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M71--thank you and appreciate the correction. The set screw was loose when I got the rifle and am afraid the peep sight is long gone :(
Still researching the calibre but having very little luck

take care

jpc
 
IIRC these were made for a shooting competition which involved shooting a timber in half. Large calibre rifles would have an advatage.
 
The only reference that I was able to find for something close is the 16x90R French rifle, aka 16.15mm French rifle. The cartridge used a paper-patched bullet and the case featured a Mauser 71 style bevelled base.

Now why was a French cartridge built on a Prussian Mauser 1871? Unknown, except perhaps that was the best (or only) suitable platform available; the gunsmith was from Alsace-Lorraine; the cartridge was named for the designer / gunsmith whose surname was French rather than named after the country, or who knows.
 
jpc - My only suggestion is post the pic. etc. on the German Gun Collectors Form, some very knowledgeable folks there. --- John
 
jamesharrison said:
The only reference that I was able to find for something close is the 16x90R French rifle, aka 16.15mm French rifle. The cartridge used a paper-patched bullet and the case featured a Mauser 71 style bevelled base.

Now why was a French cartridge built on a Prussian Mauser 1871? Unknown, except perhaps that was the best (or only) suitable platform available; the gunsmith was from Alsace-Lorraine; the cartridge was named for the designer / gunsmith whose surname was French rather than named after the country, or who knows.
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Great information and gives me something to go on now.

Thanks jamesharrison

and take care

jpc
 
There were a number of German rifle cartridges based on shortened brass shot gun shells.
The two most likely listed in the DWM catalogue of 1904 are DWM #68.40.4mm cl and DWM#189 33.4mm cl based on 24 guage brass shell. They are listed as "Kugelpatronen" ball cartridge.
In an article in "International Arms Review No1" similar cartridges shown loaded with a RN bullet intended for rifles are shown.
 
jamesharrison said:
The only reference that I was able to find for something close is the 16x90R French rifle, aka 16.15mm French rifle. The cartridge used a paper-patched bullet and the case featured a Mauser 71 style bevelled base.

Now why was a French cartridge built on a Prussian Mauser 1871? Unknown, except perhaps that was the best (or only) suitable platform available; the gunsmith was from Alsace-Lorraine; the cartridge was named for the designer / gunsmith whose surname was French rather than named after the country, or who knows.
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In 1871 Alsace-Lorraine was part of the German Empire. The area is still an enclave of ethnic Germans.
 
After meeting jpc and a coffee I am the proud owner of this 19 pound gun, this is what I found out from the German gun collectors

It is called a Vogelbuechse (bird rifle) and is used in a Vogelschiessen (bird shooting) event at a Schuetzenfest where it is used to batter to pieces a large wooden target of a bird at the top of a tall pole. The original shells were 40mm long . If you are lucky, you can use brass 20 gauge shells. The original bullets were called 'cat's heads' and were a short round-headed bullet. You will likely have to have a mould made if you ever want to shoot it.
Most of these were made in Zella-Mehlis. During WWI some were put into service for shooting incendiary rounds at dirigibles and balloons.

I need to do a chamber cast to get the shell size for sure but at least a good starting point, and here is another odd thing I have a pair of French double rifles chamber for a 20 gauge 40mm cases

Thanks jpc and it was a pleasure meeting you
 
what is it?????

Well I spoke to a fellow single shot shooter who spends a lot of time in Germany an working on German and European guns here in North America.
He sent me this:
[It's a VOGELBÜCHSE. Sometimes a club rifle mounted on a pedestal. You pay your money and take your shot at the eagle. Still at least one club in Germany doing it. They use a huge tower on a hinge. At the top of the tower the wooden eagle sits under a large steel shield.
Anyway as said before is always a very large caliber an possibly a paper cartridge or part paper Im told.
A great conversation piece for sure, would be great if you could find the rear sight an get at least on cartridge made for show.
Here is a sight which will tell you every thing about the gun and shooting fest which it is used. One problem is you need to read German or find a friend who can but the pics are interesting....
http://www.sebastianus-stammheim.de/ueberuns/historisch.html
Have fun.... Im told you can use Google gold to translate.....
sst







;
 
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