Starter shotgun?

Pete G said:
I believe canvasback intended to write "smaller weights of shot" (one ounce or less) rather than smaller weights of powder(one ounce or less).
By the way powder charges are usually expressed as "dram equivalent"........the higher the dram equivalent, the greater the velocity and normally, the greater the recoil......To start, try to stay away from 3 dram loads....look for say 2 3/4 dram loads.
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Thanks Pete, you are correct. Brain fart!
 
amolkapoor said:
Thanks Canvasback, what do you think of the 12ga or 20ga Maverick 88 Security as an affordable starter to experiment with?
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amolkapoor, I will respond to a few posts here, not just the one I quoted. So first, yes, there are differing factions of shotgun owners, and in a gross oversimplification they can be divided into the hunting/sporting area that values blued steel and walnut with longer barrel lengths and the black and green group that values options for modifications and shorter barrels. No doubt someone will object to that simple definition. LOL

I belong to the subset of the hunting/sporting where my primary interest is in SxS from before WWII. Although I also have a soft spot for classic pumps. (M12. M37, M31). From the modern era IMHO, one can't go wrong with a 870 Wingmaster and in fact I own one. I would not own an Express. But that's just me and I don't believe in criticizing anyone else's desires when it comes to guns.

Another comment I would make is that I would never buy a "budget" shotgun. If my dollars are limited, then I'm buying used. But I'm always aiming to buy the best quality gun I can afford that has the features I am looking for. Given my experience shooting 100 year old plus guns, I have concluded that they can have a pretty long effective life span.....longer than I've got left....so no need for new.

So my answer to your specific question, given all you've said and where I am coming from, is that I wouldn't touch the Maverick you asked about. But again, that's just me.

You began the thread by asking about recoil. That has been well answered by many here. What you need to do, given your lack of experience, is sift through a ton of threads on this site, thinking about THE SHOOTING YOU ARE ACTUALLY ATTRACTED TO DOING. Is it hunting, clays, tacticool, some kind of mix, whatever, and then use that understanding to home on the style of gun that would be best suited for your uses and that you will be happy to own. But be prepared for your desires to change as you become more experienced. Don't buy a small safe! LOL
 
Jim870 said:
Mid bead is far from a requirement in fact it is not even a consideration when I choose a shotgun. Wingmaster is a very good choice. It is more than just a step up in cost compared to an Express or Mossberg, but many new comers aren't eager to drop that much coin for a pump. Not that an Express or Mossberg won't give years of yoemans service, I'll always have at least one beater express as a loaner or extreme conditions gun.
Auto's are a benefit for the clays games, but are not a requirement. Talking new guns only here a high quality pump will cost less then a similar quality semi.
For hunting to me pump or semi does not matter, and clays aren't much different, provided a gun fits me well I can miss doubles almost as fast with either. The only times I see or focus on the bead is shooting stationary or slow moving targets, such as a turkey or finishing off crippled waterfowl.

Amolkapoor, I very much doubt anyone is actually upset. Just disappointed to give you all this advice trying to steer you towards a practical field gun. Yes, the short barreled security options look fun but a short barrel and fixed cylinder choke is not very versatile. A longer barrel is easier to swing smoothly an often forgotten aspect of shooting effectively at moving targets. A field gun will also shoot buckshot and rifled slugs if needed.
The maverick shotgun itself is not a bad choice either. I'm not sure if it is still available there used to be one with both a field barrel and security barrel. That may satisfy your urge to have a short cool looking gun and a field gun. I have owned both and have since parted with all but 1 of my short barreled shotguns. I kept the rifle sighted slug barrel because it does have a benefit.
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Thanks Jim! :)
I believe it does have a version with two barrels, in was on either Cabelas or Alflaherty's earlier but not sure if they still have it. I believe their Mossberg 500 model has a version like that too, they show a package with a 26" and a 28" barrel.

Okay so I understand a longer barrel is better for shooting moving targets, does that apply to straight target shooting as well?
I think I understand the choke part a bit, in the sense that it sort of controls the spread of the shot, varying decreasingly(if that's a word) from cylinder to modified to fixed(tried to get some sense by reading my CFSC book again,lol!) and that a rifled barrel is going to be better for slugs, and work slightly similar to how a rifle does.
 
canvasback said:
amolkapoor, I will respond to a few posts here, not just the one I quoted. So first, yes, there are differing factions of shotgun owners, and in a gross oversimplification they can be divided into the hunting/sporting area that values blued steel and walnut with longer barrel lengths and the black and green group that values options for modifications and shorter barrels. No doubt someone will object to that simple definition. LOL

I belong to the subset of the hunting/sporting where my primary interest is in SxS from before WWII. Although I also have a soft spot for classic pumps. (M12. M37, M31). From the modern era IMHO, one can't go wrong with a 870 Wingmaster and in fact I own one. I would not own an Express. But that's just me and I don't believe in criticizing anyone else's desires when it comes to guns.

Another comment I would make is that I would never buy a "budget" shotgun. If my dollars are limited, then I'm buying used. But I'm always aiming to buy the best quality gun I can afford that has the features I am looking for. Given my experience shooting 100 year old plus guns, I have concluded that they can have a pretty long effective life span.....longer than I've got left....so no need for new.

So my answer to your specific question, given all you've said and where I am coming from, is that I wouldn't touch the Maverick you asked about. But again, that's just me.

You began the thread by asking about recoil. That has been well answered by many here. What you need to do, given your lack of experience, is sift through a ton of threads on this site, thinking about THE SHOOTING YOU ARE ACTUALLY ATTRACTED TO DOING. Is it hunting, clays, tacticool, some kind of mix, whatever, and then use that understanding to home on the style of gun that would be best suited for your uses and that you will be happy to own. But be prepared for your desires to change as you become more experienced. Don't buy a small safe! LOL
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Thanks Canvasback. I know it took people time to write responses, and do appreciate it. There's just so much out there and so many brands and designs and options of firearms, before you even get to ammo! I'm glad there's some good and helpful people here :)

I'm not excited by the prospect of hunting or club competitions, shooting feels like a relaxing activity to me that needs complete focus and clears your brain of noise. I could be soft headed, but that's just my honest perspective. So I'm looking accordingly, I like dark wood but polymer offers sturdyness and seeming lightness(could be wrong) so leaning that way. Any opinion on the Mossberg 500 that comes with 2 barrels? I understand it comes in both 12 and 20gauge, and some people highly recommend it. Works with my budget too, not sure if I should spend a lot as it is my first year in shooting.
Found a link for the 20ga, comes with 3 choke tubes(fixed, improved and modified): http://www.cabelas.ca/product/3966/mossberg-500-field-20-gauge-pump-shotgun
 
I haven't read the whole discussion and since we don't have pennies anymore, I'll add my nickle ...

There is an old saying ... Jack of all trades master of none. The same applies here. One gun won't do it all. Just like golf clubs, a putter doesn't work very well off the tee and a driver doesn't work well on the green. So, if your main shotgun activity (90% +) is going to be trap shooting, then you should buy a trap gun. You can shoot skeet or sporting with a trap gun, but you won't be as proficient as you would be with the appropriate gun. A clay target gun is heavy, which helps absorb recoil, but gets a lot heavier when you are carrying it all day in the field. So, if you are mainly shooting clay targets and are going hunting once or twice a year, buy a clay gun. If you are going to mainly hunt, buy a hunting gun for the main hunting activity that you are going to do. You can shoot the occasional round of clays with it. In the long run, you will end up owning multiple shotguns, if you want to do lots of varying shotgun activities.

Shoot as many different shotguns that you can and a few will just feel a whole lot better than most.

Look for a good condition used shotgun. They can usually be resold for what you paid for it, if you keep it in good condition and buy it at the right price.

A brief description of chokes ... the tighter the choke, the further the effective pattern is from the muzzle. All choke tubes are not created equal (some are junk).

Shells ... more weight = more recoil and more velocity = more recoil. So, if you put 1 oz. of shot out of the end of the barrel at 1200 fps it will recoil the same (or nearly the same) out of any gauge shotgun.

Above all, the main thing to consider when picking a shotgun is how well it fits you. A well fitting shotgun will be much more pleasant to shoot and you will also shoot it more consistently.
 
I'm not excited by the prospect of hunting or club competitions, shooting feels like a relaxing activity to me that needs complete focus and clears your brain of noise. I could be soft headed, but that's just my honest perspective. So I'm looking accordingly, I like dark wood but polymer offers sturdyness and seeming lightness(could be wrong) so leaning that way. Any opinion on the Mossberg 500 that comes with 2 barrels? I understand it comes in both 12 and 20gauge, and some people highly recommend it. Works with my budget too, not sure if I should spend a lot as it is my first year in shooting.
Found a link for the 20ga, comes with 3 choke tubes(fixed, improved and modified):

The 500 combo in either gauge would be a good starting point both in quality and price . it will allow you to get your feet wet in all the shotgun disciplines . and gain knowledge in what interest you be it the clay sports or tactical shooting . as all here will attest if you come to like shot gunning this will not be your only shotgun . good luck be safe and above all have fun .
 
I had to use a sxs when I was loosing my eyesight it worked fine with the short Outlaw I know the spike is really small Haida Gwaii deer haahaa thank god for eye surgery i'm good now
 
davesaudio said:
Even if the O.P. has been seduced by the dark-side this thread has been most helpful to the rest of us Padawan learners. :)

So the value of a mid-bead is overstated?
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I've always put a white bead on the middle of my shotgun barrel, with a brass bead at the end...started that after just missing a couple of long long full choke shots when I was younger...for me, anyway, when I line them up on a distant bird, that bird goes down!
 
Amol, both the Remington 870 and the Mossberg 500 are used by the military, and proven and tested reliable. A pump shotgun is a solid reliable gun, (you operate the action, so it's just stiffer when it's dirty instead of failing), and the extra weight over many semis makes the felt recoil seem less. If you go with a pump then I'd definitely get a 12 gauge and choose light 2 3/4" "dove loads" in 7.5 shot, low dram equivalent, to start. My 11 year old son can shoot those shells with no issues. The advantage of the 12 gauge is that ammo can be found everywhere, it's cheaper than 20 gauge, and you can go from the dove loads that recoil almost as softly as the same loads in 20 gauge, all the way to 3" magnum goose and turkey loads. They even make 12 gauge shotguns now that can accept 3 1/2" shells, heavy magnum loads for shooting passing geese out of the sky...the recoil is a bit stiff though. So yeah, if you go with the ol' reliable pump, with some weight to it, you should definitely opt for it in 12 gauge.
 
nothing wrong with a cheap single shoot or sxs it may not be cool but they are fun and a great place to start soon you wont notice the recoil
 
In your case its the ammo which was hurting more then the gun itself.

ANY target load will reduce recoil substantially. Remington, Winchester, Federal etc they all make target loads. Buck shot is on the heavy side of things.

As for recoil 20g is lighter (generally), but again ammo plays a part. A 20g loaded with a slug or heavy duck load will have more felt recoil then a 12g loaded with a light target load.
 
amolkapoor said:
Okay so I was finally able to get some shotgun activity last weekend, shot tactical at some stationary steel targets with both pump and semi, as well as trap and skeet with pump. All 12ga, #7.5 target loads, shot 30 rounds overall, not so sore and had a great time!
My licence also showed issued as of last friday, so hopefully will get it by this Friday and go shopping! I like both kinds of shooting, so considering this one: http://www.cabelas.ca/product/3964/mossberg-500-combo-3-12-gauge-pump-shotgun
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Did you actually shoot trap & skeet, or just some clay targets? A round of either trap or skeet consists of 25 shots.
 
LeBarons has the 870 trio back in stock after a couple years. It's an excellent deal and will get you hunting everything.
Includes:
a 23" rifled cantilever slug barrel
a 28" vent rib barrel great for wing shooting
a 20" turkey barrel
Modified and full chokes
& 870 12ga shotgun
Spend an extra 50 bucks and get the Remington shurshot stock for it and it becomes the sweetest little rig for deer and turkey hunting. Not so great for wing shooting though. It comes with the Remington "Supercell" recoil pad that tames 3" Turkey loads very well.
http://www.lebaron.ca/pdffiles/web_spec/rem_870expresstrio_web.pdf
rem_870expresstrio_web.pdf

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I love that being an express its meant to be abused and throwing it in the bottom of an aluminum boat doesn't make my eyes rain.
 
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*edited* - removed. Note to self, don't post cranky on the forums when you got woken up too early and had to put in 6 hours on a national holiday.
 
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