Tavor Vs ACR. Which one would you keep?
- Thread starter driller212
- Start date
THE_SASQUATCH
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- The Forest
Owned both. Tavor personally
Again, intended use
Again, intended use
Tavor. It has calibre conversion kits that actually exist. Gen 2.5 trigger is good enough that I see no need to replace it. Super compact even with the 18.5" barrel. It's about as short as a colt commando, while getting pretty close to peak 5.56 ballistic performance.
I was not terribly impressed with the ACRs I've shot. Needlessly heavy. So what if it's a gun that shoots 0.8 MOA off of a sandbag from a bench? I bet it shoots 2-3 MOA from the kneeling, just like the Tavor.
I was not terribly impressed with the ACRs I've shot. Needlessly heavy. So what if it's a gun that shoots 0.8 MOA off of a sandbag from a bench? I bet it shoots 2-3 MOA from the kneeling, just like the Tavor.
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
Problem with this mentality is if a 1 moa gun is used by a shooter who is only cabable of 2-3 moa kneeling, is sure that 2-3 moa is manageable, but... take 2-3 moa gun and stick it in the hands of a shooter that is capable of 2-3 moa kneeling and now you have a system producing 4-9 moa. The more accurate the gun is, the better accuraccy potential you will have. If accuracy of the gun is bad, you are more likely to accentuate the problem then make up for the guns short comings.
Lol, you act like the entire Israel army carries a Tavor, almost the entire army is issued an M4 and only a couple select groups are given a Tavor.
So you've abused an ACR to the point of failure? You've actually broken one? Even if you have anyone can break anything, there is a big difference between hard use and abuse, if you're just abusing them till it breaks you're an idiot. I could render a Tavor unusable is seconds but that reflects nothing on the rifle and everything on me.
When SHTF the only choice will be an AR. If you think the current classification of a firearm will mean anything to anyone in such a situation you're delusional. I love my ACR but if the world falls into chaos the first rifle I grab is going to be an AR then I'm going to the garage to start drilling rivets from magazines. Nothing is as reliable or accurate as a quality AR.
Every firearm you buy is a gamble, the government and the RCMP don't want us to have guns and as soon as a party with enough balls gets into power we'll see them start taking our rifles and pistols. We need to recruit new people into the firearm community if we want to have a chance of keeping any of them. The bigger the group the more people they piss off and the louder the outcry. Every member of this forum should be a member of NFA and/or CSSA and encourage everyone you know to join. #####ing on this site will change nothing, we need groups fighting for us in court.
Truer words were never spoken.
All the guys that sit at a bench with their black rifle on a sandbag.....wrong tool for the job. These rifles were made for positional shooting. Shooting a fig 11 or IPSC torso out to 400 yards offhand (yes standing) is where its at with this class of rifle, and 2-3 moa is sufficient to do this.
Flame suit on, bring on the hate
For me the black rifles off the bench is for testing different ammo and load development, once I figure out which ammo shoots best I like to shoot standing, kneeling and prone knowing it's me missing and not the rifle/ammo combination.
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onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
Your actually wrong with this point. Only the reserves/military in public eye use M4s anymore, anyone actually in combat uses Tavors or x95s. Because of this, the media largly shows M4s instead of Tavors even though Tavors make up I believe something like 3/4 of IDF issued carbines now, and that number is increasing.
Hmmm, that's different from what I have heard in the past. Good to know.
I was under the impression it was only their elite groups that had them and the majority were hauling M4's.
9mm is available. Smith isn't required. Have to bring the kit up from the states.
what tools and knowledge is required to swap calibers on the tavor? I personally am not interested in a 9mm, would like to see some big bore calibers available for hunting before I give the platform another try.
Very cool. I was just about to ask why the tavor never seems to be in pictures of the IDF. Even the recent one's, it's always the m4, and once in awhile maybe a tavor in the background.
Made me think, if the tavor was so great, then why aren't THEY even using it? Maybe cost was an issue?
Hard to imagine soldiers not being given all the 'top of the line' equipment they need, before they need it, eh? eh?
Made me think, if the tavor was so great, then why aren't THEY even using it? Maybe cost was an issue?
Hard to imagine soldiers not being given all the 'top of the line' equipment they need, before they need it, eh? eh?
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
9mm and 5.56 are all that is available for factory Tavor options, going between those 2 would not be what I call a quick change option.
.300BLK is now available from Herron Arms as well, that being only a barrel change and not changing the status to restricted has my attention. Should only take a guy 2 minutes to swap barrels, a screw driver will be needed for the lower foregrip and also of course a barrel wrench.
Davy Crockett
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley
I have yet to receive my ACR but but after spending some time on ACR forum it looks like the platform has a ton of potential, is solid and reliable and there is a growing enthusiast driven aftermarket. I think the only question mark on the ACR is will Rem/Bushmaster sewer the gun? Had they rolled out this rifle differently I think opinions here would be different. The Rem Defense version certainly looks very nice.
I haven't shot a Tavor so I have no opinion on it.
As for Israeli military use, I'm not so sure that means anything. We've all seen military procurement processes that equip troops with garbage gear. Not saying the Tavor is but military use may not really be an endorsement. Look at the Famas and SA80, lots of them in the hands of frontline troops but they are notorious junk.
As an aside, a quick Google image search of Israeli special forces shows almost no Tavors and a whole lot of M4's. Not sure this means anything but the Tavor doesn't look like it is the weapon of choice yet among those who likely have a choice.
I haven't shot a Tavor so I have no opinion on it.
As for Israeli military use, I'm not so sure that means anything. We've all seen military procurement processes that equip troops with garbage gear. Not saying the Tavor is but military use may not really be an endorsement. Look at the Famas and SA80, lots of them in the hands of frontline troops but they are notorious junk.
As an aside, a quick Google image search of Israeli special forces shows almost no Tavors and a whole lot of M4's. Not sure this means anything but the Tavor doesn't look like it is the weapon of choice yet among those who likely have a choice.
It's still something I cant figure out about the Tavor. If it is that awesome, then why isn't it everywhere by now?
I think if AR's were NR, you would never have heard of the tavor. Then again, that is a pretty big 'if.'
I think if AR's were NR, you would never have heard of the tavor. Then again, that is a pretty big 'if.'
- Location
- North of 60
They have all the AR's they can have in the US... And still the Tavor is selling like hotcakes
There's 9mm available and MAYBE 5.45 coming. You can change it yourself, but you must disassemble the rifle.
The ACR has a quick change barrel in theory, but not in practice. Rebarrelling ACRs typically mean scavenging the gas block/quick change components from the 16" barrel. So you have to choose. I haven't seen different barrel lengths or calibres available anywhere really, and with bushmaster increasingly looking like they're going to scrap the line entirely, I wouldn't hold my breath for any either.
This is a fine looking numbers game, but not what I experience in practice. I have a rifle that shoots 1.5 MOA and my Tavor that shoots 2-3 MOA in prone unsupported. Kneeling and standing, they shoot identical groups. There's a point where the rifle can shoot better than you can, and at that point, it doesn't seem to matter anymore.
