SAM Commander Tactical...issues?

Chuckbuster

Chuckbuster

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Didn't want to derail,the current thread regarding SAM Commanders, so I decided to start this one...

I had my new Commander Tactical out today and ran into some problems. The inherent accuracy seems quite good, but I had numerous failures to feed. The gun seems much more finicky than my Norks or Taurus 1911...they have eaten everything except for one odd and squat little semi wad cutter bullet. Anyhow, the only thing it would reliably feed were FMJ reloads and commercial reloads with a LRN of the same profile as the ball load. Other bullet types including a LRN with a profile more like a 9mm projectile got stuck on the feed ramp, jammed into the chamber, got hung up and would cause the slide to not go into battery when they did chamber and fire.

I'm not terribly concerned at this point as it went through it's first hundred or so rounds this afternoon, and, I noticed the reliability beginning to improve towards the end of the afternoon (I had a few other things that I was shooting as well). It's just the first time I've had this happen, as the other guns have always functioned 100% reliably from the get go. I'm guessing that maybe tighter tolerances are at play and the gun needs to be worked in a bit. And the other, lesser issue was the thread protector...I had to re-tighten it after every magazine. Is there a way to keep it tight without using some type of super adhesive, or have others just not worried about...?
 
I would start by up grading the recoil spring. Commanders are a little fussy in that respect. I have an 18.5 in mine. I've read reports of too soft springs in those guns.

The other common issue is with magazines. Because the cycle is shorter in commanders, timing is critical and you might get better results from other mags or heavier magazine springs.

As the gun breaks in, things will change and micro seconds count. I don't think that pistol is tight but breakin will make the cycle a tiny bit quicker.

Lubrication can be an issue in a new gun too. Many will tell you to run the gun wet.

I'm going to predict that your issues will get resolved. Try changes that don't cost much and are reversible like a recoil spring you can count on to be to spec. You can get a selection of Wolfe springs to try but 18 or 18.5 is what a lot of "experts" recommend.

You can try Blue Loctite on the threads to see if it handles the heat. Red will require heat to remove it. I don't have a threaded barrel but I might try a turn or two of pipe tape.

Gord
 
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I've been holding off shooting a Tac Commander I recently bought from the EE as I've been waiting for some official word about SAM's quality control.
The previous owner reported no functional problems and good accuracy but the disappointing thing for me was discovering that the dimensions of the rail are out of spec to the point of being useless. Also the right side lever of the ambi thumb safety is bent strangely even though there is no sign of impact. The finish on these guns is not that durable and an impact that would be strong enough to bend the safety the way it is should have left a mark.
The safety is easy to replace but the out of spec rail is not so easy to fix.
 
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Can-down said:
I've been holding off shooting a Tac Commander I recently bought from the EE as I've been waiting for some official word about SAM's quality control.
The previous owner reported no functional problems and good accuracy but the disappointing thing for me was discovering that the dimensions of the rail are out of spec to the point of being useless. Also the right side lever of the ambi thumb safety is bent strangely even though there is no sign of impact. The finish on these guns is not that durable and an impact that would be strong enough to bend the safety the way it is should have left a mark.
The safety is easy to replace but the out of spec rail is not so easy to fix.
Click to expand...

I just replaced the ambi on my Seraphim and while not rocket science , it wasn't quick or easy. I had to enlarge the channel on the strong side quite a bit so it's possible that the frame is a bit thick. I got a better ambi by STI but ended up with a very good but pricey EGW. Go slowly when fitting the safety as one or two too many file strokes can mess it up. Ask me how I know. Also, don't try bending MIM parts as that was how I broke the stock one on my gun. MIM and cast don't like to be bent.
 
ive got both the tactical and the thunderbolt, im just sitting here trying to think what i could put on them to test out the rail as i dont run flashlights.
oh wait, ive had a light on my tactical before and it worked just fine now that i think about it.
 
I was wondering about the magazine as well. A friend with a full size SAM 1911, mentioned that he found some after market magazines to function better in his pistol than did the magazine it came with. I did clean the gun and lubricate with Gun Grease. Maybe I'll throw some more on. I'll lube'er up some more, try a couple of different mags and see if things settle in over the next few weeks. And, I guess it's Loc-Tite for the thread protector.
 
I've only used FMJ's on my SAM Tactical Commander. So far I've put in about 200 rounds through it. No FTF at all.

When I received the pistol from Wolverine last Nov, I did a basic field strip and cleaned all the factory grease out. I use MPro 7 oil on the rails.

I'm still using a stock spring.

One mod that I did was that I installed an Ed Brown Maxiwell. The mainspring housing was a bit tight to put on the SAM frame. A little bit of oil let it ease in but still a bit tight for my experience.

Also using a 47d Wilson Combat Low Profile mags + the stock mag that came with the SAM - both great mags BTW.
 
Chuckbuster said:
I was wondering about the magazine as well. A friend with a full size SAM 1911, mentioned that he found some after market magazines to function better in his pistol than did the magazine it came with. I did clean the gun and lubricate with Gun Grease. Maybe I'll throw some more on. I'll lube'er up some more, try a couple of different mags and see if things settle in over the next few weeks. And, I guess it's Loc-Tite for the thread protector.
Click to expand...

On a new gun, I would try oil in lieu of grease as the latter could slow down the slide particularly if heavily applied. Try a generous of amount of oil any kind and replace it frequently for a while.

Another solution to those pesky caps is to take a punch and deform the last thread on the barrel very slightly. Maybe the second to last thread might be better but one tiny bend in a thread should help.

Who made the mag you got? The .45's ship with Act-Mags and I have plenty of those that have worked well for years. The recoil spring is more critical with a 9mm as is any slowing down of the slide. I have a 9mm with the stock slide I haven't shot yet buy I will likely upgrade with a 10# wolfe or heavier if I have issues.
 
hercster said:
On a new gun, I would try oil in lieu of grease as the latter could slow down the slide particularly if heavily applied. Try a generous of amount of oil any kind and replace it frequently for a while.

Another solution to those pesky caps is to take a punch and deform the last thread on the barrel very slightly. Maybe the second to last thread might be better but one tiny bend in a thread should help.
Click to expand...

Ah, of course...good point about the oil in place of grease. The slide was quite...tardy at some points this afternoon; no need to slow it down even further!

I hadn't thought of the slight thread deformation solution either, but it sounds like a possible solution.
 
Chuckbuster said:
Ah, of course...good point about the oil in place of grease. The slide was quite...tardy at some points this afternoon; no need to slow it down even further!

I hadn't thought of the slight thread deformation solution either, but it sounds like a possible solution.
Click to expand...

If you could feel the slide slowing, you may have found your problem. Your issues are very common with many makes of Commanders including high end guns. When things go wrong, you can often spot them when the brass ejection pattern changes or you get brass marks around the ejection port. On my NightHawk, they made a slight change to the angle on the ejector that solved my problem.
 
hercster said:
If you could feel the slide slowing, you may have found your problem. Your issues are very common with many makes of Commanders including high end guns. When things go wrong, you can often spot them when the brass ejection pattern changes or you get brass marks around the ejection port. On my NightHawk, they made a slight change to the angle on the ejector that solved my problem.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that. This is my first commander, and I was completely unaware of any such quirks and hiccups.
 
hercster said:
I just replaced the ambi on my Seraphim and while not rocket science , it wasn't quick or easy. I had to enlarge the channel on the strong side quite a bit so it's possible that the frame is a bit thick. I got a better ambi by STI but ended up with a very good but pricey EGW. Go slowly when fitting the safety as one or two too many file strokes can mess it up. Ask me how I know. Also, don't try bending MIM parts as that was how I broke the stock one on my gun. MIM and cast don't like to be bent.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice on not trying to straighten it out and fitting the safety. I'll probably go with a left side only safety.
 
Chuckbuster said:
I hadn't thought of the slight thread deformation solution either, but it sounds like a possible solution.
Click to expand...

You could probably degrease the treads and let a bit of blue loctite dry in the thread protector and then screw it on and see if that helps?
I wonder if teflon tape would help?
 
those ambi safety im not liking at all, on any 1911.
which is unfortunate as im a left handed shooter.
but ive had 2 break on me, or better said ive had 2 'fatigue' and fail on me due to me using them and taking them apart and such.

its just that they are only held together by very fine metal teeth and there just isn't enough metal there they bend and eventually break.
when you look at them you can see that its just a normal pin that has a cut down the middle so the ambi safety can marry up to it from the other side and when you cut a small pin down the middle it weakens it.
its unfortunate but its what ive come to expect from any ambi safety so far.
ive all but given up on them and have replaced most if not all of my 1911's that had them with just the plain one sided ones.
 
wayupnorth said:
those ambi safety im not liking at all, on any 1911.
which is unfortunate as im a left handed shooter.
but ive had 2 break on me, or better said ive had 2 'fatigue' and fail on me due to me using them and taking them apart and such.

its just that they are only held together by very fine metal teeth and there just isn't enough metal there they bend and eventually break.
when you look at them you can see that its just a normal pin that has a cut down the middle so the ambi safety can marry up to it from the other side and when you cut a small pin down the middle it weakens it.
its unfortunate but its what ive come to expect from any ambi safety so far.
ive all but given up on them and have replaced most if not all of my 1911's that had them with just the plain one sided ones.
Click to expand...

Interesting to know as I am a southpaw as well.
 
wayupnorth said:
those ambi safety im not liking at all, on any 1911.
which is unfortunate as im a left handed shooter.
but ive had 2 break on me, or better said ive had 2 'fatigue' and fail on me due to me using them and taking them apart and such.

its just that they are only held together by very fine metal teeth and there just isn't enough metal there they bend and eventually break.
when you look at them you can see that its just a normal pin that has a cut down the middle so the ambi safety can marry up to it from the other side and when you cut a small pin down the middle it weakens it.
its unfortunate but its what ive come to expect from any ambi safety so far.
ive all but given up on them and have replaced most if not all of my 1911's that had them with just the plain one sided ones.
Click to expand...

Mr.Wayne,

You might take a look at the EGW ambi. The retention system is much better IMO and the connection is reinforced by a tightly fitting sleeve over the joint. I can't see how it could break as once assembled, there is no wiggle room at all and it's like the shaft was one continuous rod. I have a similar system on my Night Hawk Custom and while not as good as the EGW, its very good. EGW just takes the idea further with that sleeve. Their parts are incredibly precise and a pleasure to work with even if the assembly is a bit demanding the first time. I needed to really think out the assembly sequence. They are also a very nice company to deal with as they are very friendly and helpful with excellent advice and explanations. They will be my go to from now on. They ship here too but have restrictions.
 
Other then cut bushings, I get my EGW stuff from Brownells...
For the feeding issues, SAM pistols come with weakass springs. Should have an 18lb in a .45 commander. Try that out first.
 
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