WWII weapons still finding their way onto the black market in Russia

[JRW (QOR)]

https://www.warhistoryonline.com/war-articles/wwii-weapons-still-finding-their-way-onto-the-black-market-in-russia.html

Eastern front relics, mainly guns are still finding their way onto the black market. Sometimes people find caches of weapons but not all of them are handed into the officials. Thousands of weapon were of course left behind at the end of WWII or the Great Patriotic War as it was known by the Soviets. Many were just stored away and forgotten – there are some serious collectors pieces in here.

Check out this collection of arms that have been handed in into the authorities with many of the being from WWII. This is part of the drive to prevent weapons getting onto the black market

[Lots of pix in the link]

 

[CanadianAR]

https://www.warhistoryonline.com/wa...heir-way-onto-the-black-market-in-russia.html

Just a news story, you can link.

Lots of cool stuff.

 

[jody_v]

Even noticed an American made M1 Carbine in one of the pics. Seems like they got almost everything there.

 

[flying pig]

Looks like a Bren too. They all seem to be in pretty good shape to have been 'forgotten or lost' for 70 years.

 

[VuDu666]

After USSR collapse Ukraine inherited huge number of Land Lease weapons. Thompsons, Enfields etc. Before fighting started last year Ukraine was probably the biggest Eastern European manufacturer of WW2 dewats. There are also "black diggers" who restore WW2 small arms in sell it on a black market.

 

[fraserdw]

Looks like a Bren too. They all seem to be in pretty good shape to have been 'forgotten or lost' for 70 years.

Cz ch version is t it. SS troops on East Front with armed with these in the early war as the army owned the Mg34/42 production.

 

[Horilka]

Those are not live weapon but dewats, and I suspect I know whose collection it is. I need to check but it looks very similar to the biggest private collection in Ukraine that was stolen from Donetsk museum by Russian "liberators". Collection was packed and ready to be evacuated but then came terrorists and voila it is in Russia. Strictly speaking most of Ukrainian dewats are very non-intrusive (just the holes or long under cut in the barrel and bolt face cut) and all part are movings so they are considered live firearms in Russia. Maybe that's why article says about black market.

As for stashes from WW2 - private stashes are minimal, there was pretty harsh punishment for storing live firearm in USSR and doing the time in soviet jail was pretty harsh too. "Black diggers" indeed sometimes find very interesting stuff but it's rarely in restorable condition. There are some exceptions of course but we are talking small numbers. State armouries of Ukraine on another side sold most valuable things in 1990x to Germany mostly, followed by less valuable refurbs to all around the Europe and NA.

P.S. I see a Bren, not Czech ZB26/30 on pictures.

 

[gaff]

Those are not live weapon but dewats, and I suspect I know whose collection it is. I need to check but it looks very similar to the biggest private collection in Ukraine that was stolen from Donetsk museum by Russian "liberators". Collection was packed and ready to be evacuated but then came terrorists and voila it is in Russia. Strictly speaking most of Ukrainian dewats are very non-intrusive (just the holes or long under cut in the barrel and bolt face cut) and all part are movings so they are considered live firearms in Russia. Maybe that's why article says about black market.

As for stashes from WW2 - private stashes are minimal, there was pretty harsh punishment for storing live firearm in USSR and doing the time in soviet jail was pretty harsh too. "Black diggers" indeed sometimes find very interesting stuff but it's rarely in restorable condition. There are some exceptions of course but we are talking small numbers. State armouries of Ukraine on another side sold most valuable things in 1990x to Germany mostly, followed by less valuable refurbs to all around the Europe and NA.

P.S. I see a Bren, not Czech ZB26/30 on pictures.

X2 there are thousands of deactivated firearms in Eastern Europe.

 

[flying pig]

Could be a ZB-39 but not a ZB-26 or ZB-30.

 

[Horilka]

Might be, but I see some other items that were typically brouht to Ukraine from UK and Germany. While Ukraine mass deactivated runofthemill refurb stuff, some specimens from UK and Germany were more desirable by collectors as all matching non-messed examples. I had 2 ZB30s (actually still have one converted to fire blanks in full auto) and both were EPed refurbs, good toy for reenactor, but not much value for collector. And I know that all ZB30's there are captured, and all Brens and ZB30j's are relatively recent imports from UK.

 

[Andurp]

Interesting how a lot of those AK's are Chinese.

 

[fat tony]

Raiding museums to confiscate prohibs lol. When will the Canadian leo authorities take a page from the Russian book?

 

[Steve1987]

Those are not live weapon but dewats, and I suspect I know whose collection it is. I need to check but it looks very similar to the biggest private collection in Ukraine that was stolen from Donetsk museum by Russian "liberators". Collection was packed and ready to be evacuated but then came terrorists and voila it is in Russia. Strictly speaking most of Ukrainian dewats are very non-intrusive (just the holes or long under cut in the barrel and bolt face cut) and all part are movings so they are considered live firearms in Russia. Maybe that's why article says about black market

I would be curious to hear more about this. Sounds like strait up theft!

-Steve

 

[charles u farley]

Those are not live weapon but dewats, and I suspect I know whose collection it is.

<snip>

Yup, looks like more of a collection than recovered caches or surrendered arms. Only a couple of duplicates and no where near enough main line infantry rifles from the area. You have to look hard to find a 91/30 or an SVT. All the cutlery seems to me as another sign this was someone's collection. No ammo either.

Good thing they got that linear actuator (orange bin) off the street though.

Empty liquor bottles strewn on the floor...seems legit.

The room looks like a display area with the shelf lighting and unfinished glass? topped cabinets.

I want the doppeltrommel.

 

[zupermann]

There was a "Shotgun News" article(s) about it years ago ?late 90's. People would find stashes and/or concealed dumps of artillery shells, etc., Some mafia/businessman would get blown to pieces in a gang war and the explosive traced back (via chemical analysis) to WW2 Soviet or German. It showed pics of K-98's and pistols retrieved from the permafrost of the more Northern areas of Russia and the metal looked good to VG (wood not so much so). Anyhow, local crooks had the receiver/bbl/trigger cut down and attached to home made wood stocks--whose pics were shown by local cops who confiscated them.

They're still pulling out well preserved tanks out of peat bogs and swamps there. Amazing.

 

[Nabs]

I saw a French 1874 Gras in the article photos and even a Martini Henry.

Heck a second run through I glanced upon a Vetterli-Vitali in 6.5 Carcano, a couple more Carcanos, and some Mannlicher M95s.

Anyone else notice the Swiss Pioneer bayonets ?

 

[223762]

wow a mg34 panzer mantel! would i ever like to do some shopping there.

 

[fat tony]

Another completely retarded photo-op.

 

[Horilka]

I would be curious to hear more about this. Sounds like strait up theft!

-Steve

I checked with my friends and this is not the collection stolen from Donetsk museum. I was wrong. Moreover these pictures are quite old so I guess dewats smuggled from Ukraine to Russia and somebody did not bribe border services or local police good enough.

 

[Mike Webb]

Putin didn't get his cut so they were seized. They don't call modern Russia a "cleptocracy" for nothing.