Over the years, I have been shooting more and more sub gauges, and less 12 gauge, to the point where I rarely shoot 12 gauge anymore. My go to skeet gun is a 28 gauge, and my go to sporting clays gun is a 20 gauge. I am at the point now, where I need to decide if it is even worth my while to own a 12 gauge target gun .Do you shoot the 12 gauge exclusively, or most of the time, or do you shoot the sub gauges more?
12 Gauge or Sub Gauges?
- Thread starter stubblejumper
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the spank
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Being a trap shooter first, skeet shooter second and sporting clays shooter on rare occasions of course a 12 gauge is the gauge for trap especially since I shoot registered trap and though sub gauges are allowed in ATA there are no special sub gauge events or classes like there is in NSSA skeet. If I were going back to registered skeet shooting my choice would be a 20 gauge with a set of 28/410 tubes. A 12 gauge is simply overkill on the skeet field IMO. I really cannot comment much on sporting clays as I have only shot it maybe 20 times in my life but I think if I were to get into it a 20 gauge with a set of 30" barrels would be my first choice.
I bought a single and over/under 410 for the kids. I find I am using it a lot now. I think it is just something different to play around with. Also it is cheaper to shoot than 12 when reloading.
I gather you reload or you would go poor quick with 28 ga. I am still on the fence whether I should have got a 28ga over the 410.
I recently came in to some old Rem hulls and some 12S0 wads, the only think I could load up was 24g gram loads with the powders I had. What an easy shooting load. I normally shoot 1 1/8 oz but I hit just as good using these that use only 75% of the amount of lead that is in the 1 1/8. Try some light weight loads for that 12, not light powder, books says 1300 fps and I think you will like the feel of a completely different gun.
I gather you reload or you would go poor quick with 28 ga. I am still on the fence whether I should have got a 28ga over the 410.
I recently came in to some old Rem hulls and some 12S0 wads, the only think I could load up was 24g gram loads with the powders I had. What an easy shooting load. I normally shoot 1 1/8 oz but I hit just as good using these that use only 75% of the amount of lead that is in the 1 1/8. Try some light weight loads for that 12, not light powder, books says 1300 fps and I think you will like the feel of a completely different gun.
I don't reload yet, I am still looking for a supplier of shot in the area. I am buying my 28gauge target loads for $100 per flat. I bought several flats of Fiocchi game loads at around $130 per flat, which was actually cheaper than the same loads in 12 gauge.
I've owned many subgauge guns but am currently going in the other direction. My last remaining 28 gauge was sold a few months ago and I am down to only one 20 gauge semi-automatic that is a back-up hunting gun and what I use when introducing new shooters to the sport. Everything else is a 12 gauge.
The 28 gauge is great and I wouldn't rule out buying another one some day but I'm not one of those people who can switch guns easily and my scores are better when I stick with one or two guns.
The 28 gauge is great and I wouldn't rule out buying another one some day but I'm not one of those people who can switch guns easily and my scores are better when I stick with one or two guns.
I am constantly shooting different guns at skeet, often two or three guns in one day. I am not shooting competitively, but I still manage to shoot some clean rounds of doubles with the 28 gauge. That being said, I could probably increase my scores a bit if I stuck with one gun, but I shoot for fun, not for the best possible scores.
Beretta687EELL
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95% of my clay targets are trap, so I only shoot 12 gauge.
Unfortunately lead doesn't ship well, at least on your pocket book that is. At the prices today I could reload a flat of 28 ga 3/4 oz for just over $60 (not including hulls).
Make sure to save your hulls for the future
Unfortunately lead doesn't ship well, at least on your pocket book that is. At the prices today I could reload a flat of 28 ga 3/4 oz for just over $60 (not including hulls).
Make sure to save your hulls for the future
I estimate that have around 5000 hulls on hand
Why would you choose anything other than 12 gauge for trap, skeet, or clays. Sub gauge shells are expensive,
and if the guy standing beside is using 12gauge with 1 1/8 ounce loads, he already has an advantage. If recoil
is a problem, get a recoil suppressor.
and if the guy standing beside is using 12gauge with 1 1/8 ounce loads, he already has an advantage. If recoil
is a problem, get a recoil suppressor.
Because I happen to like shooting the sub gauges at skeet and sporting clays. As for the advantage that the 12 gauge has, it doesn't seem to be an issue, as I usually shoot the high scores at skeet at my local club when I shoot any of the sub gauges. I also get more personal satisfaction shooting a clean round of doubles with the 20 or 28 gauge, than I do when shooting clean with the 12 gauge. How many clean rounds of doubles have you shot with a 28 gauge?
I only shoot 12g, but I shoot 99% light re-loads- 3/4, 7/8, sometimes even 1oz, so it is like shooting sub-gauge but without needing to find hulls or own a lot of shotguns. I have a couple flats of 1 1/8 factory 12g shells that just sit there- I never shoot them. Maybe one day I'll have the resources to just buy a lot of shotguns and flats of different calibre ammo. I really did like the couple of times I've been able to shoot a nice 20 or 28g, but for now I just keep it simple. If I was shooting for competition or for some big money I would have a different approach- but I just mess around and like the challenge of lighter loads.
Don't remember the last time I used a 12ga other than trying a new gun to see how it cycled
Even when I was serious with skeet I always got my best scores with the 28ga and now that it is just for fun use it 100%
No problem either for 16yard trap. Take off the skeet barrel and put on the full choke one and grab a box of 7 1/2 reloads and away we go
Use less components to do the same amount of shooting, no recoil and better scores
Also have 1000's and 1000's of the old style AA's in my stash for hulls
IMO anyone can run them with a 12ga and 1 1/8 oz especially 16 yard Trap
Try it with a 28ga and let me know what you think
Cheers
IMO you are either on the target or not and the mind will make you miss way more birds than any small gauge will
The days the targets look like garbage can lids and I am seeing the spin in slow motion I think I could run them with a BB gun
Even when I was serious with skeet I always got my best scores with the 28ga and now that it is just for fun use it 100%
No problem either for 16yard trap. Take off the skeet barrel and put on the full choke one and grab a box of 7 1/2 reloads and away we go
Use less components to do the same amount of shooting, no recoil and better scores
Also have 1000's and 1000's of the old style AA's in my stash for hulls
IMO anyone can run them with a 12ga and 1 1/8 oz especially 16 yard Trap
Try it with a 28ga and let me know what you think
Cheers
IMO you are either on the target or not and the mind will make you miss way more birds than any small gauge will
The days the targets look like garbage can lids and I am seeing the spin in slow motion I think I could run them with a BB gun
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It's a fair point for trap where the 12 gauge is permitted in all matches and the targets are further but in skeet and sporting clays competitions there are different classes for subgauges. There is no disadvantage shooting subgauges when you not shooting against larger bores.
On shorter targets the 12 gauge shooter doesn't have much of an advantage subgauge shooter if any.
the spank
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Tell Todd Bender that sub-gauges are a big disadvantage in skeet!
Even the dimunitive .410 is hardly at a disadvantage on the skeet field. A 1/2 oz load of #8 shot is 205 pellets. More than enough to have a decently filled in pattern at skeet ranges. If you shoot the targets where they should be shot you should not be shooting beyond 21 yards. The biggest disadvantage in sub-gauges is #1 the idea that they are a disadvantage. If you think that you have alter addy cost yourself targets without ever having pulled the trigger and #2 as you mentioned cost. However most sub-gauge shooters who shoot often are reloading and then there is a cost saving considering you use much less powder and shot per shell.
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There is some merit to that statement, but still more variables. More lead in the air generally makes for a better chance to break the bird.
For me (shooting skeet), recoil is a problem. I can shoot full dram 12ga just fine. The problem I encounter is when I shoot subgauges, and I've been dealing with the recoil of the big gun. I found that my scores dip as I'm subconsciously expecting the higher recoil and the anticipation ultimately affects my form and as such my scores.
I've shot 20ga in all of the 12ga events for many years now. I'm convinced that doing so helps with my 28ga and .410 averages.
Undoubtedly I've lost targets with the 20ga that would have been broken with 1.125oz in the 12ga, but I believe that I make up for that in the small gun events. Come shootoff time in the 12ga events, there could be a little thread of doubt when putting less lead out that your competition.
Ya, I wouldn't go quite that far. .410 will break skeet birds no problem, but no where near as effective as the larger gauges.
Brad.
Hardly shoot skeet anymore, let alone competition since IPSC sucked me in, lol. But I stopped shooting 12g last year and switched to running 20g (7/8 oz) with tubes in my O/U.
20g was always my highest average anyway, so it made sense to switch over.
In retrospect, I should have done it years ago. Stopped reloading 12 & 20g and just buy factory Rio 20g now.
Only other guage I shoot is 410, and for that I choose to run a little Mossberg 410 pump with a fixed full choke. Great little training gun (still reload for the 410)
Rob
