i cant figure out these groups.

ALMAR

ALMAR

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So I got the rifle bolted into a new stock from MDT, solid and a good fit.
All screws from scope to stock are torqued to specs with Loctite.
Ammo is handloads that grouped a heck of a lot better than this last time I tried them, although the 168's were having vertical issues but the scope was slipping so I blamed that...still had better groups than this though.

Barrel is clean.

168 smk, 42 gr 4064 br2 primer lapua brass,
168 smk, 39 gr 3031 br2 primer lapua brass
155 barnes match burners 46 varget br2 primer
winchester primers were also used in separate groups of course.

All bullets set to .004 off the lands loaded and resized with Wilson dies.

I could get .32 groups with the 155 BMB bullets with that recipe, but today...total crap...

Just a brainstorm, if you have the time, ideas...the rifle is a savage 10 tr the scope is a weaver super slam 4-20.

the pictures are sideways....

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Is it possible the scope is still slipping? This may be torqued to spec but it can still happen. I talked to a guy at Nightforce and he gave some fancy numbers that a tiny slip at one end can move the POI quite a bit at the other end.

Do you have another scope that you could maybe try with some different rings?

The other suggestions are good too, check and recheck is the normal suggestion.
 
Return the action to the orig stock and redo the test.

IF the groups go back to what you are happy with, consider properly beddding the action in the MDT stock.

Look for what changed and results went south.

Also, you may have tuned for a problem set up that this new set up has 'released"

Either way, if the action/barrel and load shot well before, it can be retuned to shoot well again.

Stocks affect harmonics... your ammo is a reflection of that harmonic

As long as all is properly set up, just redo the loads to suit.

Jerry
 
Some consistency in the 168 smk, 39 gr 3031 load, possibly just need some fine tuning there, but the others I'm not sure... Could be that new stock is changing harmonics enough to require a whole new load work up? I would also check the torque on the action screw and maybe play with that a bit. When my friend dropped his 700 into a Cadex chassis it shot terrible groups, fine tuning the torque on the action screws helped his groups tremendously.
 
What torque spec are you using on the action screws? Is the rear tang floating? I have to machine out material to get my one Savage action to fit, yet another fit fine without.
 
I did increase the torque to 40 and 35 lbs from 35-30...the scope wasn't slipping, checked that after every group, I applied rosin to the rings this time too. The range has some pretty bad and short tables...I struggled just to get positioned correctly, but I felt that every shot was ok although uncomfortable...could that just be it? I have a harris bi pod in front but I tried with bags too.

The rear tang is well seated, just checked.

The rifle always had issues...sometimes it would group great, other times It would just do things like above, even worse...I managed this 4 shot group though using 46 grains of varget and a 155 smk moly coated. So I feel there must be a solution...that lower shot was the first one.
I dont have another scope yet so its still a variable, but it tracks bang on so the POI should not be shifting right?

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1: Could be your harmonics are thrown off
2: Could be the way the action is seated, and as Mystic says, run it back over, and back again, and if you can, bedd it.
 
Unless your fully bedded, I'd be looking to float the rear tang.

Is your recoil lug firmly seated against the chassis?

I'd try going lower on the action screw torque.
 
Shooter ----/ said:
Unless your fully bedded, I'd be looking to float the rear tang.

Is your recoil lug firmly seated against the chassis?

I'd try going lower on the action screw torque.
Click to expand...


Is your recoil lug firmly seated against the chassis? I had this issue it was not MDT"S tolerances but Remingtons loose tolerances may even be out of spec. Solved it by bedding it!
 
Try jumping your bullets .020"-.040" into the land. SMK's are very tolerant and you may find the sweet spot with the load just by seating the bullet deeper into the case. As far as Barnes Match Burners go, I never could get them to shoot out passed 100m. At 300m they would not hold the 4 ring on a DCRA target.
 
All sound advice, & if I read correctly above it worked.
Only thing I'll add is a general suggestion to anyone facing probs like this in the future: treat it like a science experiment. I don't mean nuking your ammo to see how long it takes to go off (that's just for cats), rather; out of all the good suggestions above: make sure you only change one variable at a time between repeated tests/experiments.
You change 3-4 variables at once & you may easily fix the problem, but without ever figuring out exactly which one it was?
Worst-case scenario if you only swap one variable at a time: you have to fire more tests...boo-hoo?
 
Even after you get things straightened out I would suggest playing with that .004 off lands. When you get that close any variations in bullet or seating can lead to some being in contact with lands and some not being in contact which can result in interesting groups.
 
I ordered a new barrel from Jerry and a thicker machined SS lug from PTG will replace this stamped lug so bedding will have to wait obviously. In the meantime, I'll have a look at the rear tang...it makes sense to float it. that scope is not the best either I have to max out the parallax now if I dont want the reticle to move around at 100...didn't use to do that before, but if it was that, how did I manage that tight 4 shot group with it? It still is the next on the list to get replaced and no more f-ing around with cheap glass or cheap rings. Yeah it's probably bedding, shooter or lands though...kind of embarrassing when the older mustache pete guy next to me at the range got one hole 3 shot groups with the lee enfield he built and peep sights.

Why so much vertical though?
 
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