A buddy shot a med sized mule deer with a Ruko 158gr SP out of a 19" barrel Armini revolver carbine at 75 yards.A bang flop with 30" penetration[frontal facing chest shot]....this is better than the 32-20 that's also been working for years.......Harold
357 Magnum as a hunting round (From lever-action rifle)
- Thread starter pqrnapm
- Start date
I'm an advocate of using a 357. You do your bit correctly and don't get crazy with distance the rifle will do the rest. I've shot both deer and bear using both lever gun and a martini. My rifles love 158gr jhp xtp and also a hard cast 170gr with gas check over a healthy dose of blue dot. Again though you must be diligent with your distance but a 357 is more than adequate
The typical argument is usually about the .223/5.56 calibre, with a 50/50 split saying it's enough with good shot placement, and others saying it's still not enough (preferring 308/30-06)
According to ballistics101.com, a 357 mag is getting a muzzle velocity of 1300-1600fps, with ft/lbs energy in the 500-800 range.
.223/5.56 on the other hand is getting 2800-3200fps, with energy ratings of 1000-1500.
Granted it's a bit apples to oranges because a 357 is a larger bullet moving slowly, and a 223 is a smaller bullet moving faster, but the 223 still has twice the energy. Not only that, though, but higher velocities make for a flatter trajectory and a higher probability that you'll hit what you want from greater distances.
Could a 357 kill a deer? Absolutely, and some people will swear that all you need is a 22LR. However, if there are debates about the 223 and whether it's enough, a round that only has half that much energy is what you're asking about.
That said, if you're a fan of handgun calibre levers for hunting, why not step up to a 44mag? I've got a Winchester 1894 trapper in 44mag, and I'd feel much more comfortable shooting a deer with it than with a 357.
According to ballistics101.com, a 357 mag is getting a muzzle velocity of 1300-1600fps, with ft/lbs energy in the 500-800 range.
.223/5.56 on the other hand is getting 2800-3200fps, with energy ratings of 1000-1500.
Granted it's a bit apples to oranges because a 357 is a larger bullet moving slowly, and a 223 is a smaller bullet moving faster, but the 223 still has twice the energy. Not only that, though, but higher velocities make for a flatter trajectory and a higher probability that you'll hit what you want from greater distances.
Could a 357 kill a deer? Absolutely, and some people will swear that all you need is a 22LR. However, if there are debates about the 223 and whether it's enough, a round that only has half that much energy is what you're asking about.
That said, if you're a fan of handgun calibre levers for hunting, why not step up to a 44mag? I've got a Winchester 1894 trapper in 44mag, and I'd feel much more comfortable shooting a deer with it than with a 357.
I think that a hard cast or xtp bullet out of a .357 might be better than a 223. Energy is an impressive statistic, but it doesn't paint the whole picture. Momentum comes into play for penetration on larger game. That said, I chose 44 for a little extra bone penetrating momentum.
The typical argument is usually about the .223/5.56 calibre, with a 50/50 split saying it's enough with good shot placement, and others saying it's still not enough (preferring 308/30-06)
According to ballistics101.com, a 357 mag is getting a muzzle velocity of 1300-1600fps, with ft/lbs energy in the 500-800 range.
.223/5.56 on the other hand is getting 2800-3200fps, with energy ratings of 1000-1500.
Granted it's a bit apples to oranges because a 357 is a larger bullet moving slowly, and a 223 is a smaller bullet moving faster, but the 223 still has twice the energy. Not only that, though, but higher velocities make for a flatter trajectory and a higher probability that you'll hit what you want from greater distances.
Could a 357 kill a deer? Absolutely, and some people will swear that all you need is a 22LR. However, if there are debates about the 223 and whether it's enough, a round that only has half that much energy is what you're asking about.
That said, if you're a fan of handgun calibre levers for hunting, why not step up to a 44mag? I've got a Winchester 1894 trapper in 44mag, and I'd feel much more comfortable shooting a deer with it than with a 357.
Great comment. But there's also 30-30 levers that are extremely popular deer rifles/calibres. Has the op considered that round in a lever?
.357 mag in a lever is a great choice for fun shooting at the range and can be used for deer if you choose your shots well as others have said.
Sounds like you are looking to buy your first rifle and in that regard the .357 is a great choice for practice and fun.
A used 30-30 can be found from between $200-$500 so money is not much of an excuse for only having one rifle. At some point if you keep your eyes open you will see a good deal and while you are waiting for the right deal you will have a chance to save a bit of extra cash. The other nice thing about lever guns is they don't take up much space in the locker......
Another bonus of two rifles is you and your wife can both shoot together.
I'm a big fan of the .357mag. but good 30-30 ammo for deer hunting is easier to find then .357mag. in a lot of places.
Last edited:
Bigfoot 870
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
Exactly.
Last edited:
That antelope went for quite a lengthy run after the shot; if that had taken place in typical central Ontario bush instead of the open prairie where you can watch the animal go down, it would have made for a challenging tracking job for a rookie. If there is little or no blood at the beginning, it could easily be written off as a miss.
If you're an inexperienced hunter, and I suspect the OP is or he wouldn't need to ask the question, you would be better off with something on the heavier end of the scale. Buck fever, terrain (trees!), inexperience, and the willingness to pass on anything but a perfect shot presentation all have to be considered.
Many discussions like this fall into long debates about what is "preferable", "better", "more accurate" etc.
I have similar discussions all the time in a black powder forum that I belong to because I hunt deer with a 38 caliber blackpowder sidelock rifle.
Is it for everyone? Absolutely not. If you are using a marginal caliber then you have to be a very disciplined hunter. With my 38 I CAN'T (and ethically won't) take a quartering shot, or shoot at a deer that is moving, or partly obstructed or further away than 50 yards.
Bambi MUST be standing dead still offering a near perfect, totally unobstructed broadside shot and the wind can't be blowing too hard and I have to become accurate and comfortable enough with my shooting to put the ball through a "boiler room" sized target 10 shots out of 10 - there is pretty much no room for error.
So if you know you don't have the discipline and have to shoot at a deer in order to have a successful hunt, then you should choose a caliber that allows you some "wiggle room".
However, if you are like myself and can sit there and watch a deer a mere 60 yards away, and while disappointed that it doesn't offer a shot, let it wander back into the woods "without" shooting at it, then hunting with a less than "ideal" caliber IS ethical and sufficient.
I recently sold a guy (at work) a 300 Weatherby Magnum that he intended for using while deer hunting only. He has some "wiggle room"
I have similar discussions all the time in a black powder forum that I belong to because I hunt deer with a 38 caliber blackpowder sidelock rifle.
Is it for everyone? Absolutely not. If you are using a marginal caliber then you have to be a very disciplined hunter. With my 38 I CAN'T (and ethically won't) take a quartering shot, or shoot at a deer that is moving, or partly obstructed or further away than 50 yards.
Bambi MUST be standing dead still offering a near perfect, totally unobstructed broadside shot and the wind can't be blowing too hard and I have to become accurate and comfortable enough with my shooting to put the ball through a "boiler room" sized target 10 shots out of 10 - there is pretty much no room for error.
So if you know you don't have the discipline and have to shoot at a deer in order to have a successful hunt, then you should choose a caliber that allows you some "wiggle room".
However, if you are like myself and can sit there and watch a deer a mere 60 yards away, and while disappointed that it doesn't offer a shot, let it wander back into the woods "without" shooting at it, then hunting with a less than "ideal" caliber IS ethical and sufficient.
I recently sold a guy (at work) a 300 Weatherby Magnum that he intended for using while deer hunting only. He has some "wiggle room"
To read many magazine articles over the last thirty or so years it would appear that deerskin has either evolved into a rhino hide toughness or, perhaps, deer have invested in body armor to be worn during hunting season. For many scores of years deer were taken with cartridges that, today, would be considered woefully inadequate - I wonder if old-timey hunters knew the deer they were killing were being shot with projectiles that should have actually bounced off them ?
All humor aside, a .357 magnum cartridge equipped with a suitable bullet and employed out of a lever action rifle is a perfectly adequate round for deer sized creatures out to 150 yards.
All humor aside, a .357 magnum cartridge equipped with a suitable bullet and employed out of a lever action rifle is a perfectly adequate round for deer sized creatures out to 150 yards.
fingers284
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Alberta Cowboy Ranges
After 50 yrs of shooting deer (1 to 4 tags a year), I have a sizable test experience to call on and one thing I can say with confidence is that the size of gun/caliber does not guarantee a bang flop any more than one of the slower offerings.
I've shot deer with muzzle loaders, B/P cartridge, .30 carbine, 30-06, 284 win, 25-06 and a couple of .30 cal magnums...I've had 2 next day recoveries, both shot with 3200 fps bullets. One was shot between the last two ribs with a 300 mag (at about 30 yrds running) and was dead when found, the other was shot an inch bellow the heart with a 25-06, it was still alive when caught up to the next day. I've had a mule doe go 300 yrds with both lungs shot out of her with a .284 and a buddies whitetail go 100ytrds with a 6 mill. thru heart shot .
Of course I've had bang flops with the above guns as well but on the other side of the coin I've had bang flops with 1100 fps muzzleloaders and B/P cartridge and one with a .30 carbine ( the second carbine kill was a 4 jump result). The fact is I've dad far more tracking experience garnered from a wiz-bang cartridge than any of the lower energy bullets
galamb makes some very relevant points about ranges when using a slower bullet. The only real benefit to using a wiz-banger is flatter shooting, which translates into easier accuracy at longer ranges. At 100 yrds or so all are about equal in effectiveness in my book
I have no experience with .357, but there are enough people here suggesting its adequate at 100 yards and there are plenty of Americans online that say they use .357 lever guns on deer (although some areas have smaller deer than other areas). No one needs a .338 for deer, but as others have suggested, there are plenty of budget hunting rifles in larger calibres these days, so most people could afford a second rifle in something more powerful. Plus, maybe after a few years you might want to hunt something larger than deer anyways.
On an aside, I didn't realize how popular the .357 lever guns were .... I saw a used Marlin on sale at a local store and it was sold in less than a day.
On an aside, I didn't realize how popular the .357 lever guns were .... I saw a used Marlin on sale at a local store and it was sold in less than a day.
Wild_Thing
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- In the thick of it!
With the right bullet and at range of >150 that you can comfortably shoot accurately at, the .357 is fine.
I'm just guessing, but it might be something to do with the size of the population or number of hunters .... For example, there are shotgun only areas in B.C. so that a missed shot won't travel too far and endanger someone. A missed shot with a larger caliber rifle would travel much farther.
Shot fired at 3:13
Animal down at 3:41
Sure an antelope will cover a pile of ground in 30 seconds and so will a deer but IMO he was at the max range for a .357 revolver.
Which is way less velocity than what a rifle will be going. And it still was what I would call a clean kill.
I am sure lots of guys have had deer hit better than that go farther.
A 357 is lots of gun for deer, especially in ONT, where there is a VG chance your shot will be closer than 133 yds.
Many discussions like this fall into long debates about what is "preferable", "better", "more accurate" etc.
I have similar discussions all the time in a black powder forum that I belong to because I hunt deer with a 38 caliber blackpowder sidelock rifle.
Is it for everyone? Absolutely not. If you are using a marginal caliber then you have to be a very disciplined hunter. With my 38 I CAN'T (and ethically won't) take a quartering shot, or shoot at a deer that is moving, or partly obstructed or further away than 50 yards.
Bambi MUST be standing dead still offering a near perfect, totally unobstructed broadside shot and the wind can't be blowing too hard and I have to become accurate and comfortable enough with my shooting to put the ball through a "boiler room" sized target 10 shots out of 10 - there is pretty much no room for error.
So if you know you don't have the discipline and have to shoot at a deer in order to have a successful hunt, then you should choose a caliber that allows you some "wiggle room".
However, if you are like myself and can sit there and watch a deer a mere 60 yards away, and while disappointed that it doesn't offer a shot, let it wander back into the woods "without" shooting at it, then hunting with a less than "ideal" caliber IS ethical and sufficient.
I recently sold a guy (at work) a 300 Weatherby Magnum that he intended for using while deer hunting only. He has some "wiggle room"
^^^ I agree with this completely.
