m&p pistols, really that bad?

if pressed the look between the glock and M&P mean nothing to me.
for me it boils down to 2 things.
1 - the M&P feel better to me in the hand
2 - i find the bore axis of the glock to be too low
neither of which are deal breakers, if my work required me to shoot a glock so be it.
as it stands i shoot for pleasure so i buy the M&P because it feels good and shoots good.
ill still keep my glock and shoot it but its not my favorite.

on a related note ive never had a failure of either platform, so reliability for both are excellent.
 
My brother and I bought 9's same day, I bought the M&P 9 and he bought CZ 75 B. In the 2500 rounds put through both guns, a fair bit less problems with the M&P, not saying it was flawless but definitely performed well.
 
Interesting diagrams on the grip angle comparison. My own personal qualitative observation is that the M&P feels more similar to the 1911 than the Glock by a large margin which tells me there are likely more factors at play.

I ended up with the M&P9 as my first handgun. One thing to note about the M&P9 vs Glock argument in Canada is that Glocks tend to cost quiet a bit more here and this was the main deciding factor for me. In the US, I noticed that there isn't much of a price difference between the M&P9 and Glock 17 - something to keep in mind when you read reviews online as most of them originate from the US.
 
My M&P 40 is fantastic !! Everyone who tried it feels the same. All guns will have their issues, some more than others. But when the M&P stands as one of the most popular handguns out there, you have got to know they are doing something right. When it comes to the trigger feel, that comes down to the person more than the gun, because we all see and feel differently from each other. So one person hates this, one says it's ok and the next one loves it, which do you listen to ? Do your research, watch all the vids available, go handle the gun and see how it feels and test the trigger at the gun store, then if you like it enough, buy it and enjoy it. There are parts available to change things up if you so wish, again, very subjective to each person. I have heard the same about my Ruger SR9, some say the trigger is #### and some say it's fantastic ! Is it the best out there, I don't think so, but in my opinion its still nice. Make your own decision, listen , but don't buy because of some one else. I have multiple firearms that people did not like for what ever reason and yet I have no problem with them. Only a custom gun, might be accepted by more people but I am sure some still won't be happy, that's people for you !
 
"Bad" is a relative term. Is it a steaming pile of dung? No. Is it as good as a typical German or Austrian polymer pistol? No. With a few exceptions, semi-autos have never been S&W's strong suit. The Sigma pistols were crap. The 1st - 3rd generation guns that preceded them were mediocre. The only S&W semi-auto I can think of that is known for its excellence is the Model 41 .22 target pistol. Then there's S&W long history of inconsistent quality control, which is a separate topic...
 
Viper26 said:
You've got 2 sites that don't agree on actual grip angles. I can show you more if you like. What's your point?
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The couple of degrees difference makes no difference. People use the grip angle "issue" as an excuse for not being able to shoot. The other one that gets used in conjunction is the "bad trigger", and then they proclaim that they "feel cheap" and prefer "steel and wood guns". All lame excuses for not being able to shoot. The point to the images is that the angles between many common guns are not all that different, which makes the grip angle "issue" a non issue.

Canuck44 said:
Just out of curiosity what are you training for?

I fire more than 5,000 rds per year and 500 rounds a week would mean it had rained a lot that week. I still prefer the reliability and shootability of the M&P. As an aside the only two guns I have seen jam up at a Sanctioned match are four Glocks and several 1911's. One of the Glocks broke a spring and the others three were likely limp wristed as they all occurred on the weak side of a wall for right handed shooters. The heavy Glock slide makes limp wristing a jam fairly easy. No fault of the gun but it does happen. All guns wear out over time and are susceptible to breakage including the Glock. Personal preference rules and to say one is better than another is silly. They are both excellent designs for what they are made for. What we can do with them falls to the shooter.

Personally, I think the CZ New Edition is the best looking, ###ist pistol made and the Glock butt ugly but I also realize some guys go for ugly women... too.

Take Care

Bob
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You said it yourself Bob, the failures were not the result of the gun and were most likely attributed to the user. People who can't shoot or in the cases above can't hold up a pistol to make it cycle properly are far from the litmus test I would use to evaluate what gun is or isn't a quality piece. Limp wristing is entirely due to poor user input. It is not a knock on any make or model, it is a knock on the individual who lacks the physical strength to hold the gun remotely steady so it can function as designed. Both designs are not excellent, the Glock is the (original) excellent design, the S&W is a near carbon copy that functions quite well.

Oh and as my friend TDC(who I know you're very fond of Bob) has said in the past, "Looks never won a match or a gunfight". A good looking gun is a personal opinion and one that doesn't effect the performance at all.

capp325 said:
"Bad" is a relative term. Is it a steaming pile of dung? No. Is it as good as a typical German or Austrian polymer pistol? No. With a few exceptions, semi-autos have never been S&W's strong suit. The Sigma pistols were crap. The 1st - 3rd generation guns that preceded them were mediocre. The only S&W semi-auto I can think of that is known for its excellence is the Model 41 .22 target pistol. Then there's S&W long history of inconsistent quality control, which is a separate topic...
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Oh who wants to talk about S&W's less than stellar history of product quality and design. That would only muddy the waters.. ;)

TW25B
 
Well my new M&P 9mm is off for warranty work. Am sure hoping that the replacement barrel will fix the issue. Should as it is a known problem. Other than the lower left shooting I love the gun!
 
CamDelle said:
Well my new M&P 9mm is off for warranty work. Am sure hoping that the replacement barrel will fix the issue. Should as it is a known problem. Other than the lower left shooting I love the gun!
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Are you right handed?

Because if so I agree flinching is a fairly well known problem. However that isn't gun related.
 
r34skyline said:
Are you right handed?

Because if so I agree flinching is a fairly well known problem. However that isn't gun related.
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Actually tactical teacher and 2 other shooters used the gun. All are shooting low and to left. 3-5 inches low at 5 yards. Me shooting no worries. Shooter related. The other 3 I dont think so.. Especially when one was off of a rest.

Known problem that a bunch of M&P 9mm came with crappy barrels that cause this issue.

I do appreciate the input, But I did get this info from charlton the warranty center. It also seems to have mismatched sights.
 
CamDelle said:
Actually tactical teacher and 2 other shooters used the gun. All are shooting low and to left. 3-5 inches low at 5 yards. Me shooting no worries. Shooter related. The other 3 I dont think so.. Especially when one was off of a rest.

Known problem that a bunch of M&P 9mm came with crappy barrels that cause this issue.

I do appreciate the input, But I did get this info from charlton the warranty center. It also seems to have mismatched sights.
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Now that's what I call a quality firearm Laugh2 Laugh2 Laugh2
 
enefgee said:
55000 rounds in 7 years. Same barrel, 3 recoil springs, 3 sets of mag springs, 2 sets of followers, 3 strikers - no part was replaced due to failure - still have the strikers and recoil springs just in case. I have a new replacement barrel and an Apex failure resistant extractor - still in the package. No firearm related failures.
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2007 glock 17 with 200 000 plus rounds thru it of wolf usa ammo, got it from firearms training school , the barrel is pitted and worn from the chamber forward about a centimeter and shoots 12 inch steel at 80 yards, upgraded steel guide rod with spring, very smooth. This barrel shoots better than a new 23 i recently purchased.
 
misanthropist said:
Oh please, give us the justification for this.

I'm a Glock guy...but I think their ergos blow and lots of guns can play in Glock's league on reliability.
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Truer words have yet to grace this thread. Where TDC rode others fearlessly tread. Same old same old.

Frankly, given my druthers I druther shoot my GP-100. It is more accurate than any Glock or M&P made, is just as reliable from one range session to another and kills cardboard targets, gongs at 100 yards and TV bad guys silently as I dry fire it with the consistency of a sun dial. Being caught up in a drug induced gun fight has never been one of my wet dreams so the six rounds, reload in four seconds and do it all over again has a certain Southern appeal. More genteel as my Texas friend is often heard to say.

I now will return this discussion over to those who now may want to argue the merits of their respective guns against the 4.2" Ruger GP-100, a gun that weighs less than a 4" 686 with the grips each has and has a smoother trigger than the 686.

Those comments should set the fox in the hen house. Might as well, if the NDP gets in we will only be one multi shooting incident away from losing our pistols anyway.

Take care

Bob
 
0.5moa said:
2007 glock 17 with 200 000 plus rounds thru it of wolf usa ammo, got it from firearms training school , the barrel is pitted and worn from the chamber forward about a centimeter and shoots 12 inch steel at 80 yards, upgraded steel guide rod with spring, very smooth. This barrel shoots better than a new 23 i recently purchased.
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That's very nice, but clearly, my M&P has shot more than 5,000 rounds per year for 7 years and hasn't blown up - hell, hasn't even hiccuped - at least I think that's the point I was making. After all, it isn't a rick measuring contest, is it? Besides, I either bought or loaded all of those rounds - if I'd had 200K rounds, I'd have shot them.
 
andrew3081 said:
Actually, it was a brand new Gen3 Glock 17.
A quick internet search shows that they still have not fix the BTF issue with Gen4 Glock...
It was a big issue for me as I don't want my face to be burnt by the hot empty brass. Sold the gun afterwards of course.
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Hmmm... I put 350 rounds through my week old gen 4 G17 yesterday. Add that to the 15k I put through my gen 3 model over the past few years. I have yet to be hit by any brass in the face.

That said, the few times I have shot a friends m and p I have enjoyed the gun. Fits very well in my hand. I'm just a Glock guy and they never seem to break on me or ftf or fte. I would be more than comfortable owning either or both.

Jeff
 
0.5moa said:
did you get shot at alot? did you have to fire back ?

if you fire less than 5,000 rounds a year s&w's are fine, if you drop 500 rounds or more per weekend training with the pistol you carry, its glock gen 3's all the way.
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Who gets shot at that much? If you are getting in regular firefights you might want to skip the pistol route altogether and go with a rifle and armoured vehicle...

Jeff
 
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