Mouse fart recipes

I've mostly used Trail Boss with 70-80% case capacity loads and never had ignition problems. I've tried some .45-70 loads down to maybe 50-60% capacity. Several people have reported with lighter loads (closer to 30-50% case capacity?) there can be ignition problems with powder position in the case (especially shooting downhill). I've never tried this myself. A filler would keep the powder against the primer and should prevent ignition problems. If you're looking for exceptionally light loads, mostly subsonic, you may have to use a filler.

I use Unique for most of my reduced loads (opened my last bottle a little while ago, I'm rationing since it's all I have) but have also tried 800X, Bluedot, Reddot, Titegroup, IMR4227, Longshot, HS-6, and probably some I'm forgetting. With conventional pistol and shotgun powders (not Trail Boss) I've never had issues with loads as light as 8-10gr which I guess is around ~20% case volume charge in many common medium rifle cases (.308, .303B, 7.62x54R, 6.5x55, etc.). I've used both magnum and standard rifle primers and not noticed a difference.
 
My favourite is small game load is for my .444 marlin . It is 12 grains of unique, a cereal box wad the rest of the case filled with#4 shot and an upside down 44 cal gas check crimped over the shot . The pattern gets pretty thin by 20 yards but it works well up close
 
Try 7.5 shot as rifling spins the shot and does nothing for patterns.Will a plastic .410 wad fit ? John Wooters had a 3 ball stacked load for the 45-70 that printed around 3" groups at 20 yards or so? Could be duplicated in the triple 4 perhaps? Harold
 
Silvertip13 said:
Trailboss powder is the easiest way to build light loads for most hunting rounds. Hammond gamegetters is what I pack hunting though as it takes up less space, weighs less and is cheaper.
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You have multiple game getters ready to go? That sounds pricey.

I love my game getter too, but don't wanna get a new one for every rifle. My current dilemma is that one of my .308s won't take a Hammond game getter. The firing pin is pointy like a needle and doesn't reliably crush the rim of the .22 blanks.
 
Gatehouse said:
There are dozens of light loads that have been worked up with all sorts of powders and fillers and potions...I've done it myself many times.

But now, since we are almost into 2016, we may as well use the simplest route. Get some TrailBoss and follow Hodgdons directions.
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LUTNIT said:
For reduced loads I usually use normal weight cast bullets but have been meaning to try buckshot pellets sized down. I'd run a 00 buck pellet (.330") through a Lee push-through sizing die bringing it down to .309". I'd try loads of most any normal shotgun or pistol powder starting at 6-7gr and going up to maybe 12-15gr. Find something that works well and load up a bunch, write down what it is. Keep things consistent and redevelop the load if anything is changed. For the loads on the lighter end I'd check the bore after each shot for either a lodged pellet and to see how dirty the bore is. At low velocities there are various reports online of it working well without lube but I'd likely throw some Lee alox on there because it's easy to do.

I've been meaning to try this for .30 cal cartridges and haven't but have done it for others. I shot 00 buck pellets sized down to .323" for an 8x57mm Czech mauser and it worked decently well (5-6" groups at 50yds if I remember correctly; easily take a grouse at 10-25yds). Also works well for .435" round balls sized down to .430" for very light loads in a .44 mag (below .44 special loads). It worked, but not as well, with .461" round balls sized to .458" in a .45-70. I may have been pushing them too fast for such a small bearing surface though; need to do more testing with the .45-70 loads.

The Hodgdon data site has data for subsonic loads using Titegroup for many rifle cartridges. They use conventional rifle bullets, not round balls or buckshot pellets, but could serve the same purpose as a small game cartridge. Some guys say you need to use lard or shortening to lube the bullets with these loads but I've shot many subsonic rifle bullets and my only squibs that lodged bullets in the barrel were my fault when seeing how low I could go; I didn't have issues until I went below 700fps.
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Northman999 said:
As has been stated, easiest is to use Trail Boss, if it is available. When you want to get really, really low velocities, you can use very little and a dacron filler; just be sure the dacron stays up at the bullet end and does not compress back into the Trail Boss charge. Great for larger cases.

Unique, Red Dot, Green Dot and Blue Dot can also be used with filler. The internet will get you some starting recipes. Unique seems to be the most versatile powder for this stuff, and has a long history of being used this way. If you can actually find any....

Personally I prefer to use the same, or similar bullet I normally use in whatever cartridge I am loading for. All this buckshot, gamegetter, shotgun wad, wax sealing stuff seems like a whole bunch of unnecessary work. Same brass, same primer, same bullet, same seating depth, just change powder and maybe some dacron and you're done. I use a jiffy marker to blacken the base of my subsonic ammo so I can quickly tell what is what.
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LUTNIT said:
I've mostly used Trail Boss with 70-80% case capacity loads and never had ignition problems. I've tried some .45-70 loads down to maybe 50-60% capacity. Several people have reported with lighter loads (closer to 30-50% case capacity?) there can be ignition problems with powder position in the case (especially shooting downhill). I've never tried this myself. A filler would keep the powder against the primer and should prevent ignition problems. If you're looking for exceptionally light loads, mostly subsonic, you may have to use a filler.

I use Unique for most of my reduced loads (opened my last bottle a little while ago, I'm rationing since it's all I have) but have also tried 800X, Bluedot, Reddot, Titegroup, IMR4227, Longshot, HS-6, and probably some I'm forgetting. With conventional pistol and shotgun powders (not Trail Boss) I've never had issues with loads as light as 8-10gr which I guess is around ~20% case volume charge in many common medium rifle cases (.308, .303B, 7.62x54R, 6.5x55, etc.). I've used both magnum and standard rifle primers and not noticed a difference.
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Great input guys, thanks :)

Any of you fellas care to share some tried and true, caliber specific recipes for the cook book?
 
Enjoy shooting my 55gn cast bullets in my M4 over 3gn of clays. Fun little plinking load I've been shooting out to 25m and plenty accurate. Turns the semi into a manual action but still fun and raises questions at the range that's for sure. Clays is my favourite powder I have and love it for its versatility. Have loaded nice light loads using clays and cast bullets in my milsurps with good success just don't have the records handy at the moment.
 
Hmmm funny all these people talk talk about reduced loads .... Funny thing is in Europe in general this is what people do to hunt reduce there loads so there is not a lot of noise .... And bullets don't travel more than like 100 meters...... At the very most.... It was funny I was in Europe and I kept on hearing this (pop) sound the pop. Pop pop my friend was laughing at me ... He knew what it was ... I didn't but was curious looked in the field and there was a guy walking in the field with rabbits and some kind of bird!!!! I said hunting in the town !!!!! Wow in Canada we would have the swat team .... Police .... Provincial police. After us ... Stupid me they told me a #### load of recipes but didn't think to write any down... We just talked about guns and hunting
 
I've got a .30 cal mold. Mostly I use them for slugging bores on my 30 cals. Tried a load a while back with a small charge of Unique (maybe).

I didn't get a chance to really try it out much, as a buddy shot them all up before I had much of a chance to really see how accurate they were in my 30-30, but the velocity was up there in the 1500-2000 fps range.

I since acquired a 32 cal pistol mold in the 100 grain range, and with reduced loads it hits significantly differently than with hunting ammo.

I don't use Unique anymore because a buddy needed my last pound more than I did, so I'm reduced to using other powders. Mostly 8-10 grains of Trailboss. As long as it isn't compressed you should have a safe load to use.
 
kodiakjack said:
Hey gang.

I was hoping some of you would share your mouse fart recipes (reduced loads for picking off grouse and small game while big game hunting). I know a lot of folks do it, so I thought it would be good to compile a cook book of sorts for various chamberings.

I'm personally interested in .308, but the more the merrier. If there's enough content, I'll edit the OP to keep things on the front page for easy reference in the future.

Thanks folks! :)

KJ
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Thought about this when I was more into hunting but stopped. if you are going after small game with a dedicated set up, I would use a smaller cal.

If this is plan B while hunting for big game, I would ask you test what happens to your POI of your big game load after you have shot a few of these reduced loads?

YMMV.

Jerry
 
I might have shot one or two chickens with the reduced recoil loads, but that's about it. Probably have shot just as many with a full charge from the muzzleloader (head and neck shots from 10-20' away)

Mostly the reduced loads are for when kids show up, or I'm introducing a new shooter who doesn't like recoil or noise, but wants to step up from a .22

Several years ago a friend showed up with his 5 or 6 year old son. I gave the son the 30-30 and about 50 or so rounds of the mouse phart loads. The kid had a BLAST shooting the reduced loads from a "grown up gun", and it kept his interest in hunting and shooting without turning him off of shooting a bigger gun.

I did the math, and IIRC those 50 reduced recoil loads cost less than $5 for the whole box. Sure beats +/- $20 for a box of 20 in the store.

It's not all about the loud noise and big recoil sometimes. Sometimes it's about the trigger time, in the back yard, without bothering napping neighbours, with your favourite big game gun.

I also have neighbours with horses, so I don't need to be spooking the horses while I'm getting some trigger time. I can shoot full house loads, but don't always need to.
 
Mystic Precision said:
Thought about this when I was more into hunting but stopped. if you are going after small game with a dedicated set up, I would use a smaller cal.
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Indeed, I've never heard of anyone using a big game rifle as a "dedicated" grouse/bunny gun. This is just a common solution to the question "What's for dinner" at moose camp.

If this is plan B while hunting for big game, I would ask you test what happens to your POI of your big game load after you have shot a few of these reduced loads?

YMMV.

Jerry
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If you're referring to lead fouling of the barrel, I've experienced no ill effects. I use a Hammond game getter that fires a 00buck pellet from 350 to 1000 fps depending on the .22 blank used. My point of impact for full size rounds has never changed. Although, I'm by no means a bench shooter. Long range precision guys may likely find a change, but I'd venture to guess that where bunnies and grouse reside, guys are hunting in an area where very long range shots are improbable anyway.
 
I run 000 buck through a .358 Lee sizer die, 4.5 grs. Titegroup gives me 1" groups at 50 yards 2" low with my 350 Rem mag. Doesn't mess up a grouse too bad.
 
kodiakjack said:
Indeed, I've never heard of anyone using a big game rifle as a "dedicated" grouse/bunny gun. This is just a common solution to the question "What's for dinner" at moose camp.



If you're referring to lead fouling of the barrel, I've experienced no ill effects. I use a Hammond game getter that fires a 00buck pellet from 350 to 1000 fps depending on the .22 blank used. My point of impact for full size rounds has never changed. Although, I'm by no means a bench shooter. Long range precision guys may likely find a change, but I'd venture to guess that where bunnies and grouse reside, guys are hunting in an area where very long range shots are improbable anyway.
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I am in the southern OK valley in BC... around here, with logging, you are a few hundred yards of brush/bush where the grouse are then you open into clear cuts where you can literally shoot a country mile.

Why I never pursued this concept... I just pack a SG in my truck.

Jerry
 
Well we've got a few entries in he cook book to get us started :) Thanks!

Still looking to fill in the gaps though. Anyone got reduced load recipes for .243? .270? .303? .308? 30-06? 7mm? 7.62x39? 7.62x54?

Oh, and Happy New Year!
 
from the Hogdon site:

Hodgdon Powder Company has found that H4895 can be loaded to reduced levels.

H4895 was chosen because it is the slowest burning propellant that ignites uniformly in reduced charges.

To create reduced loads, the 60% formula is recommended.

Find the H4895 load in the Reloading Data Center for your caliber and bullet.

Take the maximum H4895 charge listed and multiply by 60% (.6).

The load may be adjusted up from there to achieve the desired velocity and accuracy.

This works only where H4985 is listed.

DO NOT use in a cartridge where H4895 is not shown.

Example: 30-06 cartridge with 125 gr. Sierra SP bullet.

Max load shown in the Reloading Data Center with H4895 is 53.7 grains. 53.7 X .6 = 32.2 grains.

The shooter begins with this load, and may work up from there to obtain the desired velocity and accuracy for his reduced load.

Call Hodgdon Powder Company if additional information is needed, 913-362-9455.
 
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