Weihrauch HW97 UnderLever Springer Love Thread

easyrider604

easyrider604

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Did some thread searching and couldn't find a dedicated thread for the HW97, so thought I'd start one for lovers of this awesome rifle. Hopefully, we can share everything and anything HW97 in this thread. Experiences, tips, mods, pictures...

Quick background: Returned to shooting two months ago after a three year absence. Shocked at the cost of ammo and reloading components these days, I decided to spend time at the range with both FAs and AGs. I actually am enjoying shooting my AGs more than FAs. So the CZ631s and the Diana 45 are getting more use now but I felt that I was missing something in these two models although both are very accurate up to 17 meters (maximum distance of my new club, indoor btw).

I decided that it was time to get a premium, powerful and accurate air rifle. I like the idea of a self contained, no fuss, no mess gun. I had CO2 rifles in the past and did not like how their velocity was dependent on ambient temp and learning how CO2 behaved as a propellant was too much work. Pneumatics are too expensive and need auxillary equipment that I do not want to deal with. Between my hobbies (RC planes, shooting, reloading, classic stereos) there is no extra space in the man cave. Foremost, I do not like the idea of 2,000-3,000 lbs per square inch of pressure inches from my head. So my premium AR will be a springer.

Only precision and accurate rifles are interesting and google said that a fixed barrel is the most inherently accurate configuration. Agreed. Side or Under Lever...well I was not fond of my FWB300 side lever as it felt awkward to hold and ####. So Under Lever...check. For caliber, .177 seemed to be the most logical as my other AGs are .177 and there is a wider selection than the other AG calibers.

Lastly, I am thinking that I should get a rifle that will last a lifetime, meaning it should have the quality, fit and finish, durablity, accuracy and the intangible pride of ownership factor that will keep me wanting to own and shoot it for the rest of my life.

So with my criteria condensed and my mind less confused, the choice has narrowed down to the Air Arms TX200 and Weihrauch HW97. Both of these are arguably the top 2 affordably and similarly priced, underlever springer rifles available. I would have tossed a coin but for the fact that I am a fan of anything steel that is made in Germany. Nothing against British steel, just the idea of owning a Tiger tank of an air rifle appealed to me.

The next decision was which particular model of HW97 to get. The HW97K Blackline STL .177 made the most sense. Apparently all HW97s in Canada are the K, Karbine, short barrel version. So K by default. Its nickel finish will keep it new looking for a long long time with little maintenance. While I love wood stocks, my synthetic stock CZ452 Style (nickel finish btw) still looks new while the beautifully grained walnut of the CZ452 Varmint has suffered a bit of safe rash. Both CZs are supremely accurate, so stock material is immaterial. And I have never had a thumbhole stock. So Blackline STL it was.

Now, seeing the Blackline in person, and not having the chance to shoot it yet (no spare scope), it was love at first sight.
She needed a sister. A quick call to DLAirgun revealed a HW97KL STL in .22 was available, the last piece in their inventory. Did say that I loved wood, specially laminate, in blue and gray.... Wow, this STL in laminate version is not even in the Weihrauch catalogue, or maybe I missed it. Laminate stock were only mated to blued actions.

The prices on these HWs were very reasonable, even cheap when if you compare with their prices at US online retailers. Perhaps these prices were low because they were older stock, i.e. imported before our Cdn$ tumbled. Considering our dismal Cdn$ exchange, any new imports will cost more.

It was a no-brainer, my Blackline needed a Laminate STL companion in .22

Maybe it was not that quick, so to cut a long story short, may I present the crown jewels in my modest AR family:

 
I have the blued, blue laminate. Great gun, but heavy.

hUMS8wr.jpg
 
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Great write up and photos. These are my most loved springers. The Walther LGU and HW97kt. The LGU is stock except for a piston sleeve and the 97 has a Vortek PG2 12fpe kit installed. Love these guns!
 
Idontknowjack, Blued steel on laminate is gorgeous, except I get OCD when it comes to oiling blued guns. She's a heavy weight at 10+ lbs with scope, but I am slowly getting used to them. The 39 pound cocking force also took getting used to. Please share your Bushnell scope details.

Mulby said:
Great write up and photos. These are my most loved springers. The Walther LGU and HW97kt. The LGU is stock except for a piston sleeve and the 97 has a Vortek PG2 12fpe kit installed. Love these guns!
Click to expand...

Thanks for your kind words. Please share your scope information, i.e. brand, model and specs, etc.

Are they AO with side focus?

Did you install the Vortek PG2 kit and do you think it is necessary? I ask because John at DLairgun said I should not do anything except shoot lots and lots, no lubing or tinkering necessary for many years.


Flyr,

Dig your sidewinder scope, looks like you got some serious coin invested in your set-up! Please share your scope information with us.

Never seen that bubble level attachment before, helps when you cannot see the horizon or any other reference. Nice!
 
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easyrider604 said:
Idontknowjack, Please share your Bushnell scope details.
Click to expand...

Scope is the Bushnell Legend, Mil Dot, AO, 5-15x40mm purchased from the CAF store. Nice piece of glass.

I also have 2 of the Leapers S.W.A.T. (side wheel adjustable turret), side parallax, like above. One on my custom pcp qb78 and the other on my .25 Talon.
 
Hi 604,
I enjoyed your write up!
My rifle has gone through a few incarnations.
It started out stock, then a Maccari kit,then a Vortek PG2.
I now have a combination of both in it.
It shoots a very consistent 860 fps with JSB exacts and 890 with JSB exact express.
The scope is a UTG 8-32x56mm side focus mil dot.
It is pretty clear up to about 28x (gets fairly dark at 32x)
I use it for ranging at 32X and have made up a tape for the side wheel that gives accurate distances (not in pic)
The level helps keep the gun vertical(avoiding "cant") and really helps shooting longer distances(50+yds.)where drop becomes a significant factor.
The gun also has a re-settable safety, extra setback trigger and cocking lever grip by Rowan engineering.
Sling swivels are from S.S.S. (I think)
I have subsequently made up a removeable and adjustable Kydex raised cheek rest that lines my eye directly up with the scope and aids in repeat-ability.(not shown)
The gun weighs just over 11 pounds and I usually shoot from a sitting position,gun rested on my knee.
I use the rifle for F/T practice and long distance(for a .177 A/G)drop,wind,estimation practice.
Good luck with your rifles, they are beauts!
Regards,
AL

1 more (crappy)pic.
DSC00197.jpg
 
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I really love the PG2 kits in gerneral. Are they needed? That's a loaded question. For me it started by getting a kit for my HW50s as it needed spring and seal replacement. So smooth and quiet next was my 30s, 95, 97, and even my Diana 34 sports a kit. The scopes on my 97 and LGU pictured are Hawke Varment 4-12 side focus. Not the fanciest of items but they do what I need them to do.
 
easyrider604 said:
Did you install the Vortek PG2 kit and do you think it is necessary? I ask because John at DLairgun said I should not do anything except shoot lots and lots, no lubing or tinkering necessary for many years.
Click to expand...
John's advice is good. Don't worry about tune kits until you've broken in the rifle and really seen how it shoots and behaves. If you find down the road that you would like to have an even smoother shot cycle than your HW97 will have when broken in, then you might want to consider the 12 fpe tune kit from Vortek. I put one in my HW77K and in an Air Arms TX200 and they work very well. Out of the box your HW97 will be shooting close to 14 fpe. With a little less power, the rifle will be easier to #### and have less recoil, making for a smoother shooter with even greater accuracy potential. At 12 foot pounds of energy, a .177 pellet weighing 8.4 grains (a very typical weight) will have a muzzle velocity around 800 fps. In the U.K. where they are very enthusiastic airgun shooters because of their firearms laws, the vast majority use 12 fpe air rifles and bag plenty of rabbits, birds, and squirrels. It's all in the shot placement.
 
Those HW's are very nice guns, worth every penny you invest. I have the HW 77 since I wanted the iron sights. Guns like that turn heads, they are so well made they put many powder burners to shame.
Denis
 
idontknowjack said:
Scope is the Bushnell Legend, Mil Dot, AO, 5-15x40mm purchased from the CAF store. Nice piece of glass.

I also have 2 of the Leapers S.W.A.T. (side wheel adjustable turret), side parallax, like above. One on my custom pcp qb78 and the other on my .25 Talon.
Click to expand...

Guess what, the Bushnell Banner 4-12X x 40 AO on my 97K .22 broke this morning. Elevation adjustment did not work. It is a new unit from Walmart. Promptly returned it. Luckily, a used Bushy Legend just like yours came on the CAF for a reasonable price....should be in my hands by next weekend.
 
flyr said:
Hi 604,
I enjoyed your write up!
My rifle has gone through a few incarnations.
It started out stock, then a Maccari kit,then a Vortek PG2.
I now have a combination of both in it.
It shoots a very consistent 860 fps with JSB exacts and 890 with JSB exact express.
The scope is a UTG 8-32x56mm side focus mil dot.
It is pretty clear up to about 28x (gets fairly dark at 32x)
I use it for ranging at 32X and have made up a tape for the side wheel that gives accurate distances (not in pic)
The level helps keep the gun vertical(avoiding "cant") and really helps shooting longer distances(50+yds.)where drop becomes a significant factor.
The gun also has a re-settable safety, extra setback trigger and cocking lever grip by Rowan engineering.
Sling swivels are from S.S.S. (I think)
I have subsequently made up a removeable and adjustable Kydex raised cheek rest that lines my eye directly up with the scope and aids in repeat-ability.(not shown)
The gun weighs just over 11 pounds and I usually shoot from a sitting position,gun rested on my knee.
I use the rifle for F/T practice and long distance(for a .177 A/G)drop,wind,estimation practice.
Good luck with your rifles, they are beauts!
Regards,
AL

1 more (crappy)pic.
Click to expand...

Hey bro, 1 crappy picture is better than 1,000 crappy words :)LOL

Thanks for your reply and kind words...I definitely need the bubble level. Hope it is not too pricey as I want it on all my scoped rifles, powder and Air. Keeping the gun consistently vertical (horizontal?) is one key to accuracy at longer distances. Haven't tried JSB pellets but Crosman Premier HP's (cheapo pellets) have given 1 holers at 10 meters. That is after about 150 shots to break in the gun and bring me up to speed after 3 yrs with no trigger time.

Did you install the Vortek PG2 kit yourself? Sounds like its beyond my capability. I don't have spring compressor.

Does that sunshade obstruct pellet loading? What's the deal on that large side wheel? Wouldn't a small knob work as well?
 
Mulby said:
I really love the PG2 kits in gerneral. Are they needed? That's a loaded question. For me it started by getting a kit for my HW50s as it needed spring and seal replacement. So smooth and quiet next was my 30s, 95, 97, and even my Diana 34 sports a kit. The scopes on my 97 and LGU pictured are Hawke Varment 4-12 side focus. Not the fanciest of items but they do what I need them to do.
Click to expand...

Although John at DLAirguns specifically said to not do anything but shoot, shoot and shoot these 97s, I am curious about these kits. Are they easy to install without special tools or special skills? I have no problem with complete disassembly of FAs like 1911s, but these springers look intimidating.
 
A spring compressor would take a lot of risk out of disassembly and reassembly. Like mentioned enjoy your gun and look at aftermarket parts when the factory components fail. In my experience HW springs don't have the longest life span. And the first part that will likely need replacing is the breech seal. Vortek make a superior seal over the HW part.
 
easyrider604 said:
Hey bro, 1 crappy picture is better than 1,000 crappy words :)LOL

Thanks for your reply and kind words...I definitely need the bubble level. Hope it is not too pricey as I want it on all my scoped rifles, powder and Air. Keeping the gun consistently vertical (horizontal?) is one key to accuracy at longer distances. Haven't tried JSB pellets but Crosman Premier HP's (cheapo pellets) have given 1 holers at 10 meters. That is after about 150 shots to break in the gun and bring me up to speed after 3 yrs with no trigger time.
Did you install the Vortek PG2 kit yourself? Sounds like its beyond my capability. I don't have spring compressor.
Does that sunshade obstruct pellet loading? What's the deal on that large side wheel? Wouldn't a small knob work as well?
Click to expand...

Hi again,
You will most likely find JSB or HN FTT pellets will be more consistent once you get out past 20 yards.
JSB pellets are available in different head sizes(mine shoots the 4.52 best) testing different sizes is the only way to find out which pellet shoots the best in your rifle.
I did all mods on the 97kt rifle.
A spring compressor is easy and cheap to build.(there are tutorials on Ytube)
Due to the large objective lens on the scope there is a lot of flare in sunny conditions with out the shade,I don't really notice the shade loading anymore.(10,000+pellets through current set up)
The larger side wheel spreads the yardage graduations out so you can estimate distances more accurately for hold over, or for "clicking".
As I stated in an earlier post I made up a yardage tape using measured distances for when they are in focus at 32x ( the actual graduations on the supplied wheel are not accurate)The tape is now over top of the factory graduations.
The scope will give very good estimates out to about 60yds, It declines in usable accuracy past this point.
You have to remember that if you sight in for say, 35yds , the pellet will be dropping very rapidly past 60 and range estimation will be critical when the pellet can drop 1 inch over 1 yard.( I use a laser RF at longer distances)
My rifle sighted in at 35yds hits about 3 inches low at 60yds, 10 at 80, and 30+ at 100.
Enjoy your rifle, and get used to it before you modify,getting familiar with it in stock condition will allow you to evaluate any changes (good or bad) that occur when you eventually add aftermarket parts.
A chrono is a good investment if you don't already own one.
Good Luck!
 
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All you guys with the thumbholes!!! I love the stainless blue laminate- but unfortunately when I pulled the trigger on mine they were out of stock and I got a good deal on a non-PAL one. I never actually shot the non-PAL version- I had a kit for it before I actually got the rifle!

I have the normal stock with a 12fpe vortek kit. It is my favorite air rifle- even among the PCP ones. I did the kit myself and didn't need a spring compressor- but I did start with a 495fps gun so maybe the spring was different? (yes I know I made it a firearm and yes I have my PAL so nobody needs to worry!). These are a little easier than other springers as the back of the spring chamber threads on. It is much easier than compressing a spring and trying to get a retaining pin through the rear cap. If you can handle normal firearms assembly and disassembly then putting a kit in likely won't be above your head. I probably wouldn't bother with a kit until I had a mechanical with the original. Springs are going to fail eventually so take the opportunity for a kit and a new seal and everything will be good (or slightly better) as new.

The 12fpe kit is just super smooth and quiet. It is hard to believe that a springer can behave like that and the accuracy is phenomenal. I have tried a lot of different pellets and it works well with most but I find the 4.52 JSB exacts to be the best for it. I chrony it around 810fps with those.

Guys at the range always come to check it out. As long as the wind isn't blowing too hard the groups at 50 yards surprise most of them. It is never going to leave my safe.
 
grauhanen said:
John's advice is good. Don't worry about tune kits until you've broken in the rifle and really seen how it shoots and behaves. If you find down the road that you would like to have an even smoother shot cycle than your HW97 will have when broken in, then you might want to consider the 12 fpe tune kit from Vortek. I put one in my HW77K and in an Air Arms TX200 and they work very well. Out of the box your HW97 will be shooting close to 14 fpe. With a little less power, the rifle will be easier to #### and have less recoil, making for a smoother shooter with even greater accuracy potential. At 12 foot pounds of energy, a .177 pellet weighing 8.4 grains (a very typical weight) will have a muzzle velocity around 800 fps. In the U.K. where they are very enthusiastic airgun shooters because of their firearms laws, the vast majority use 12 fpe air rifles and bag plenty of rabbits, birds, and squirrels. It's all in the shot placement.
Click to expand...

I am too inexperienced with AGs to really discern the difference between medium and high recoil, or thump vs twang. My Original Diana 45 and "New" Diana 45 (which is the 34 action in a 45 stock) both feel stronger in recoil than my HW97s, but not enough to bother. I suppose accuracy is affected by amount or the kind of recoil, but again, I am not that good at shooting AGs yet to tell the difference (that is not saying I am a great shot with FAs, which I am not). I have had AGs since the 80s but did not shoot them much or truly appreciate them. Too bad I sold my FWB 300S some yrs ago. These HW97s are great guns and I really enjoy shooting them the way they are out-of-the-box. I will continue to shoot them and learn how to shoot them well as-is. I will follow John's advice as you said. Tnx
 
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cartwheel said:
All you guys with the thumbholes!!! I love the stainless blue laminate- but unfortunately when I pulled the trigger on mine they were out of stock and I got a good deal on a non-PAL one. I never actually shot the non-PAL version- I had a kit for it before I actually got the rifle!

I have the normal stock with a 12fpe vortek kit. It is my favorite air rifle- even among the PCP ones. I did the kit myself and didn't need a spring compressor- but I did start with a 495fps gun so maybe the spring was different? (yes I know I made it a firearm and yes I have my PAL so nobody needs to worry!). These are a little easier than other springers as the back of the spring chamber threads on. It is much easier than compressing a spring and trying to get a retaining pin through the rear cap. If you can handle normal firearms assembly and disassembly then putting a kit in likely won't be above your head. I probably wouldn't bother with a kit until I had a mechanical with the original. Springs are going to fail eventually so take the opportunity for a kit and a new seal and everything will be good (or slightly better) as new.

The 12fpe kit is just super smooth and quiet. It is hard to believe that a springer can behave like that and the accuracy is phenomenal. I have tried a lot of different pellets and it works well with most but I find the 4.52 JSB exacts to be the best for it. I chrony it around 810fps with those.

Guys at the range always come to check it out. As long as the wind isn't blowing too hard the groups at 50 yards surprise most of them. It is never going to leave my safe.
Click to expand...

Sorry I stole (from you) the last .22 Blue Lam STL, couldn't resist getting a companion rifle, after seeing in person the .177 Blackline STL. Had to follow my one in, one out rule, so my safe queen SW Mod 27 .357 revolver had to go.

It is good you have the skill and strength to remove spring without compressor. 1911 recoil springs are nowhere near the power of a 950 fps AG, I think!:) No rush to change springs or going into the internals yet, still enjoying my honeymoon with my two honeys, it's like marrying 2 trophy wives with brains, LOL!

Later I may look into that 12FPE kit, as I am more of an accuracy than velocity fan. Less mechanical stress on the rifle itself, I think, so it should last longer.

JB Exacts 4.52 seem to be the pellet of choice and I tried ordering from CAF...$40 for shipping 6 cans (assorted types including .22)...too much IMO, guess I have to look elsewhere for now unless I order 20,000 pellets.

Tnx for your post.
 
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easyrider604 said:
JB Exacts 4.52 seem to be the pellet of choice and I tried ordering from CAF...$40 for shipping 6 cans (assorted types including .22)...too much IMO, guess I have to look elsewhere for now unless I order 20,000 pellets.

Tnx for your post.
Click to expand...

$40 is the default shipping for everything on the site. Contact them for an accurate shipping cost. Often they just refund the difference.
 
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