Phat Eagle
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley, BC
^^^. That is why they developed .300 Blackout.
Sub sonic .223/.556
- Thread starter Izzi115
- Start date
^^^. That is why they developed .300 Blackout.
Subsonic 300 BLK with a conventional muzzle device will run about 150 - 155 dB. While a lot quieter than full power rounds, that is still way above the 140 dB limit for hearing damage. I tested a 10" 300 BLK with a SPEX brake and it was down around 145 dB IIRC. This is pretty close to being hearing safe.
+1 for the BLK. Super fun round with a lot less noise and bother.
Phat Eagle
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley, BC
.300 BLK with a suppressor is very manageable. Too bad we're not allowed them as law-abiding citizens...
No centerfire round is really hearing safe without hearing protection. I've fired 150gr and 208gr 300BLK rounds subsonic and they both left my ears ringing after one shot while shooting outdoors. Heck, even firing a case with only a primer in it will make your ears ring if you're indoors.
Quality electronic hearing protection is worth the money and doesn't prevent you from hearing what's going on around you.
I can't think of any situation where you would need to practice shooting without ear-pro, if you're a hunter you can still make the one shot on a critter without plugs or muffs without too much damage but why would you not wear it when you can?
You won't flinch on your first shot anyway, it's your second and third shots you'll flinch on if you're not wearing hearing protection, and if you're practicing with subsonics and then you go to the field and use supersonics you'll flinch just the same because the noise will be that much more than what you are used to practicing with.
Just for a little idea of what you're heading towards if you keep shooting without hearing protection. Talking to my wife's parents or watching TV with them is so annoying, they need everything so loud. I came home the other day and they were visiting and the TV was so loud and the subtitles were on as well. I don't think that TV has ever been that loud before and I had to go back out to the shop and the tranquility of my gun/toy room.
Is it worth it? Not in my opinion.
Quality electronic hearing protection is worth the money and doesn't prevent you from hearing what's going on around you.
I can't think of any situation where you would need to practice shooting without ear-pro, if you're a hunter you can still make the one shot on a critter without plugs or muffs without too much damage but why would you not wear it when you can?
You won't flinch on your first shot anyway, it's your second and third shots you'll flinch on if you're not wearing hearing protection, and if you're practicing with subsonics and then you go to the field and use supersonics you'll flinch just the same because the noise will be that much more than what you are used to practicing with.
Just for a little idea of what you're heading towards if you keep shooting without hearing protection. Talking to my wife's parents or watching TV with them is so annoying, they need everything so loud. I came home the other day and they were visiting and the TV was so loud and the subtitles were on as well. I don't think that TV has ever been that loud before and I had to go back out to the shop and the tranquility of my gun/toy room.
Is it worth it? Not in my opinion.
I have subsonic Isreali military rounds I bought years back a a GTA gun show. Obviously used for the type of urban operations they face. Since this has got my attention I will have to dig them up from my cartridge collection as I believe they have a very unusual bullet that if I remember may even be plastic but not a usual profile. Guy was selling 10 round strips of them. I will see if I can get some pics up----Dieseldog!
Canadian_Zuk
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Pickering, Ontario
Subsonic .223 loads can be useful. I cast my own 55 grain .224 soft lead projectiles and use 4 grains of Trailboss powder and some dacron filler, this load gives me 1,000 FPS. My Savage bolt action rifle is quieter and more accurate than my 1200fps pellet gun, not to mention the 55 gr bullet actually carries some energy to the target.
Phhht WRONG.
A subsonic pointed rifle bullet will not expand and will wildly overpenetrate with producing a decent wound channel. For the most part the energy will be wasted when the bullet flies out the other side of the target.
On the other hand a 40gr 22 rim fire bullet will expand and thus expend much more energy in the target.
I've done a lot of work with subsonic rifle bullets and for the most part they are semi-useless pain in the @ss. Other than 300 BLK, a better choice is 22 rim fire.
Canadian_Zuk
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Pickering, Ontario
What exactly is so wrong with my post? My load data? Would you like to see chronograph pics? Or my statement that my pellet gun is louder? What are you getting at? The OP specifically asked about subsonic 223 and I provided a load that works for me.
Most of them are actually especially a lots of old timer, they just didn't realize that yet. I was too stupid not to use one when I was young but back then nobody really care much either.
Hearing loss doesn't necessarily mean deaf. And a great many veterans do indeed have severe hearing loss due to their exposure to gunfire, explosions, etc.
This is the chart for noise exposure limits in the Alberta OH&S Regs. It gives you an idea of what are considered safe noise levels in a workplace:
Table 1
Noise exposure limits
[ See sections 218, 219(1) ]| Exposure level (dBA) | Exposure duration |
| 82 | 16 hours |
| 83 | 12 hours and 41minutes |
| 84 | 10 hours and 4 minutes |
| 85 | 8 hours |
| 88 | 4 hours |
| 91 | 2 hours |
| 94 | 1 hour |
| 97 | 30 minutes |
| 100 | 15 minutes |
| 103 | 8 minutes |
| 106 | 4 minutes |
| 109 | 2 minutes |
| 112 | 56 seconds |
| 115 and greater | 0 |
https://search-ohs-laws.alberta.ca/legislation/occupational-health-and-safety-code/schedule-3-noise/
Note that there is no safe exposure duration for any noise louder than 115dB. Centerfire rifles are closer to 160dB. Every single time you expose yourself to gunfire without hearing protection you suffer some amount of hearing loss.
Mark
Impulse noise is a bit different. OSHA lists 140 dB as the limit for hearing damage. A gunshot is on the order of 100-150 microseconds. Under the 140 dB limit, it takes a lot of gunshots to add up to any exposure time.
Centefire rifles will be on the order of 165 dB.
Here's some info on dB of firearms. Per the 'charts' ALL Firearms create OVER that 140dB. And I have Tinnitus from thousands of shots; The 'higher Crack' of pistols - even a .25 from a 2" barrel - Hurts me about as much as the .30+ cal rounds !
https://earinc.com/gunfire-noise-level-reference-chart/ ( specific calibre & Gauge levels
Chart from http s://scarlet-tech.com/osha-noise-standard/
https://earinc.com/gunfire-noise-level-reference-chart/ ( specific calibre & Gauge levels
Chart from http s://scarlet-tech.com/osha-noise-standard/
What Are OSHA Decibel Limits?
| Noise Level (dBA) | Max Exposure Time | Example Source |
| 85 dBA (Action Level) | – | Loud traffic inside a car |
| 90 dBA (PEL) | 8 hours | Shouted conversation |
| 95 dBA | 4 hours | Electric drill, forklift area |
| 100 dBA | 2 hours | Chainsaw, pneumatic drill |
| 140 dB (Peak Limit) | Impulse only | Gunshot, explosive impact |
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Flying radial powered aircraft 10's of thousands of hours back in the day has been much harder on my ears than shooting...Except for that one time with naked ears and my 686 4" and a balls to the wall 125 grain/296WW round...My ears are still ringing.
Funny thing is my hearing when tested is still very good for my age...It's the full time tinnitus and occasional sensitivity that sucks.
I used to get very sensitive ears after a ton of flying...Even walking with dry leaves on the ground in the fall would be uncomfortable on my noise sensitized ears...Since we had the aircraft converted to turbine engines and noise cancelling headset sensitive ears is a thing of the past but the ever present ringing is endless.
Funny thing is my hearing when tested is still very good for my age...It's the full time tinnitus and occasional sensitivity that sucks.
I used to get very sensitive ears after a ton of flying...Even walking with dry leaves on the ground in the fall would be uncomfortable on my noise sensitized ears...Since we had the aircraft converted to turbine engines and noise cancelling headset sensitive ears is a thing of the past but the ever present ringing is endless.
As with yourself Lastgun, my hearing is actually quite good.
But sitting up on the hill glassing, my old friend tinnitus is never absent.
Ummmm, nope.
I load sub223 all the time.
My fav pill is the 75gr hornady HPBT match but the Barnes Matchburner 77gr are pretty good too.
Tons of fun. Super frugal on powder.
Why not!?
