Alberta Fires....

It's a terrible terrible time Grump. Don't blame you for being raw.

There will be rays of sun through all this terrible catastrophe. It'll take weeks, but it'll come. New homes, new planning (that maybe wasn't as rushed as FM was the first go around), new forest growth, work for out of work oil folks, etc, etc.....

It looks like everyone's alive. It's as good as it can be right now..
 
grumpyold said:
I' m a little raw right now. A week ago a fire broke out 35 miles south east. Two days ago a fire broke out 15 miles east, right while Fort Mac turned into hell. Local friends waited with hearts in their throats to hear from family. My focus and mind set is really limited right now. I can't see why topics of this sort matter right now, and how really meaningless they all, and I guess maybe should be posted when nerves are not frayed. I'm an #######, at least that what my wife says, but I'm normally not a #### head, I guess my priorities may not match others and I'll admit any post that looks insensitive rubs my fur the wrong direction.
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Maybe now is a good time to stop surfing CGN for a while
 
grumpyold said:
I' m a little raw right now. A week ago a fire broke out 35 miles south east. Two days ago a fire broke out 15 miles east, right while Fort Mac turned into hell. Local friends waited with hearts in their throats to hear from family. My focus and mind set is really limited right now. I can't see why topics of this sort matter right now, and how really meaningless they all, and I guess maybe should be posted when nerves are not frayed. I'm an #######, at least that what my wife says, but I'm normally not a #### head, I guess my priorities may not match others and I'll admit any post that looks insensitive rubs my fur the wrong direction.
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Your human man, Dont stop coming around like another mentioned. We have to have all types here to make a community and hell maybe your post is what is needed I dont know, but be mad be pissed but know we are all shallow in our own little ways. So we wil take your wifes opinion and take you with salt, but I hope ya know we all care

I hope this came out how i wanted it to.
 
My question was about the effect of fire on an ecosystem,nothing more,nothing less.When the fires in Yellowstone burned huge areas,they realized that fire was a natural phenomena that restored browse and grasslands to forested areas.Obviously no one wants to see property destroyed and this disaster my change the way towns are protected with firebreaks. Possably building codes will also require less flammable roofing materials( in some areas cedar shakes are prohibited)
I speculated the huge areas of beetle kill pine in BC might have resulted in a firestorm,but that did not materialize ( possably due to the policy of cut block clear cutting which created fire breaks ,had the forest policy bowed to some environmentalists who demanded no clear cutting, ,they would have had a similar fire as Alberta is experiancing
Anyway, sorry if the question offends some people,it was not meant to trivialize the disaster of the loss of property,but a question of the effect of fire on an ecosystem and hopefully what lessons will be learned from it that will prevent similar disasters that put towns at risk

But if anyone wants to vent their anger,save it for the people who said it was 'Karma' for developing the oil sands..
 
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burnt_servo said:
I wonder if a class action lawsuit could be put into action if it could be proven that the cuts put firefighters at a disadvantage , which would have helped the fire get out of control faster and become larger and more destructive ......
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"if" someones wins a case against government, taxpayers are on the hook for the bill.
I sincearly hope the people of Ft Mac can rebuild there lives and homes, and move forward from this tragedy.
 
ratherbefishin said:
My question was about the effect of fire on an ecosystem,nothing more,nothing less.When the fires in Yellowstone burned huge areas,they realized that fire was a natural phenomena that restored browse and grasslands to forested areas.Obviously no one wants to see property destroyed and this disaster my change the way towns are protected with firebreaks. Possably building codes will also require less flammable roofing materials( in some areas cedar shakes are prohibited)
I speculated the huge areas of beetle kill pine in BC might have resulted in a firestorm,but that did not materialize ( possably due to the policy of cut block clear cutting which created fire breaks ,had the forest policy bowed to some environmentalists who demanded no clear cutting, ,they would have had a similar fire as Alberta is experiancing
Anyway, sorry if the question offends some people,it was not meant to trivialize the disaster of the loss of property,but a question of the effect of fire on an ecosystem and hopefully what lessons will be learned from it that will prevent similar disasters that put towns at risk

But if anyone wants to vent their anger,save it for the people who said it was 'Karma' for developing the oil sands..
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I got what you were asking, it's a cycle of Nature, although she may not have started it, who knows but the conditions were a huge contributing factor. People homes were in the line of fire it wasn't the first time, and likely won't be the last one can hope we can learn from it. The Eco system will come back and likely thrive on dead & decaying leftovers from the fire.
 
This fire is not the result of natural cycles unless a policy of total suppression and anthropogenic climate change are considered a part of the natural cycle...
 
AbdullahD said:
Your human man, Dont stop coming around like another mentioned. We have to have all types here to make a community and hell maybe your post is what is needed I dont know, but be mad be pissed but know we are all shallow in our own little ways. So we wil take your wifes opinion and take you with salt, but I hope ya know we all care

I hope this came out how i wanted it to.
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It did, at least to me.

99% of us on here would do whatever we could to help another.

I'm still wondering what I can do to help from here. I've given money, but somehow I feel me in person would do more.
 
live4therut said:
I got what you were asking, it's a cycle of Nature, although she may not have started it, who knows but the conditions were a huge contributing factor. People homes were in the line of fire it wasn't the first time, and likely won't be the last one can hope we can learn from it. The Eco system will come back and likely thrive on dead & decaying leftovers from the fire.
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As someone who has suffered loss in Fort Mac, I have to say that I have not taken offense to any poster's musings on the long term effects of the fire for the ecosystem as a whole, but to the point...

The fires that ravaged Yellowstone in the late 90's directly resulted in at least 126 new species of animals, insects, etc. coming to the area over the following few years. Food for thought - just figured I'd put it out there.
 
Having never been in the Fort McMurray area,I have no idea of the flora and fauna of the area,was it brush,forest or grassland?What is it likely to revert to?

I recall similar natural disasters,ie. the Mt St Helens eruption that people said would take 'decades' to restore life to and the following year plant life emerged and even large animals such as elk were seen again.
 
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ratherbefishin said:
Having never been in the Fort McMurray area,I have no idea of the flora and fauna of the area,was it brush,forest or grassland?What is it likely to revert to?

I recall similar natural disasters,ie. the Mt St Helens eruption that people said would take 'decades' to restore life to and the following year plant life emerged and even large animals such as elk were seen again.
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Northern Boreal Forest. Essentially Poplar, Birch, Alder, and a couple varieties of willow in open and/or wet areas, and Spruce, Larch, Lodgepole Pine, and other conifers as the mainstay of the Forest mass, depending on local soil and moisture levels.

The recovery schedule will essentially be that the ash being washed into the soil will provide essentially a fertilizer application, in to soil that becomes host to wind blown and bird borne seeds of various plants that specialize in that sort of available space, deciduous trees will take over and grow dense in the opened up areas, providing browse and cover that is prime for the moose, deer and Elk, while the seeds of the slower growing conifers will germinate, many because of the fire to open up the cones, and they will get shelter from wind and weather from the deciduous growth. In 30-50 years, you will see the deciduous trees starting to die back and be crowded out by the conifers in the areas where they are better users of the soil conditions than the deciduous trees, and this will continue until the conifers have essentially choked out the deciduous trees again. Or there is another fire, same as has happened since about the dawn of time.

Cheers
Trev
 
burnt_servo said:
the other upsides I can see with the fort mac fire are , the city planners can pretty much start with a blank slate to before rebuilding , so hopefully things can be done better .
think about all the new jobs created to rebuild ..... lots of guys looking for work now might have something to do .
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You guys realize that 80% of Fort Mac is unscathed, right?
If one is worried about the opportunities that will abound then the North is where the place is to go.
The idiot from Taber has had his hands and fingers smacked, why paint the others with the same brush.
The Geese are already heading back, it will not be long before the other forest critters return...but the fires may still pose a danger with fires still burning beneath the soil till the rains come and soak the earth.
Oh wait this is spring and the rains are a long way off.
Well said trevj.......
Tight Groups,
Rob
 
A lot of questions are going to have to be answered once the fires out or at least controlled. Conversations here are "Did we learn nothing after the Slave Lake fire?" It's so nice to have the wilderness at your back door until it starts to burn. Is the damage as bad as first thought, no. Unscathed, thinking every structure up there is going to have at least smoke damage, one big clean up to come.
 
It sucks this happened... but look to the future with heads held high and think morels, sweet sweet morels. As far as the wildlife it will rebound as it has in other burned areas. The opened up areas will become prime browse for the creatures and should actually increase overall numbers given some time.
 
So many of our CGN members have been directly impacted by this fire. So what is a good course of action for fellow CGN members to follow at this time? Too soon?
 
Bland said:
So many of our CGN members have been directly impacted by this fire. So what is a good course of action for fellow CGN members to follow at this time? Too soon?
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At this point, as I see it, the best course of action is patience, and wait for factual information. Which is hard to find on the News, these days.

When the smoke has cleared, quite literally, an things have been accurately assessed, then the folks that are actually affected directly, can move forward, as well as they can.

I too am interested in seeing if the city planners will rebuild as it was, with barely space between houses to allow light to reach the ground, or if there will be some thoughts towards some isolation spaces between homes.

As was mentioned before, all the survey work, buried services, etc., seem to indicate that they will end up rebuilding, rather than changing things, so they may have to look elsewhere for the answer.

I should hope this sort of thing would be a topic of some importance, to planners around the Boreal, for some time into the future. But hope springs eternal.

Best of luck, all in the affected areas!

Cheers
Trev
 
Good letter to the editor in today's Times Colonist by Edo Nyland, retired superintendent of the Yukon Forest Service who said there was a publication called 'Guidelines for Settlements'based on the Alberta 'Firesmart: Protecting your community from Wildfife' ...
There as also a publication called' Forest Fire News' which were sent to every government agency...but as usual, the guidelines and warnings were ignored...and politicians are reluctant to put money into pro active solutions when no crisis exists,cutting budgets to fund other pet projects that get them elected.I'm no expert or authority but it makes you wonder if something as simple as clear cutting a mile wide firebreak might have prevented this disaster.....one thing is certain and that is,no matter what it cost it would have been a whole lot cheaper
 
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ratherbefishin said:
.I'm no expert or authority but it makes you wonder if something as simple as clear cutting a mile wide firebreak might have prevented this disaster.....
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A fire of this magnitude will be creating it's own weather system and will be floating out burning embers several kilometers in front of it. Wooden shingles and combustible siding are very easily ignited in this type of situation.

If the roof surfaces of buildings are kept wet with something as simple as yard sprinklers set on the roof peaks many buildings may be saved. There are many other ways of helping to defend your buildings from wildfires some of which are outlined in British Columbia FireSmart manual which can be downloaded HERE
 
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