Question re: reloading 308 Win for Browning BLR, sporadic difficulty chambering

OldNewGuy

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Hoping somebody can assist in one or two ways.

I have a BLR SS Take Down in .308, and have had some issues reloading for it right from the get-go.

First issue was last year, when attempting to F/L resize using my RCBS standard die set, almost 100% of the F/L resized brass wouldn't chamber even after trimming to length as noted in the Lyman reloading guidebook. COAL is well within specs after resizing and seating the bullet (150 gr Hornady PSP's I got with the promotion from Hornady in 2015).

I thought I had that fixed when a couple of knowledgeable folks suggested I get an small base resizing die and use that only for my BLR since it is not recommended to use small base in bolt action rifles. I bought the small base (RCBS "X-Die") and was seeing a huge improvement in cycling and closing. But I'm still getting the odd won't chamber round (maybe 10%?) of my reloads for the BLR, and I've noticed a very small indentation in the shoulder of a few - not all, probably 2% to 3% of the resized which are part of the "won't chamber" group.

I've started using the barrel of my take down as a resized/trimmed brass check (off the receiver, natch) but that's a pain, and likely isn't doing the barrel any good by clamping it in a padded vice to have it handy for the check.

So - is there such a beast as a chamber-duplicating check die which I can use instead of the barrel/chamber of the rifle (I've been told to look at headspace check dies/gauges, but also been told they don't duplicate the entire SAAMI spec chamber, just shoulder to rim of the brass)?

And, anybody got suggestions on how to reduce, or eliminate the small percentages of "won't chamber" reloads, and smaller percentage of resized brass with the very slight indent in the shoulder - I can't seem to figure out why the indent is only intermittent, even in the same reloading session.

Should be noted that the RCBS standard die set I've been using works 100% in my son's bolt action SAKO .308, without any chambering or indented shoulder issues. It's just in the X-Base used for the BLR, and again is not constant.

Thanks!

O.N.G.
 
You might want to take a look at "slot" gauges from Sheridan Engineering. The gauges won't necessarily duplicate your chamber but they claim to replicate SAAMI spec in both length and diameter and you can see where things are off.
hxxp://www.sheridanengineering.com/index-2.htm.

Have you tried neck sizing a piece of fired brass and putting it into your case gauge (I'm assuming you have a case gauge) to see how long/short your chamber might be versus SAAMI spec?

Indentation in the shoulder of the brass is usually a sign of too much lube but should not affect chambering. Could it be that that the brass that won't chamber is just older, work-hardened brass and did not size completely?
 
along with a true small base .308 die you need one of these. Lyman case length headspace gauge http://ww w.lymanproducts.com/lyman/case-prep/rifle-headspace-gauges.php it will tell you if case is under or oversize and also if it needs trimming
 
You might want to take a look at "slot" gauges from Sheridan Engineering. The gauges won't necessarily duplicate your chamber but they claim to replicate SAAMI spec in both length and diameter and you can see where things are off.
hxxp://www.sheridanengineering.com/index-2.htm.

Have you tried neck sizing a piece of fired brass and putting it into your case gauge (I'm assuming you have a case gauge) to see how long/short your chamber might be versus SAAMI spec?

Indentation in the shoulder of the brass is usually a sign of too much lube but should not affect chambering. Could it be that that the brass that won't chamber is just older, work-hardened brass and did not size completely?

Thanks for the info.....

These are all once-fired from the BLR, and had never been resized prior to encountering the above.

I will check into the "slot gauge" from Sheridan, it sounds like they might be a solution to my desire to stop using the barrel/chamber from my take down for checking. Truthfully, I don't have a case gauge, for the 308 or any other caliber - I've never felt the need for it before now. But having reviewed the product (from Wilson and Sheridan web sites) I'll certainly consider it right away. It seems I could order both the slot gauge and the case gauge from Sheridan.

Re: lubing. I never lube the shoulder on any of my non-straight-wall brass when resizing I do lube all my straight walled rifle cases i.e. 444 Marlin. And I only use boat-tail bullets on shouldered cases so I've never seen the need for any kind of lube, excessive or otherwise, on the inside neck of the brass.

Thanks again for the feedback - this might just help me resolve the problem(s), especially the slot gauge which I wasn't aware of.

OldNewGuy
 
Unfortunately the X die is not a small base die. You have to buy dies marked as small base dies.

Neil

Actually, I purchased the small base die right from Brownells office when I was in that area on business. The box label says "RCBS X-Die Small Base Die, 308 Win". I spent about 15 minutes talking to their in-house Q&A guy who advises on reloading before I bought the thing.
 
along with a true small base .308 die you need one of these. Lyman case length headspace gauge http://ww w.lymanproducts.com/lyman/case-prep/rifle-headspace-gauges.php it will tell you if case is under or oversize and also if it needs trimming

Thanks, I'll check into those as well as the Sheridan Engineering items.

CGN is great - a wealth of knowledge shared without hesitation.

O.N.G.
 
Ask a local gunsmith to give you a scrap 308 barrel. Cut off the chamber section and you have a chamber gauge. But it will probably be bigger than the BLR chamber.

Yes, that's the issue. One of my hunting buddies also mentioned this, but my research on the BLR's as well as some of the Semi-Auto rifles (black and wood stock) seems to indicate that the chamber on these is at the tight end of the tolerance range for the SAAMI specs. Hence, the advice from RCBS that small base die resized should not be used in bolt action rifles (since the chamber tolerances are not as tight, my understanding about the reason for that caution and what the Brownell's guy mentioned to me when I visited their office/shop and bought the small base die).
 
Thanks for the info.....

These are all once-fired from the BLR, and had never been resized prior to encountering the above.

I will check into the "slot gauge" from Sheridan, it sounds like they might be a solution to my desire to stop using the barrel/chamber from my take down for checking. Truthfully, I don't have a case gauge, for the 308 or any other caliber - I've never felt the need for it before now. But having reviewed the product (from Wilson and Sheridan web sites) I'll certainly consider it right away. It seems I could order both the slot gauge and the case gauge from Sheridan.

Re: lubing. I never lube the shoulder on any of my non-straight-wall brass when resizing I do lube all my straight walled rifle cases i.e. 444 Marlin. And I only use boat-tail bullets on shouldered cases so I've never seen the need for any kind of lube, excessive or otherwise, on the inside neck of the brass.

Thanks again for the feedback - this might just help me resolve the problem(s), especially the slot gauge which I wasn't aware of.

OldNewGuy

The lube on the inside of the neck is to make it easy for the expander button to come out, without stretching the case. If the case stretches, it won't chamber in a tight chamber (like the BLR).
 
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