Why not just powder throw pistol loads? I've thrown "match" rifle rounds with pretty decent results out to 300 yards. I just check every 5 rounds then 10 after the first 20.
Sharing a press
- Thread starter sclifford
- Start date
Why not just powder throw pistol loads? I've thrown "match" rifle rounds with pretty decent results out to 300 yards. I just check every 5 rounds then 10 after the first 20.
Sharing a press immediately brings Ned Flanders and Homer Simpson to mind.
Save your money and buy your own reloading gear and not have to worry about how something mysteriously broke or diasapperaed.
Tight Groups,
Rob
Save your money and buy your own reloading gear and not have to worry about how something mysteriously broke or diasapperaed.
Tight Groups,
Rob
I went straight to a progressive press. I shoot mostly 9mm and .223.
I figure if I have 4 hours a week to shoot/reload I would rather spend 1 hour reloading and 3 hours shooting. I have made a total of 400 rounds on my press and I can pump out 200 rounds of 9mm in about 35 minutes. Thats clean brass, deprimed.
Rough prices
I picked up a hornady lnl ap form amazon.com- $389 USD and 2 hours of driving to pick it up
I dont remember all the individual prices for the components, but I got dies, scale, bullet puller, 4lbs of powder, 5000 primers, spare primer tubes, bullet feeder die and tubes, primer flip tray for about $650 from budget shooter supply (Henry is awesome)
I am shooting campro projectiles. If you look around you may find a local supplier that is cheaper then sponsors. I lucked out and found someone local who is 10% cheaper then sponsors and requires no shipping.
I figure once I have loaded 4500 rounds of 9mm exclusively I will have paid off my press. I figure that will be done this summer as I have already shot 3000 rounds of factory since march.
I couldnt share. I like the fact that I can reload whenever I have time. If I have 40 minutes I can go and work until Im out of time. I dont need to worry about cleaning up for someone else to come and use it, or redo my setup because someone else had been using it.
In the end you have to decide where your time and money is most valuable. I decided I would rather spend the money on the press and be able to spend less time reloading and more time shooting and with my family.
I figure if I have 4 hours a week to shoot/reload I would rather spend 1 hour reloading and 3 hours shooting. I have made a total of 400 rounds on my press and I can pump out 200 rounds of 9mm in about 35 minutes. Thats clean brass, deprimed.
Rough prices
I picked up a hornady lnl ap form amazon.com- $389 USD and 2 hours of driving to pick it up
I dont remember all the individual prices for the components, but I got dies, scale, bullet puller, 4lbs of powder, 5000 primers, spare primer tubes, bullet feeder die and tubes, primer flip tray for about $650 from budget shooter supply (Henry is awesome)
I am shooting campro projectiles. If you look around you may find a local supplier that is cheaper then sponsors. I lucked out and found someone local who is 10% cheaper then sponsors and requires no shipping.
I figure once I have loaded 4500 rounds of 9mm exclusively I will have paid off my press. I figure that will be done this summer as I have already shot 3000 rounds of factory since march.
I couldnt share. I like the fact that I can reload whenever I have time. If I have 40 minutes I can go and work until Im out of time. I dont need to worry about cleaning up for someone else to come and use it, or redo my setup because someone else had been using it.
In the end you have to decide where your time and money is most valuable. I decided I would rather spend the money on the press and be able to spend less time reloading and more time shooting and with my family.
look for a used turret press, it saves a wack of time changing dies and never depreciates in value, the 6 position will easily do 2 possibly 3 calibers and the dies can be left setup, get a powder drop for handgun and done, the only negative issue I have with a turret is using a RCBS bullet puller, its the old screw tighten and the turret turns when I tighten the collet, not a big deal but thats why I have a single for pulling should the need arise
for under 500 you can get a pretty decent setup for the calibers you are looking at reloading and still have change for supplies
for under 500 you can get a pretty decent setup for the calibers you are looking at reloading and still have change for supplies
ipscgraz
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Look for a used Rockchucker to start, on your own. It will serve and you will learn a bit more. If you really do outgrow it you can sell it for the price you paid for it.
You will find the time required to load quantities, especially once you get a rhythm going.
FWIW I shot my first IPSC match with ammo I built with a Lee loader and a hammer, one round at a time.
You will find the time required to load quantities, especially once you get a rhythm going.
FWIW I shot my first IPSC match with ammo I built with a Lee loader and a hammer, one round at a time.
Bingo!
Deprime/resize is a no brainer step that can be interrupted at any time, and you will always pretty much know where you are. I use two steel bowls, pull a case out of one, run my greasy (Hornady Case Lube, IIRC, had it so long I don't really recall when I lost the lid...) fingers over it while I look for splits, then through the die.
Inspecting cases gets done as you are lubing and processing through this step. Good time to measure the cases for max length. If you want. I happen to like the Lee case trimmer, and use them with the cutter and mandrel in my lathe, but a drill press or other motorized rig makes it really fast to just run the whole batch through and see if the cases lose any trimmings. Same power tool gets used to run the deburring tool first inside, then outside. And the primer pocket cleaner. Really fast, and you can run hundreds of cases in an hours time. Repetitive hand motion, it goes really fast.
I use a Lee hand primer to prime. Because that's what I have, and it works.
A set of dippers, a powder funnel, and a scale, for measuring out your powder. Powder measuring and assembling the bullet to case, are the two step I would not interrupt. Dip a couple dozen loads onto the scale, to check your consistency. Then go to town on your cases in a loading block. I am too cheap to buy a dedicated loading block, so I use my MTM CaseGard ammo boxes. Messy when you put that double charge in ( It happens!) but whatever. Easy to look into all the case mouths, and compare the height of the charges, a double, if you are using a powder that will actually FIT a double charge, will stand out like a sore thumb.
If you do not want to use dippers, look at a Lyman 55 or similar powder measure. Quick, and pretty consistent. I like my dippers though. I don't try to wring the nuts out of my loads, either. I loaded with just dippers, for a couple(OK, nearly 20) years. I ate a lot of venison, and shot a LOT of gophers. They work.
Seating/crimping. The fiddly bit is setting the dies up. Once that is done, esp if you have your own dies and are not changing from one bullet to another often, they are pretty much just a matter of checking the first couple off the press, then, it's pretty rapid progress, pick up a charged case and put it in the shell holder, place a bullet on top of it, feed it into the die, go full stroke, rinse, and repeat.
My last reloading session was a bit over 500 rounds of .223 ammo, spread over a couple evenings. Maybe 3 1/2 hours total. Much of that time was me doddling around rather than really working at getting progress made.
Before I bought the Lee Classic Cast, I could pretty much fit my entire reloading kit into a lunchbox. And still have some room for consumables.
Cheers
Trev
If you want 500 rounds or more a progressive press is worthwhile depending on your budget. The 650 is too much. I've made several thousand 9mm Luger, .40s&w and .223 Rem on the Lee Loadmaster in the last year and it has been a producer. No issues. Hornaday LnL progressive is a beautiful machine for a small price increase. Dillon makes fabulous machinery but very expensive.
My return on investment was around the 3800 round mark for 9mm Luger. The total dollars spent to reach the pay off point was $1100. That was with a total fixed cost for equipment of $460 (press, scale, dies, accessories, etc). If you step into a D 650 you are looking at $1850 (mdgardner.com) all inclusive.
With that additional $1400 for a Dillon 650 and all the trimmings you need 16,000 rounds of 9x19 to break even. Total to break even of about $4900. A bit less if you don't have a case feeder and salvage some used stuff like tumbler.
Shooting 500 rounds a month? That's 32 months before you break even.
To calculate these values I'm using Atlantic Arms ammo at $41/100, bullets $0.12, Powder $0.03, brass free, primers $0.04 = $0.19 which is conservative.
You'll still want a single stage press or a turret, Lee Classic Cast is very good, but choose a colour you like.
My return on investment was around the 3800 round mark for 9mm Luger. The total dollars spent to reach the pay off point was $1100. That was with a total fixed cost for equipment of $460 (press, scale, dies, accessories, etc). If you step into a D 650 you are looking at $1850 (mdgardner.com) all inclusive.
With that additional $1400 for a Dillon 650 and all the trimmings you need 16,000 rounds of 9x19 to break even. Total to break even of about $4900. A bit less if you don't have a case feeder and salvage some used stuff like tumbler.
Shooting 500 rounds a month? That's 32 months before you break even.
To calculate these values I'm using Atlantic Arms ammo at $41/100, bullets $0.12, Powder $0.03, brass free, primers $0.04 = $0.19 which is conservative.
You'll still want a single stage press or a turret, Lee Classic Cast is very good, but choose a colour you like.
Based on even doubling those numbers on a per year basis I'd say that a dillon 550b outfit would be right up your alley. It's progressive so you can load the handgun ammo fairly rapidly. The press and accessories are more trouble free IME than the cheaper "red" brand. The price for the press and other gear is going to be well within your budget limit compared to the much more expensive 650. And finally the 550 is quite easily used as a single stage by simply removing the case retention buttons which gives you access to all the stations for individual use. The 650 can do that too but it takes more work to defeat the auto indexing which the 550 simply does not have.
If you are loading the .308 for basic plinking such as from an M14/M305 then you can run the 550 in progressive mode and likely as not keep it accurate enough. If this is more for serious target shooting you'll want to weigh out each charge. And that's where the 550b becomes so flexible. You can either remove the case retention buttons and use it in single stage mode or you could run it in progressive mode with a funnel on the powder through die instead of the powder measure and simply drop the powder in from the dish off the scale.
This sort of flexibility is why I find it easy to suggest the 550 in your case. It's progressive enough to be able to rapidly churn out lots of good handgun ammo during even a short window of time. With the right setup arrangement you can easily set it up, turn out a couple of hundred rounds and have it all put away in less than an hour. But it is also so easily adapted to using it in single stage mode when needed for however you want to load the rifle rounds.
Without rushing to any real degree I find that I can pretty easily reload 350 to 400 rounds per hour on my 550b. And this includes the time needed to pause every 100 rounds and pick up and transfer the primers. Changing conversion kits and even primer sizes is pretty easy. (there's a You Tube on how to switch primer sizes that involves only swapping the spring cup and which speeds things up MASSIVELY)
For cleaning I know that stainless pin tumbling is all the rage these days. But I'm getting such good results from simply using a basic ultrasonic cleaner that I don't have any need to opt for the more expensive SS pin method. As in on my rifle casings if I decap before cleaning they come out looking like they just came out brand new from the bag. I don't need them any cleaner than that. Clean enough is clean enough after all. Google for "ultrasonic rifle brass cleaning" and see the results for yourself. The 9mm and .45 ammo is cleaned with primers in place to save the time of decapping. It comes out shiny clean outside and mostly shiny clean inside with some still having a slight grey cast. And for handgun ammo that's more than clean enough. All this for less than 1/3 the cost of an SS tumbler setup. And best of all with the right cleaning solution I can clean gun parts if I want in my US cleaner. You can't do that in an SS tumbler setup unless you want to reblue each time...
Just DO NOT use the same vinegar and water mixture as for cleaning brass. Unless you really want to remove the blueing.I'm with BCRider, in also recommending the Dillon RL550b. I've been running one of these presses for better than 30 years now, and consider it exceptionally versatile and flexible. Not only for pistol ammo, but many rifle rounds, too. Though relatively expensive, these presses are very durable, easy to maintain and simple to operate. With regular maintenance, I've never had a single mechanical failure with mine. This, after loading an unknown number of pistol rounds on it. Plus, at least several thousand rifle cartridges, in various calibers.
A friend of mine runs a Hornady LNL progressive press, and likes it. I'd rate one of these as an excellent, longterm investment, too. Worth looking into. Right now, you could likely load all the quality ammo you need on a simple, single-stage press. As some have already noted. Also, it may seem like you really don't need all the reloading capacity that one of these progressives can deliver. But eventually, you will. Once the reloading addiction really takes hold. In any case, look at all your options, before making a final decision.
A friend of mine runs a Hornady LNL progressive press, and likes it. I'd rate one of these as an excellent, longterm investment, too. Worth looking into. Right now, you could likely load all the quality ammo you need on a simple, single-stage press. As some have already noted. Also, it may seem like you really don't need all the reloading capacity that one of these progressives can deliver. But eventually, you will. Once the reloading addiction really takes hold. In any case, look at all your options, before making a final decision.
A while back 2 buddies of mine and myself were talking about possibly doing this. Seems to me the big issue is maintenance cleanup and access. Where do you want to keep it? One of my buddies for example said we could keep it in his shop. So if I want to go to the range on any given Saturday, does that mean I can come over at will to load up any given Friday? Probably not right. Then what about when something breaks? Even if under warranty someone has to deal with sending it in etc. I wound up buying a middle of the road set up (Lee Loadmaster set up in 9mm) added additional dies and a turret to do 40 cal and plan on adding dies and turret for other calibers as I go. I have loaded 3000 9mm and 500 .40 since January so I think the press has paid for itself at least 2 times over by now. As far as rifle rounds, the press I have is supposed to be capable of loading up to 308, but I suspect it would be more worthwhile to load rifle cartridges on a single stage. For your situation given how much you are shooting, I would recommend starting on a single stage, yes 1500 rounds of 9mm is going to take ALOT longer than on a progressive, but your start up costs will be about $300 less so you will recoup your investment faster over all. Do your reloading in stages (deprime a batch, prime a batch, charge and seat a batch and crimp a batch in different sittings) to make the most of your time. I think you will find your investment will pay for itself, then you can look at something in a progressive to speed things up. If you find that reloading is not for you, you can still recoup your investment in hand loaded ammo, then re sell what you bough on EE for a good percentage of your initial investment. If you shoot enough and you enjoy reloading, it will be a good investment no matter how you look at it. If you don't enjoy reloading you can still recoup most of the cost in the end. All that being said a word of caution. When I started reloading, I found what they say is true. You don't really save money because you wind up shooting that much more. That being said in my opinion yes it is worth it.
In a perfect world sharing a press would be awesome. In reality I personally would find it frustrating. I like to have my equipment well tuned and set up as I like it for results that I expect. This involves time and effort. I don't find that everyone else has the same expectations. I prefer to suck up the expense and keep my equipment to myself. If I shared equipment I would be the guy who was adjusting and repairing it after others used it.
For the quantities that you are shooting, and sure reload and double the round count a single stage press will do the job and pump out great ammo. I reloaded many thousands of rounds on a single stage press. Working through the process in large batches allows you to move realtively quickly.
For the quantities that you are shooting, and sure reload and double the round count a single stage press will do the job and pump out great ammo. I reloaded many thousands of rounds on a single stage press. Working through the process in large batches allows you to move realtively quickly.
turbo_bird
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Kamloops, BC
I started with an RCBS Rockchucker kit that was something like $300 with taxes and shipping a few years ago. The only extras I needed were dies and components, and I was in business. I knew I was going to eventually start reloading, I always made sure to save my brass, even way before I bought a press. I loaded an awful lot of 45 acp and 357 mag on that Rockchucker before buying a progressive, and doing it in large batches made it go pretty decent. I'd have the press set up to size and deprime, and leave everything set up until all my brass of that caliber was done. I could run a few cases through every time I walked past the press. I used the hand primer from the kit to prime cases while watching TV, then did large batches again for expanding the mouths. The only time I really sat down for any time specifically to reload was when I was charging cases with powder and seating bullets, and I did that in 50 and 100 round batches with a loading block and powder thrower. With the cases all prepped I could easily have 100 rounds loaded in under 1 hour, including cleanup. I set up my dies so that I spin them in the press and give the lock ring a quick tighten with a wrench, and changing dies really doesn't take long then. A turret would speed things up by not having to handle the cases quite as much though. I spent more time setting up dies and figuring out loads than actually reloading, and that's no quicker with a progressive vs. a single stage.
Kristian
Kristian
@op; besides the trouble that lies ahead when things breaks down, imagine the time you would waste and agony every time you have to pick up the press/gear and re adjust it when you share or rent...
When you buy a used quality press (and other gear)at a decent price you won't have much depreciation so by the time you upgrade or decide reloading is not your thing you will recoup most of the investment. So you reach the break even point faster than you think.
Look around on EE, gunshows and lgs. It takes some time but deals are out there, just act quick if you see one. I'm on a tight budget (family, kids bla bla..) and bought (all used) a single stage Rock Chucker, a progressive Hornady Pro-Jector and a Hornady progressive 12ga shot shell reloader and paid in total about 500 for the 3 presses. They will last a lifetime and leaves enough budget for dies, scale, shell holders, brass prep tools, measuring tools etc.
Good luck with whatever you decide!
When you buy a used quality press (and other gear)at a decent price you won't have much depreciation so by the time you upgrade or decide reloading is not your thing you will recoup most of the investment. So you reach the break even point faster than you think.
Look around on EE, gunshows and lgs. It takes some time but deals are out there, just act quick if you see one. I'm on a tight budget (family, kids bla bla..) and bought (all used) a single stage Rock Chucker, a progressive Hornady Pro-Jector and a Hornady progressive 12ga shot shell reloader and paid in total about 500 for the 3 presses. They will last a lifetime and leaves enough budget for dies, scale, shell holders, brass prep tools, measuring tools etc.
Good luck with whatever you decide!
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- Location
- West Quebec
^^^ Good move I'd recommend a Forster C0-Axe if you have plans for accuracy rifle shooting as well
- Location
- S.E, Saskatchewan
Hey guys, I have a similar situation . I don't want to hijack the O.P, but figured instead of starting a new thread I could get some insight. A little bit of history, I have been reloading for roughly 12 years.At my previous acerage I had a light smithing and reloading garage set up. ( extremely high end set up ). 7 Years ago a devastating flood came through the valley ( as in 14 feet of water moving at 900 Cubes per minute) and wiped the acerage, shop , house . All I was able to salvage was the powders, bullets, dies and primers. Everything else was swept out and gone. ( Keep in mind, no flood insurance) . Long story short I have since purchased another acerage, spent the time and money to set up a 500 yard range with iron and paper targets with a shack etc. I have now started to reno another garage for my light smithing and future re-loading. about a month ago I decided I had licked my wounds enough and get back into re-loading. So out comes the wallet, more reno's , keypad access lock on the door, signage and pricing of presses, kits, the whole deal. There are several gentleman that enjoy coming out and using the range with me. I don't mind that , as it is always nice to have others to shoot with and keep people active in this hobbie. However... They caught wind I was getting back into re-loading and wanted to do the same. "go in on the press and equipment" . They have never re-loaded before and wanted to "learn" . All my new toys came in ,I set up the shop and away I go. I have not seen any $$ towards this. I re-did my round development for my .308 and .338 LM . So here is where it gets sticky.. They gentleman come on out, and I was just finishing up a batch of 50 for my .308. They then asked about there .308s. Naturally I told them we need to do a little bit of round development for them, as they wanted to use 168 grn . ( that I previously had and are tucked away). So I roll up 5 rounds at a time, walk back to the range, throw em down and adjust as necessary to 20 rounds in total and a good grouping. About 4 hours of time, again it was fun.. but.. we come back to the shop, and they are looking through what I have, powders, projectiles etc. And the prices on this stuff is extremely cheap , as some of it is older than I am . Now they figure they can just buy the projectiles at that price, and in there mind they have already previously supplied the brass, ( I have been collecting out of my range shack for the last few years). And just want me to roll them and they will come "HELP" . My answer was simple.. we need to figure out something for $$ here guys.
My problem is this, 1: I havn't seen any $$ go towards this set up
2: I will not be able to re-supply my stock for those prices
3: even if they did now want to spend the $$ and go in on the equipment side, I don't really want to many people having access to my shop, as I do have children , if someone forgets to lock the door etc . Could just cause to much headache for me. As well as the broken equipment, trying to keep track of who's is who's.
So, This morning I get to thinking, what if I was to roll them and just sell them to them by the box? Do I charge per round?
Only reason I am doing this is to try and get a little $$ back to put towards more equipment or the range, otherwise I wouldn't bother.
I know this is long winded, But thanks for any opinions or any other ideas!!!!!!!
My problem is this, 1: I havn't seen any $$ go towards this set up
2: I will not be able to re-supply my stock for those prices
3: even if they did now want to spend the $$ and go in on the equipment side, I don't really want to many people having access to my shop, as I do have children , if someone forgets to lock the door etc . Could just cause to much headache for me. As well as the broken equipment, trying to keep track of who's is who's.
So, This morning I get to thinking, what if I was to roll them and just sell them to them by the box? Do I charge per round?
Only reason I am doing this is to try and get a little $$ back to put towards more equipment or the range, otherwise I wouldn't bother.
I know this is long winded, But thanks for any opinions or any other ideas!!!!!!!
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You can't sell your reloads legally without the proper permits from the gov.
If you're going to do it as a "favour", have them supply all the components at their cost.
If they're cheap bastards the who just want to take advantage of you you're better off not doing it. Tell them to buy their own gear and help them set it up at their homes.
If you're going to do it as a "favour", have them supply all the components at their cost.
If they're cheap bastards the who just want to take advantage of you you're better off not doing it. Tell them to buy their own gear and help them set it up at their homes.
- Location
- S.E, Saskatchewan
Ya, that's what I figured! Never had to consider selling before, always just rolled for me. Thx !
