Optics of the winning F-TR rifles at the Canadian Nationals are interesting...

kombayotch

kombayotch

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http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2016/08/chou-brothers-top-f-tr-field-at-canadian-championships/

Scopes are a NF NXS 5-22x56mm and a March Tactical 2.5-25x52mm. Both have 1/4 MOA clicks IIRC.

How many times have people started threads on here proposing using similar set-ups and been told that they would not be competitive? That you must have super high magnification scope with fine 1/8 MOA turrets in order to be successful at long range shooting? Yet here we have scores as high as the F-Open ones and V counts 50% higher than the rest of the pack.

Great guys! Awesome win! ...and some myth busting to boot!
 
Kris - thanks for sharing. I am often one of the "need highest power 1/8th clicks" crowd and quite clearly proven wrong here which just goes to show that it is often if not always down to the shooter not the gear.

What is even more personally shocking is that I am now converting over to the FFP Mil/Mil scopes - proving old dogs can learn new tricks :)
 
Someone that knows please kindly tell me this:

There are far too many people saying that 5-25 is more than enough for me to not listen, but is it not easier to lay the crosshairs on a target that's twice the size when you have 50x, or even 80x like the big March?? I understand that mirage is worse, FOV is worse, etc, but when you're hunkered down on bags or a rest, who cares? For PRS comp or real world use, I understand the why 50x is bad, but it you're trying to ring a gong at 2000yds????
 
Their shooting, demeanor and sportsmanship are all at an "Olympic" level.

With the Soup we were shooting through, 24X was plenty... many were down to 18X

But if the conditions allow, more mag can be very helpful. I was between 20X and 35X through the week.

Note the use of a mirage modifier disk...... I don't think many ranges or many non local shooters have shot in this level of muck....

Jerry
 
Gunneegoogoo said:
Someone that knows please kindly tell me this:

There are far too many people saying that 5-25 is more than enough for me to not listen, but is it not easier to lay the crosshairs on a target that's twice the size when you have 50x, or even 80x like the big March?? I understand that mirage is worse, FOV is worse, etc, but when you're hunkered down on bags or a rest, who cares? For PRS comp or real world use, I understand the why 50x is bad, but it you're trying to ring a gong at 2000yds????
Click to expand...

GGG, when mirage was at it heaviest, you don't aim at the center... you can't see it.

You turn down the mag until the reticle hash marks subtend the Black Circle that is the 2 ring (44" circle) and you bracket this very large circle. You are literally centering the great big black wobbly blob much like an aperture sight. For my scope it was 20X (Sightron LRMOA reticle), others it was 18X or there abouts. Connaught has alot of humidity so this type of muck is very common.. so common, some adapt to bracket the big black blob and dial the scope to center impacts.

Trying to actually pick the center in these conditions could easily give you a 1/2 to 1 min aiming error.... pretty much pointless.

BUT then the conditions cleared and you could see ring lines... many shooter would crank up mag then.

Different range, different conditions, different scope set ups....

The Chous skill is truly in their amazing wind reading and how that allows them to attack the conditions. Being coached by them is one of shootings greatest experiences.

Great guys too....

Jerry
 
Great information and explanation.
Thanks for taking the time to put this out there.
I have long struggled with mirage and trying to read it.
I have read on reading wind speed buy mirage angle with zero success.
I could get my spotting scope to pick up the air flow, but it always shows up to me as straight across.
I knew the wind was gusting and going from almost nothing to close to 10mph as per my wind meter.
I just could not "see" it down range where it really mattered.
Suggestions?
SRSA311
 
Mystic Precision said:
GGG, when mirage was at it heaviest, you don't aim at the center... you can't see it.

You turn down the mag until the reticle hash marks subtend the Black Circle that is the 2 ring (44" circle) and you bracket this very large circle. You are literally centering the great big black wobbly blob much like an aperture sight. For my scope it was 20X (Sightron LRMOA reticle), others it was 18X or there abouts. Connaught has alot of humidity so this type of muck is very common.. so common, some adapt to bracket the big black blob and dial the scope to center impacts.

Trying to actually pick the center in these conditions could easily give you a 1/2 to 1 min aiming error.... pretty much pointless.

BUT then the conditions cleared and you could see ring lines... many shooter would crank up mag then.

Different range, different conditions, different scope set ups....

The Chous skill is truly in their amazing wind reading and how that allows them to attack the conditions. Being coached by them is one of shootings greatest experiences.

Great guys too....

Jerry
Click to expand...

I never heard of the mirage disk. Have you tried one out?
 
Tomochan said:
Kris - thanks for sharing. I am often one of the "need highest power 1/8th clicks" crowd and quite clearly proven wrong here which just goes to show that it is often if not always down to the shooter not the gear.

What is even more personally shocking is that I am now converting over to the FFP Mil/Mil scopes - proving old dogs can learn new tricks :)
Click to expand...

Its definitely more the Indian than the arrow. The barrel profile is also interesting.

Nice! Hopefully it is working for you. I think you will find it very advantageous if you get into the PRS game.
 
Mystic Precision said:
GGG, when mirage was at it heaviest, you don't aim at the center... you can't see it.

You turn down the mag until the reticle hash marks subtend the Black Circle that is the 2 ring (44" circle) and you bracket this very large circle. You are literally centering the great big black wobbly blob much like an aperture sight. For my scope it was 20X (Sightron LRMOA reticle), others it was 18X or there abouts. Connaught has alot of humidity so this type of muck is very common.. so common, some adapt to bracket the big black blob and dial the scope to center impacts.

Trying to actually pick the center in these conditions could easily give you a 1/2 to 1 min aiming error.... pretty much pointless.

BUT then the conditions cleared and you could see ring lines... many shooter would crank up mag then.

Different range, different conditions, different scope set ups....

The Chous skill is truly in their amazing wind reading and how that allows them to attack the conditions. Being coached by them is one of shootings greatest experiences.

Great guys too....

Jerry
Click to expand...

I wish like hell I coulda got to nokomis.....good intentions.....
 
With interest, I can get more of these mirage modifier disks. I shot with the maker in the US... very good shooter.

If you can, get to these matches... more coming up in your area. Even if you shoot 1 day of the match, you will see, meet and experience alot.

The SK shooters I met on the Cdn Team are excellent shooters and great guys. Ask for help and you will get maybe more then you can absorb.

Jerry
 
Mystic Precision said:
With interest, I can get more of these mirage modifier disks. I shot with the maker in the US... very good shooter.

If you can, get to these matches... more coming up in your area. Even if you shoot 1 day of the match, you will see, meet and experience alot.

The SK shooters I met on the Cdn Team are excellent shooters and great guys. Ask for help and you will get maybe more then you can absorb.

Jerry
Click to expand...

Hey Jerry - I have a Sightron 10-50 and saw on their website that the disk fits it. You could put me down for one.
 
Mystic Precision said:
With interest, I can get more of these mirage modifier disks. I shot with the maker in the US... very good shooter.

If you can, get to these matches... more coming up in your area. Even if you shoot 1 day of the match, you will see, meet and experience alot.

The SK shooters I met on the Cdn Team are excellent shooters and great guys. Ask for help and you will get maybe more then you can absorb.

Jerry
Click to expand...

I'm gonna try for the sept meet. Will depend on baby.
 
I emailed Chou brothers about the mirage modifier disk. He said the light transmission is reduced through the scope and appeared the target a bit darker.

I told him about the Neutral Density (ND) or Polarizer filter to reduce the amount of light enter the scope. It could work well also.
 
MikeinCalgary said:
Hey Jerry - I have a Sightron 10-50 and saw on their website that the disk fits it. You could put me down for one.
Click to expand...

Send me a PM or email as I am building an order file to do a bulk order

No Fear, we had a great chat about all sorts of camera filters - one of the shooters does photography as a hobby. The Chous have already tried a variety with varying/less excellent results. Problem for some filters is the POI shift - they work by bending the light which is fine until you want to aim at it and it is not really where you think :)

This is by FAR the worst range I have ever shot on for mirage/Soup. Buy anything to help your aim is important. Just remember to have something that still lets you see the mirage... it is important.

Jerry
 
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