APC223-SA Final specifications - place your order now.

Interested to see what the weight of the 308 comes in at (in a year or so). The APC223 looks very nice, only budget issues keep me from looking in to the pre-order more seriously.
 
monahov said:
Mr. Wolverine,

The only obstacle preventing me from placing the order is the barrel. I might be in minority, but ideal configuration for me would be using the original B&T barrel specification but in non-restricted length. That would be cold hammer forged barrel with the 1 in 7 twist. I'm aware of pros and cons, but I also believe, that B&T engineers put a lot of thought into their original barrel decision. Here is what the APC 223 PDF on their website says: “The hammer forged barrel is designed for optimal transitional ballistics and long barrel life. This 1 in 7'' twist rate is the best all-around for many different loads and bullet weights.” Those may be just nice words common in promotional materials, but I actually like long life expectancy of cold hammer forged barrels – I want it to last for ages. Many might find it economically unreasonable, but I like playing with heavier 75 or 77 grain ammo and want the barrel to have optimal performance with those heavier bullets – it's a technological hobby. I also like keeping my toys according to their original design specification as much as it is possible in our Canadian context – I believe many of us have that collector's interest, especially when it applies to expensive hi-end products.

As I mentioned, I realize, that I might be in minority, but I believe I'm not the only one. Since this magical number of 20 came up recently, it would be really interesting to estimate if there is enough interest for such configuration, if it's feasible. Maybe we could run a poll?

I realize, that it might take longer than the already confirmed configuration with the 1 in 9 twist. But I would be still willing to wait another 6 months for another batch with non-restricted barrels of original specification and would gladly place an order if such configuration is confirmed.

I apologize if I'm making it overly complicated and thank you for making this huge effort to bring this rifle to Canada!
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Ok, I have some answers for you. We can order the APC223-SA with a 477 mm hammer forged Loather Walther barrel with a 1:7 twist. We would be looking at a 4 to 5 month wait from when we place an order and we have to place an order for a minimum of 30. These will be at the regular price of $3,900.00 based on our current exchange rate. Our first order (ETA Late Jan) is only just over half sold so we would not be placing another order for a few months, based on customer feedback the second order could be with the 1:7 twist.


I have ordered enough of the stock adapters (Accept an AR15 buffer tube) to allow one for each of the first shipment, these will be available as an optional extra and should be delivered with the rifles.
 
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Mr Wolverine said:
Ok, I have some answers for you. We can order the APC223-SA with a 477 mm hammer forged Loather Walther barrel with a 1:7 twist. We would be looking at a 4 to 5 month wait from when we place an order and we have to place an order for a minimum of 30. These will be at the regular price of $3,900.00 based on our current exchange rate. Our first order (ETA Late Jan) is only just over half sold so we would not be placing another order for a few months, based on customer feedback the second order could be with the 1:7 twist.


I have ordered enough of the stock adapters (Accept an AR15 buffer tube) to allow one for each of the first shipment, these will be available as an optional extra and should be delivered with the rifles.
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These are wonderful news!
Thank you for looking into the 1 in 7 twist hammer forged option, Mr. Wolverine!
I will be waiting with impatience for the second pre-order to start.
 
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Mr Wolverine said:
Ok, I have some answers for you. We can order the APC223-SA with a 477 mm hammer forged Loather Walther barrel with a 1:7 twist. We would be looking at a 4 to 5 month wait from when we place an order and we have to place an order for a minimum of 30. These will be at the regular price of $3,900.00 based on our current exchange rate. Our first order (ETA Late Jan) is only just over half sold so we would not be placing another order for a few months, based on customer feedback the second order could be with the 1:7 twist.


I have ordered enough of the stock adapters (Accept an AR15 buffer tube) to allow one for each of the first shipment, these will be available as an optional extra and should be delivered with the rifles.
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Did I read that right!?!?!

We should be expecting our NR APC223 December??
 
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1:8 would have been perfect IMO, but a 1:9 should still stabilize a 69 grain matchking so no big deal.

Thank you John for making the effort and bringing in those AR stock adapters. I'm probably going to stick with the factory stock and make it work, but if I can't it's nice to have an alternative.

One question, when B&T refer to the front pin as a "fixed bolt" does that simply mean it's captive or will we not be able to completely separate the upper and lower? If it's the latter is that how all APC 223s come out of the factory or is it specific to us?
 
Shabazz said:
1:8 would have been perfect IMO, but a 1:9 should still stabilize a 69 grain matchking so no big deal.

Thank you John for making the effort and bringing in those AR stock adapters. I'm probably going to stick with the factory stock and make it work, but if I can't it's nice to have an alternative.

One question, when B&T refer to the front pin as a "fixed bolt" does that simply mean it's captive or will we not be able to completely separate the upper and lower? If it's the latter is that how all APC 223s come out of the factory or is it specific to us?
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The fixed pivot pin is manufactured as two parts and then pressed together when the rifle is manufactured so that it can not be removed. This is one of the detailed changes that were made in order to salsify the RCMP SFSS due to the fact that there is a select fire version of this rifle. There are many other subtle changes so parts would not interchange between the select fire and the semi auto version.
 
To clarify

The first order of non restricted APC223-SA with 1:9 twist was placed a while ago, just over half are sold, these are at the special price of $3,600.00 ETA late Jan

The second order has not been placed yet, these could be 1;7 twist but I have to order a minimum of 30 units, ETA is 4 to 5 months from when I place the order
 
Mr Wolverine said:
The fixed pivot pin is manufactured as two parts and then pressed together when the rifle is manufactured so that it can not be removed. This is one of the detailed changes that were made in order to salsify the RCMP SFSS due to the fact that there is a select fire version of this rifle. There are many other subtle changes so parts would not interchange between the select fire and the semi auto version.
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Wow... you and B&T should get a medal for having to accommodate those people. I'm surprised B&T even took the time for our market but I'm glad they did.
 
Shabazz said:
Wow... you and B&T should get a medal for having to accommodate those people. I'm surprised B&T even took the time for our market but I'm glad they did.
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We submitted the first APC to the RCMP on 12 Dec 2011. We are on the forth generation now, the service and support we get from Karl Brugger is superb, he really works with us to manufacture products to meet Canadian standards. I really wish we could sell more, as B&T really earns our support. The long time delays to have firearms classified have cost us millions of dollars in lost sales.
 
Mr Wolverine said:
The fixed pivot pin is manufactured as two parts and then pressed together when the rifle is manufactured so that it can not be removed. This is one of the detailed changes that were made in order to salsify the RCMP SFSS due to the fact that there is a select fire version of this rifle. There are many other subtle changes so parts would not interchange between the select fire and the semi auto version.
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now i will have to figure out a way to unfix the fixed pivot pin - it's a good thing i like to tinker...
 
John

I know this isn't the right threar for it & I'm not trying to derail BUT

considering how B&T has done all these changes that satisfy the RCMP to the APC line up, I'm assuming now then that the APC9 should be good to go soon????
 
bfiles said:
John

I know this isn't the right threar for it & I'm not trying to derail BUT

considering how B&T has done all these changes that satisfy the RCMP to the APC line up, I'm assuming now then that the APC9 should be good to go soon????
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I think that is a pretty safe bet, but as the receivers are different we had to supply additional data. We should be good for the APC in ,223, .300, 9mm, and .45ACP in both restricted and non restricted versions. My only problem maybe minimum order quantities of the non restricted version due to the special order barrels.
 
Mr Wolverine said:
To clarify

The first order of non restricted APC223-SA with 1:9 twist was placed a while ago, just over half are sold, these are at the special price of $3,600.00 ETA late Jan

The second order has not been placed yet, these could be 1;7 twist but I have to order a minimum of 30 units, ETA is 4 to 5 months from when I place the order
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1:7 twist? Count me in.....29 more eh?
 
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