Zastava Stainless Mauser-98

medvedqc said:
Greg,

is the barrel for the 7x64 a Delcourt one?

Phil
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I have never seen details listed on the barrels for these rifles Phil... all I know is that Ruger was contracted to build a run of them in 1999 for a Eurpoean vendor, and most of the rifles never shipped and stayed on this side of the pond. I have read conflicting reports on the numbers, apparently 350 were ordered, but by most accounts only 172 were actually built.
 
Interesting, yet I do not see a lot of manufacturers specifying what type of stainless they are using.
(http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?141291-Stainless-Steel-Barrels-410-vs-416-vs-416R)



Hitzy said:
Sigh.... I guess your Google is broken.

So yes, the 416 they use is lower grade then Crucible Steel 416R, on top of that they probably only use 416 for the barrel/receiver/and maybe the bolt, and a lower grade for the guts, trigger guard, etc.
Take it however you want...but standard grade 416 is not the most stain resistant or the most cold friendly SS that can be used.
A Ceracote treated 4140 rifle will withstand far more foul weather abuse then 416 ever will. Just the way it is.
And some more reading....
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Well, I don't want to be involved in an argumental cat fight, but;

Crucible Steel is just one manufacturer of SS barrel steel, and the steel they are offering is just another marketed name for one grade of steel. There are others, like OutoKumpo which is one large worldwide supplier of SS barrel blanks, and they also have their own "special stainless steel" names such as 416RQ, 416FQ and 17-4.

Sulphur in SS does not help against rust but a lower level helps getting rid of "red-short" which usually makes the steel brittle when worked at red-hot temperature. The smelters usuually compensate the sulphur content by adding manganese but that's another story.
The rust occurs because the coating is somewhat porous, but it does not mean the steel isn't good. As for machining, the 400 series is not so easy to machine, and no manufacturer of SS rifles is exempted from machining flaws (see the Winchester ones...) .

AFAIK no one ever said that the Zastava SS rifles (and even any other of their products) are the best and well produced, but for the price, they are hard to beat. And it' easy to compare two similar products one being over twice the price of the other, but to me it's somewhat pointless as there are obvious (anyways, it should) reasons why one is priced how it is...
And honestly, myself, I bought a Zastava SS to be a beater rifle, and I still have to hear about one failed SS barrel - maybe there are somewhere, but I never heard of them.
 
No, not many production gun makers will say what grade of SS they use, but as Baribal stated you can almost guarantee it's plain old 416. Lothar Walther has a proprietary SS they use that is supposed to solve the problems, higher grade custom or semi custom production will use a higher grade SS.
Back in 2004-05 SAKO f'ed up and released a bunch of Sako/Tikka rifles with brittle SS barrels that they claim were proofed but blowing up on owners with first shots fired.
https://www.shootersforum.com/rifles-rifle-cartridges/17304-sako-recall-barrel-defect.html
Makes me wonder what they used in the Ranger rifles and if they will be OK for the North.
 
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hoytcanon said:
I have never seen details listed on the barrels for these rifles Phil... all I know is that Ruger was contracted to build a run of them in 1999 for a Eurpoean vendor, and most of the rifles never shipped and stayed on this side of the pond. I have read conflicting reports on the numbers, apparently 350 were ordered, but by most accounts only 172 were actually built.
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not a problem if you heard about one in 8x68s that should the barrel made from ... the 7x64 were made because Humbert french importer asked for it but i do not know if they even ended in France do not know about the other details.
 
Hitzy said:
No, not many production gun makers will say what grade of SS they use, but as Baribal stated you can almost guarantee it's plain old 416. Lothar Wslther has a proprietary SS they use that is supposed to solve the problems, higher grade custom or semi custom production will use a higher grade SS.
Back in 2004-05 SAKO f'ed up and released a bunch of Sako/Tikka rifles with brittle SS barrels that they claim were proofed but blowing up on owners with first shots fired.
https://www.shootersforum.com/rifles-rifle-cartridges/17304-sako-recall-barrel-defect.html
Makes me wonder what they used in the Ranger rifles and if they will be OK for the North.
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wait two years and you will get an answer do not think the tikka lovers will like it ....
 
Baribal said:
Well, I don't want to be involved in an argumental cat fight, but;

Crucible Steel is just one manufacturer of SS barrel steel, and the steel they are offering is just another marketed name for one grade of steel. There are others, like OutoKumpo which is one large worldwide supplier of SS barrel blanks, and they also have their own "special stainless steel" names such as 416RQ, 416FQ and 17-4.

Sulphur in SS does not help against rust but a lower level helps getting rid of "red-short" which usually makes the steel brittle when worked at red-hot temperature. The smelters usuually compensate the sulphur content by adding manganese but that's another story.
The rust occurs because the coating is somewhat porous, but it does not mean the steel isn't good. As for machining, the 400 series is not so easy to machine, and no manufacturer of SS rifles is exempted from machining flaws (see the Winchester ones...) .

AFAIK no one ever said that the Zastava SS rifles (and even any other of their products) are the best and well produced, but for the price, they are hard to beat. And it' easy to compare two similar products one being over twice the price of the other, but to me it's somewhat pointless as there are obvious (anyways, it should) reasons why one is priced how it is...
And honestly, myself, I bought a Zastava SS to be a beater rifle, and I still have to hear about one failed SS barrel - maybe there are somewhere, but I never heard of them.
Click to expand...

indeed finding a commercial mauser in stainless good luck, will it be even the serbs that did that one lol, one should be a fool to not have one ... when it will be over, it will be ....

i really like the one i found in 9.3x62 for my wife ...
 
Hitzy said:
No, not many production gun makers will say what grade of SS they use, but as Baribal stated you can almost guarantee it's plain old 416. Lothar Wslther has a proprietary SS they use that is supposed to solve the problems, higher grade custom or semi custom production will use a higher grade SS.
Back in 2004-05 SAKO f'ed up and released a bunch of Sako/Tikka rifles with brittle SS barrels that they claim were proofed but blowing up on owners with first shots fired.
https://www.shootersforum.com/rifles-rifle-cartridges/17304-sako-recall-barrel-defect.html
Makes me wonder what they used in the Ranger rifles and if they will be OK for the North.
Click to expand...

AFAIK, the Sako/Tikka thing was about steel Phosphopus and maybe Sulphur contamination, not really "steel quality" but rather a lack of QC from the smelter... and anyways, even for the purest SS 416 steel we would not talk about "quality" but "Grade".
As for if there are "good or bad" SS 416, yes there are, but since we can't really know what the material really is as per they are all using "brand names" for their steel claiming it's the best thing earth have ever seen.... I personally would not get into that kind of extrapolation... and I am sure that a company like Sako have ordered the right product... that's not a "all white, all black" thing...
 
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https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/939361-Zastava-stainless-7x64-Brenneke

https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/for...r-than-expected-velocity-from-a-7x64-Brenneke

https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/994847-Zastava-stainless-7x64-gets-a-buck

https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/1009571-Zastava-stainless-M70-bedding-issue

A lot of the pictures are gone from these threads but basically it's been super reliable and shoots easy 1.5" groups or less with little load development. Probably could do better but that's good enough for me. My only complaint with it is still the side safety and eventually I will do a 3 position conversion to it. At one time one of the makers was offering a stainless shroud and safety conversion but I don't think they are any more. I'll have to look into it again.
 
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hoytcanon said:
Pretty crappy excuse there... I have 7X57, 7mm RM, .280, .284 and still bought an M77-RS MKII 7X64... smiley face, winky face....
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I hate to say it but you convinced me to grab one of the 7X64 stainless models. They do seem to be getting scarce and Gagnon's had 2 left on sale for $599 which seemed like a good price. The plastic stock isn't too bad either, tag says it was made in 2013. Researching the 7x64 and it seems to be a pretty cool cartridge...looks like I'll have to dump my 7-08 Savage though, but I never really liked it anyway lol.
 
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Rob said:
Anyone have experience with the 7x64? I notice that Tradeex still has a couple of stainless Zastavas left...but they are in 7x64 and I have never used it.

Using a slightly odd European caliber, no matter how effective, sort of cuts into the concept of a very reliable, go anywhere, do anything rifle....I'd say that type of rifle calls for a standard caliber that you can pick up anywhere if you have to...

Still...if they really aren't going to be importing any more of them...might be a good idea to pick up another one...or two.
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I have one in 7x64, & 7x57. Nice rifle. Good accuracy. I don't have a problem with Zastava. I agree it's not a CZ or M70 CRF in slickness but so what. I want a rifle I can hunt with no matter what some bonehead know-it-all's say.
Back in WWII the German army had considered the 7x64 as the calibre of choice for their sniper teams if I'm remembering my history correctly. It came down to KISS. Since everyone used the 8mm round for the most part they decided not to change it
 
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