Ontario deer hunters.

dutchhunter said:
The controlled hunt is ment to controll the number of hunters. If a guy wants to bow hunt why can he not buy a bow seal . separate from the controlled hunt tag.
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No the controlled hunt tag is merely a validation tag that allows you to participate in the controlled hunting season you selected. It is not a second tag. That is how it was explained to me by the Aylmer district MNR. You may only get another tag if there are additional seals available in your wmu or if you are a landowner in certain wmu's!
 
Right it controls the number of people that can hunt in the controlled hunt
You still have to buy your deer lic
 
dutchhunter said:
We already have to put in to a draw for archery doe tags so why not have a separate license for archery
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This has been explained to you. You can only harvest ONE deer per season. So if your wish came true, and there was an archery only license, then there would have to be a system to prevent you from buying a controlled license and associated seal. That system wouls need operate in real time, for example at Canadian Tire where licenses are sold. Could you imagine how much this database might cost?

So think about all that has been said as you are still asking the same question and it really does not make sense.
 
dutchhunter said:
We already have to put in to a draw for archery doe tags so why not have a separate license for archery
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We don't do this because the harvest is calculated together from both gun and bow success rates. The antlerless harvest is one number for the wmu. They divide it up with archery success rates and average hunter success rates for the 2 controlled gun seasons. (How they get accurate data on those success rates and qty's of does vs bucks in the harvest is a mystery to me?) after that if they believe they have and excessive amount of deer in a wmu they add additional seals ( again no idea where this number comes from?)
This is just a guess but i think they just use previous historical harvest data, hunter success rates ? Which IMO they just don't collect enough data on for it to be current or accurate.
 
You guys know that we few years ago we could buy up to 7 seals in one year. I understand that northern areas do not have the same numbers as southern Ontario crop land .so say 30 percent of deer hunters bow hunt .say 75 percent of bow hunters fill there tag. These numbers will not have a negative impact on over all deer numbers. Bow hunters in southern Ontario tend to hunt property that is very close to urban areas were gun hunting can be frond on or not allowed at all.
 
dutchhunter said:
You guys know that we few years ago we could buy up to 7 seals in one year. I understand that northern areas do not have the same numbers as southern Ontario crop land .so say 30 percent of deer hunters bow hunt .say 75 percent of bow hunters fill there tag. These numbers will not have a negative impact on over all deer numbers. Bow hunters in southern Ontario tend to hunt property that is very close to urban areas were gun hunting can be frond on or not allowed at all.
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And then the deer numbers tanked and now we can only have one tag. Why is this so hard for you to understand?
Do you think you should be treated special because you burned your tag early? You get ONE tag, fill it how you want but don't cry when your season is done early.
 
cdn1canhunt said:
No the controlled hunt tag is merely a validation tag that allows you to participate in the controlled hunting season you selected. It is not a second tag. That is how it was explained to me by the Aylmer district MNR. You may only get another tag if there are additional seals available in your wmu or if you are a landowner in certain wmu's!
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This is correct. The way my friend and I does it is like this, we go out for the regular gun season, if we can we'll shoot and seal 2 deer. We go out on the controlled hunt with my wife. We party hunt with her seal. And hopefully get 1 deer. We have 3 seals in total to use.
 
I hunt under a farmers tag.and filled my tag last week.i am just discussing the system and how it can be changed in the future to better manage the deer in areas in southern Ontario were there are lots of deer.we already draw for archery doe tags so the numbers would not be that much different with a separate bowl tag
 
Dutch
I agree there are more deer in SW Ontario than the MNR has a clue. Instead of extra tags they have increased hunter numbers in the controlled hunts to the determent of safety I will add. Spring turkey season is looking to be the same sh22t show. I know for a fact in 92B in 2014 tags for 3 hunts were in the neighbourhood of 1100. 2015, 2200 tags for 3 hunts. 2016 my requests to the MNR for numbers is 6 weeks old but I heard in 92C they let out 3600 tags for 3 hunts. Usually for the last 25 years tags for 3 hunts in 92C have never been over 11-1200.

It boils down to if you have extra tags you as a hunter will not spend any more $$$, other than tag fees, so you are not stimulating the economy. Get a bunch of folks from Windsor and Toronto come out to Rural SW Ontario and they spend $$$. The local motel that sits empty most of the year is now standing room only for out of towners on the controlled hunt weeks.

I talked to a lot of local guys in 93 this past week that this was the first time they have seen a tag in 5-6 years and not just one but entire groups of 10 or more. The local boys spent most of their week running out of towners out of the bushes they had no business in. One local group invited 4 work collegues from Windsor, dogged all day for them as they did not know the lay of the land, the invitees shot 3 deer and at days end loaded up all the deer and headed home, leaving the locals with more than a bad taste in their mouth. Needless to say they won't be invited back but they have made clear they will be hunting next year. Wonder if it will be where they were shown such a great time but without permission.

It boils down to the MNR has lost sight of any management practices and have been told to generate as much licence money as possible at the expense of a controlled hunt system that has worked since 1972. The money they have lost on the moose hunt has to be made up somewhere so throw open southern deer and turkey with way to many bodies in limited hunting areas and lets see the reaction when someone ends up shot .
 
dutchhunter said:
I hunt under a farmers tag.and filled my tag last week.i am just discussing the system and how it can be changed in the future to better manage the deer in areas in southern Ontario were there are lots of deer.we already draw for archery doe tags so the numbers would not be that much different with a separate bowl tag
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There is nothing wrong with the system. They offer additional tags if deer populations are too high and reduce tags if deer populations are low.


Therefore, under the current system you would be able to harvest deer with both a firearm and bow during years when additional tags are offered. You simply need to apply for both hunts and purchase additional tag(s) during the years when additional tags are offered. During years when no additional tags are offered in your area it's up to you how you harvest your one deer for the season.
 
As indicated previously they are not issueing extra tags. They are increasing hunter numbers in areas that do not have the land for the number of hunters. In the first week we had no less than 8 people that were asked to leave a farm where we have sole permission in 3 days of hunting. One clown had even cut holes in the sides of a steel drive shed(he assumed was abandoned) and lined the holes with pipe insulation to not scratch his gun. and sit inside out of the weather. When cornered he said he was coyote hunting - when asked why he was using a muzzleloader he suddenly couldn't understand or speak English. PD and MNR were no shows on that one and I doubt this guy even had a tag to start with.

If you choose to take the MNR koolaid feel free on the subject of extra tags but we were able to fill 10-12 tags between 5-6 guys by Thursday in the years we have extra tags. What has changed in population when we are tagged out with 6 by Wednesday at daylight and we all passed deer the first two days. Oh that's right the other 8 guys we ran off filled those tags by trespassing. Wynne wants you to buy a licence and piss off rural Ontario even more.
 
hunter148 said:
Simply because our MNR is underfunded. The current government has robbed 70 million from the MNR portfolio to balance budgets of other departments. MNR was asked fro $12000 to get an accurate deer count in Middlesex County and the request was denied due to lack of funds BUT the MNR increased tags in the controlled hunts in that area by 300% so that their are hunter everywhere and usually where they don't have permission and this is pissing landowners off bad. Most biologists in Peterborough don't even own a pair of boots but are making decisions based on sunshine and butter flies perhaps and of course US based studies. Shall I go on!!

Other than the fact the MNR as it is could not organize a piss up at the Legion. That and the general state of Ontario government in all capacities. Now I have to stop cause I am depressing myself LOL
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When I used to trap, there was an optional game form to fill out. The answers to the questions were used for stats, and determining bag limits etc. I always chose to fill in the forms, and accurately as possible. Actually it's a good idea, as trappers spend more time than most over large areas observing furbearers foremost, but are a wealth of knowledge more so than a biologist, in observing wildlife population changes.

With such data collection, licenses shouldn't cost so much... even farmers license. I do like the management of wildlife being sustainable... to bad more management and penalty wasn't imposed on the mis-managers who have no interest in this except public perception and the revenue.
 
dutchhunter said:
I hunt under a farmers tag.and filled my tag last week.i am just discussing the system and how it can be changed in the future to better manage the deer in areas in southern Ontario were there are lots of deer.we already draw for archery doe tags so the numbers would not be that much different with a separate bowl tag
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Dutch my thoughts are this.... due to the fact they you can only get one deer seal unless additional seals are available why not manage your hunting goals? Eg. Apply for your archery antlerless tag but up until the first shotgun season just hunt for a mature buck when I say mature try 4.5-5.5 yrs old or at least the largest deer know in you area either through scouting or trail cam pics. If you are not successful then open the door to taking a deer in the controlled hunt..... if still unsuccessfull...then lower your goals to a legal animal to full the freezer in the bow season after the gun season. This allows you the longest opportunity to try to harvest a deer with your single tag.
 
That's all good for mist guys
But many like to bow hunt in October and head north in November. Then hunt controlled hunt at home. Some guys only hunt a few days a year in the controlled hunt is am just saying it would be good to have options on the tags you buy.
 
dutchhunter said:
That's all good for mist guys
But many like to bow hunt in October and head north in November. Then hunt controlled hunt at home. Some guys only hunt a few days a year in the controlled hunt is am just saying it would be good to have options on the tags you buy.
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Your hunting desires do not trump the amount of animals you wish to shoot..... that is what you don't seem to get.... sure, in southern Ontario there are more deer....... but there are also more hunters........

It's very simple Dutch....... you get one tag..... choose to use it when you want......

I know you turkey hunt as well, so why not do like I do and open yourself to other hunts?..... coyote, rabbit, upland etc is very rewarding and you can enjoy more hunting......

To think you should be able to harvest more deer because you bow hunt is selfish..........
 
I never realized there was such issues in some WMU's. Just lucky I guess that I am 10 minutes from 3 separate WMU's and manage my hunts accordingly. I get one bow only seal in a controlled hunt area, where I got a 7pt buck this year on opening day. Then I have my November rifle hunt seal that I put in for the draw for and got a doe. Finally I apply for December controlled hunt and buy an additional seal for that hunt but had no luck in the late hunt this year. Can get costly but I enjoy the hunt, have permission for properties to hunt in each WMU and have only been skunked once.
 
hoytcanon said:
No such thing...
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Funny thing I have one???? In the wmu I'm in, you have to enter a draw to get an antlerless tag for archery only! or are you being a douch be cause it's an antlered deer tag with an antlerless validation.

Here in wmu 93a if you want an antlerless tag for archery hunt you enter a draw.
You can enter a draw for one of but not both controlled shotgun seasons.
 
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