Lee bench style powder measures - anyone use the classic?

[RonR]

Can anyone provide feedback on the classic powder measures as compared to the perfect powder measure?

Separately, I’ve read here a little bit about the auto drum and am interested in knowing how the quick change drums perform. If I have read correctly there is a “deluxe” powder measure for 2017 coming that appears to be the same design of quick change drum…but perhaps I am incorrect.

I load for 7-08 and 303 Br with no need for handgun cartridges yet. Stick powders like Varget and IMR 4166 is what is used most.

Regards
Ronr

Currently I use the perfect powder measure that came in the kit. I’m not satisfied with repeatability. I know there are other alternatives from other manufacturers but I want to hear from the red paint users. Green and blue are good colors for reloading and for field work (farming ) but in an attempt to limit the scope I’d like to hear from the Lee users if I can. I find the remaining Lee products work well...and yes I use the safety scale to audit and it works as long as you don't have check variation such as case or bullet weights...or if a person doesn't have to d%nk around too much for load development.

 

[Receipt]

Almost exclusively Lee user.

I suggest stop using the Safety Scale first and foremost. My bench mount perfect measure is the most consistent measure I use of three I own.

 

[RonR]

Almost exclusively Lee user.

I suggest stop using the Safety Scale first and foremost. My bench mount perfect measure is the most consistent measure I use of three I own.

What powders do you throw?

Regards
Ron

 

[Fargone4sure]

The new auto Drum works really well. It meters any powder well, doing well with extruded powders like Varget. And it allows you to switch drums quickly, with no need to reset the drums. It compares extremely well with measures costing 3-4 times more. Excellent value.

 

[Receipt]

H4895. H335. Titegroup. H4198. H110.
I do like the auto drum much better than auto disc. Very easy to setup, no spillage and consistent.

 

[dirtybarry]

For .223 I use the Lee Auto-Disc powder measure with a double disc kit. For my last batch of .308 I set up the Lee Perfect powder measure that's been sitting in the cupboard for a while.
It worked just fine and was super simple to adjust for the exact charge weight I wanted. The Auto-Drum measure looks interesting but I wouldn't be able to justify it solely because of the relatively few rounds of .308 that I reload. For ~100 at a time the one I've got is quite sufficient and so far have only used it with H322 and H335.

 

[migrant hunter]

I have the lee perfect powder measure, love it. For bulk loading(.38spl, .7.62x54,.303,.223 plinking loads etc,) I set the measure and just keep dumping it in, for prescision I dump the powder into the pan for my balance scale and check them. The perfect measure is surprisingly accurate.

 

[RonR]

The new auto Drum works really well. It meters any powder well, doing well with extruded powders like Varget. And it allows you to switch drums quickly, with no need to reset the drums. It compares extremely well with measures costing 3-4 times more. Excellent value.

Thanks Forgone. Looking for this experience.

H4895. H335. Titegroup. H4198. H110.
I do like the auto drum much better than auto disc. Very easy to setup, no spillage and consistent.

For clarity, consistency is better with the autodrum version over the perfect powder measure in your experience? Thanks Receipt.

It worked just fine and was super simple to adjust for the exact charge weight I wanted. The Auto-Drum measure looks interesting but I wouldn't be able to justify it solely because of the relatively few rounds of .308 that I reload. For ~100 at a time the one I've got is quite sufficient and so far have only used it with H322 and H335.

Barry, you are hearing me. That's what I'm trying to rationalize. Whether there is any repeatability increase with the interchangeable drum design. For myself if the repeatability is better it would be worth it. I'm appealing to those like yourself for some tested experience.

I have the lee perfect powder measure, love it. For bulk loading(.38spl, .7.62x54,.303,.223 plinking loads etc,) I set the measure and just keep dumping it in, for prescision I dump the powder into the pan for my balance scale and check them. The perfect measure is surprisingly accurate.

Thanks migrant. The perfect powder measure I have can produce accurate results but it varies over a reloading session. All the tap tap tap methods and even "de static ing" with bounce sheets doesn't improve repeatability. If you have other Lee throwers I'd like to know more.

Regards all,
Ronr

 

[yomomma]

You really have to but 2-3 pounds through for the perfect powder to break in.

 

[redruns]

The new auto Drum works really well. It meters any powder well, doing well with extruded powders like Varget. And it allows you to switch drums quickly, with no need to reset the drums. It compares extremely well with measures costing 3-4 times more. Excellent value.

This is also my experience.

 

[Receipt]

Thanks Forgone. Looking for this experience.



For clarity, consistency is better with the autodrum version over the perfect powder measure in your experience? Thanks Receipt.

Regards all,
Ronr

I've never used the classic powder measure, someday I'll purchase one but haven't felt the need to at this point. I'm starting to wear through the plastic housing on the perfect measure at this point; it's been a major part of my 17+lbs of powder I've loaded up at this point and am totally fine with this kind of lifespan for a $35 measure.

For precision rifle like the above poster I dump into scale tray (RCBS 5-0-5) then trickle my way to perfection. (But the measure has always been consistent for me within .1gr)
I've yet to meet a centrefire (short of ironsighted milsurp) that I haven't been able to find various MOA loads.

I really suggest rechecking your perfect powder measure with a better scale to get an honest review of its consistency. I've obtained two Safety Scales over the years through dealings, gave one away to a friend and sold another for $10. They don't inspire confidence for me.

I was saying for turret or progressive use, I prefer the auto-drum over the auto-disc leaps and bounds. Essentially no spillage with auto-drum and the adjustability between large and small drums is very quick and painless to get setup.
Also have never been a subscriber to the taptap methods. Just a consistent solid full stop to full stop motion and you will provide your tap tap with the end of your cycle.

 

[Ron AKA]

I use the Lee Perfect Powder Measure with H4831, H322, and Varget. I find it works fine for my purpose, which is to pre-load the scale pan with a charge that is a fraction of a grain under the final charge. I weigh every charge with my Redding Model 1 Balance Beam scale, and use a Lyman powder trickler to get up to the final load which I like to keep to +/- 0.05 grains. I wouldn't even think of loading the cartridge direct with a powder measure.

 

[vagrantviking]

I've been trying to use a Perfect powder measure for handgun loading and having trouble with it throwing consistent charges under 5gr. It leaks a bit with flake powders and titegroup too.

That said, I'm still breaking it in and haven't lapped it as some people recommend. With time or larger charges I'm sure it will improve.
I find the Lee disk measures to be very consistent and repeatable.

 

[RonR]

You really have to but 2-3 pounds through for the perfect powder to break in.

I've read a bit about the break in. Thanks for the tip. I've got 3 or 4 lbs on this one but maybe it needs more seasoning.

This is also my experience.

Thanks reduns.

it's been a major part of my 17+lbs of powder I've loaded up at this point and am totally fine with this kind of lifespan for a $35 measure...

I think the same way. Just want to find out from users that can give a comparable. You use both the auto drum and the perfect. To answer the question I have would be to throw 7 to 10 charges from each device and record each throw to understand the repeatability from one to the other. (Pardon any of my ignorance on how the autodrum is used and how difficult/PITA that would be to conduct a test like that.) It would indicate either my technique or the specific perfect powder measure as not sufficient to provide repeatable consistent results.

For precision rifle like the above poster I dump into scale tray (RCBS 5-0-5) then trickle my way to perfection...

No different here.

I really suggest rechecking your perfect powder measure with a better scale to get an honest review of its consistency. I've obtained two Safety Scales over the years through dealings, gave one away to a friend and sold another for $10. They don't inspire confidence for me....

I have a digital scale to audit and the results here indicate that the Lee safety scale is accurate. Until I come across a more reputable scale for a good deal, or find that the scale is indeed inaccurate, this one will do. Much in the line of thinking about the reasons for not purchasing a new bench powder measure in your case.

So far the tools I have also produced sub moa for 2 rifles using the OCW method...but again the intent of the thread is to determine from users if the interchangeable drum style of powder measures from LEE produce more repeatable results than the perfect powder measure. (not scales) You have both and therefor receipt you can speak directly to the question and thank you for the expanded response.

I've been trying to use a Perfect powder measure for handgun loading and having trouble with it throwing consistent charges under 5gr. It leaks a bit with flake powders and titegroup too.

That said, I'm still breaking it in and haven't lapped it as some people recommend. With time or larger charges I'm sure it will improve.
I find the Lee disk measures to be very consistent and repeatable.

Thanks for posting Viking, I don't have experience throwing small charges or flakes but it appears from experience that you expect the results to get better in time...after break in.

The part about lapping...is that here in this reloading forum?

Regards all,
Ronr

 

[Fargone4sure]

The Auto Drum is basically an updated version of the Perfect Powder measure. I haven't tested them back to back, but doubt there is much if any difference in accuracy between them. But the Auto Drum is much handier to use. Once you have set a drum, you can write the load and powder type on the drum with a pencil. Spare drums come in sets of 4 for cheap. So you can switch between loads quickly with no need to reset a drum.

Another really handy feature is you can weigh out the charge you want, then take a drum with the cavity opened up, dump the powder into the drum cavity, and then adjust the drum until the powder is level with the cavity opening. Dump the powder, and put the drum in the measure and test it. Every time I've done this I've been within 1/2 grain, so just needed to fine tune a bit.

Both measures use an elastomer wiper, which makes them much more forgiving with extruded powders than other measures.

Anyway, I really like my Auto Drum.

 

[Receipt]

Just went and threw some titegroup in perfect powder as that's what in my Loadmaster with autodrum.

10 throws, 13.9gr every single time. One was on heavy side of line indicating a 13.95gr.

10 cycles of titegroup through autodrum on Loadmaster shows 4gr everytime.

I'd give them both a +- of .05gr at worst.

 

[Mystic Precision]

RonR, if your powder measure can drop charges +/- 0.2gr, that is as good as you are going to get regardless of what volumetric powder measure you choose. Extruded powders bridge and that will lead to varying mass.

Ball powders settle well so their volume can be very consistent.. I load my bulk 223 with the Lee auto disk measure on my Lee 1000. Charges are within 0.1gr. Forget about getting that consistent with an extruded powder.

If you need better powder charge control with extruded powder, weigh each charge on a good scale.

Jerry

 

[RonR]

Just went and threw some titegroup in perfect powder as that's what in my Loadmaster with autodrum.

10 throws, 13.9gr every single time. One was on heavy side of line indicating a 13.95gr.

10 cycles of titegroup through autodrum on Loadmaster shows 4gr everytime.

I'd give them both a +- of .05gr at worst.

Thanks for this Receipt and for testing out. Good to know that both models are repeatable with titegroup. It's something on this end if others can achieve that kind of repeatability.

RonR, if your powder measure can drop charges +/- 0.2gr, that is as good as you are going to get regardless of what volumetric powder measure you choose. Extruded powders bridge and that will lead to varying mass.

Ball powders settle well so their volume can be very consistent.. I load my bulk 223 with the Lee auto disk measure on my Lee 1000. Charges are within 0.1gr. Forget about getting that consistent with an extruded powder.

If you need better powder charge control with extruded powder, weigh each charge on a good scale.

Jerry

Sincere thanks for weighing in Jerry. Sage experienced talk here and I am picking up what you are putting down.

W760 meters like a charm (for testing out the perfect measure) and noted that stick powders are a challenge. I am getting at times during a loading session of 60 or so drops variation from -.3 to -.4 on 7 to 10 cycles with the sticks and the source of that extreme spread is what I am trying to determine. (perhaps I'm just that screwy ) If the lee changeable drum design is such that it can eliminate the -.4 and keep with +_ .2, and make me look more competent I'd be very happy. I just can't get there with this thing yet. Not giving up but looking over the fence at other Lee alternatives...at this point.

This part of the process is the most inconsistent and provides the most variation (for myself an the equipment on hand) and I'd like to make it better. There will always be a need to trickle up but the less variation to start with lessens the probability of anomalies. No doubt the ultimate solution is a chargemaster or similar to look after this whole operation but I'm not there yet in reloading maturity.

Thanks for the grounded insight as usual.

...But the Auto Drum is much handier to use. ... Another really handy feature is you can weigh out the charge you want, then take a drum with the cavity opened up, dump the powder into the drum cavity, and then adjust the drum until the powder is level with the cavity opening. Dump the powder, and put the drum in the measure and test it. Every time I've done this I've been within 1/2 grain, so just needed to fine tune a bit.

Anyway, I really like my Auto Drum.

Thanks 4sure. It may come down to a point of just getting some more features if these two designs are both repeatable.

Regards all and thanks for the responses.
Ronr

 

[vagrantviking]

Another discussion on Lee measures with a description of lapping the drum.

ht tp://forums.loadmastervideos.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=933

If I figure out a good method for hand throwing charges with the disk measures instead of using them in the expander dies the drum measure won't see a lot of use.