My rifleman and platoon commander days are indeed over. However, there is nothing wrong with a C8 for our use. Those CHF barrels are unstoppable.
What AR comes close to this Achievement?? HK416
- Thread starter Stoner99
- Start date
My rifleman and platoon commander days are indeed over. However, there is nothing wrong with a C8 for our use. Those CHF barrels are unstoppable.
CHF is Chromed Hammer Forged (sorry if you already knew that), basically a machine gun barrel, very durable and some manufacturers can make them quite accurate as well. I prefer a stainless Nitrided barrel for my shooting but I'm a civilian and looking for accuracy not something that can take sustained full auto fire.
I skipped the whole SA15.7 for obvious reasons but when those 14.5 C8 uppers materialized... hoochie mama!
The C8 barrel is pretty thick compared to Faxon's pencil barrel pictured below.
KAC puts out a good product as well. I tossed the URX 3.1 and put a decent hand guard on mine.
I got you covered. 9mm PDW pictured above.
The rifling is pressed into the barrel steel with rotary hammers and then chrome lined. Rifling will last longer (20k+ rounds) than button cut rifling for example.
Gunnerlove
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver Island
Norway changed their OTB tests from "no damage" to " no visible damage" because shooting anything that's full of water will beat the piss out of it. Colt Canada's biggest issue was ruptured gas tubes, the 416 was bulged barrels and bent oprods.
I am just sitting here wondering how much HK is going to lose selling guns to the French.
I am just sitting here wondering how much HK is going to lose selling guns to the French.
What? They have not just jumped on the piston wagon, they are the only ones I know of with a long stroke system, they are lighter than most other piston driven rifles and my 12 inch rifle would shoot just under one moa with black hills 77gr mk262 mod1 ammo. I'm also the only guy as far as I can remember that didn't have a single stoppage during the CQB course I did a couple summers ago, and that includes the guys with Colt's and whatever other brands were floating around.
What bunk data is it you speak of?
You like HK? That's great but just because you've drank their kool-aid doesn't mean nothing else is any good. As a civilian in Canada you would get just as much use and performance out of a S&W sport for $700 and be able to put all that extra money towards ammo and training courses. It's not like you're going to be taking your personal rifle to war with you and it's not like anyone is ever going to be shooting back at you at the gun range so what's the point of spending $4000 on a restricted rifle? If you're some special forces SEAL team type military guy then I would want the HK whenever deployed but for a rifle I can only poke holes in paper with or ring steel gongs I can think of a lot of rifles I'd rather spend big money on and they all have a NR tag hanging off of them.
I agree with you on principle. That being said, I myself purchased an MR223A3 recently and I couldn't be happier. Yes there are cheaper ARs that will do just about the same job for WAY less but at the end of the day it comes down to what I wanted and being a fan of the HK416 I wanted something similar to it. What I did get for my money was: the best finish (strongest) on an AR that I have seen ( includes Colt, DD, Sig), around 1 MOA with 55gr range ammo and less with heavier quality loads (my personal experience), CHF chrome lined barrel, FULL Ambi from factory, a rifle that runs incredibly clean and has proven reliability. Was it worth 3K? Like I said it depends on your perspective. For me, it sure was!
Totally understand that, if I shot at the range more I'd be able to justify spending more on an AR. Before I bought land I can shoot on I owned my PWS (and a few others) which was over $2000 and it was amazing, very similar experience to what you have with your HK. Now that I can go shoot any time I have 20 minutes free I just prefer to spend my money on non restricted.
Everyone is in a different situation and I completely agree the HK is a top end rifle but for my current situation it would just sit in the safe while my other rifles get to go play.
To me, I'll support anyone buying any rifle they want as long as it gets them out shooting (except maybe NEA/BCL
), I just get a little defensive when someone says only their favorite rifle is any good and nothing else measures up. As civilians there's very little practical difference between them since we are so limited with our stupid restricted laws and magazine capacity laws. On rifles like these it all comes down to personal preference and bragging rights, the only factor I really care about is how reliable it is and since I'm only using it at a range and no one is shooting back if I have a stoppage it's not the end of the world. Reminds me of the guys that refuse to run an optic that takes batteries because it might go dead some day. I reply with, and if it does, so what? You walk 10 feet over to your range bag and grab a fresh battery and continue on.
I have a PWS MK212. It is a fun gun to shoot - BUT
Yes, it is lighter than most 7.62 semi auto but that is mostly because they are using lighter barrel profile and lighter barrel nut.
The long stroke system employed by PWS is sound but there are two issues. Number 1, all military long stroke guns have detachable gas tube, or like the TAVOR it can be cleaned with the long brush provided, or when it is detail stripped. PWS - there is no easy way to clean it. For military use, it is a not a good go. It is not maintainable.
The long stroke system also vent gas pretty far down the tube. Putting a lot of rounds down range in a short time you hand will feel the burn.
PWS has not perfected the ignition cycle calculation. Mine has problem with military primer once it gets dirty.
Yes, as a recreational guns the PWS it works pretty good shooting commercial ammunition(as long as you wear some gloves) , but there is no way it is close to a HK416 or MR223 or MR308.
Yes, it is lighter than most 7.62 semi auto but that is mostly because they are using lighter barrel profile and lighter barrel nut.
The long stroke system employed by PWS is sound but there are two issues. Number 1, all military long stroke guns have detachable gas tube, or like the TAVOR it can be cleaned with the long brush provided, or when it is detail stripped. PWS - there is no easy way to clean it. For military use, it is a not a good go. It is not maintainable.
The long stroke system also vent gas pretty far down the tube. Putting a lot of rounds down range in a short time you hand will feel the burn.
PWS has not perfected the ignition cycle calculation. Mine has problem with military primer once it gets dirty.
Yes, as a recreational guns the PWS it works pretty good shooting commercial ammunition(as long as you wear some gloves) , but there is no way it is close to a HK416 or MR223 or MR308.
I also noticed it being a little awkward to clean the gas tube but I just shot some wipe-out down the hole once in a while then used a brush to clean it, Worked fine and I never had any reliability issues after thousands of rounds. I definitely wouldn't want this with a x39 since I only own corrosive ammo in that cal but for non corrosive 223 I never had an issue.
I can definitely agree about feeling the heat, I had to wear gloves if I was doing any sustained firing with pistol mags and pounding on the gongs.
Sorry, I'm not familiar with the ignition cycle calculation, sounds like a weak hammer spring but I'm far from an AR expert.
That's my point, we are all recreational shooters when it's our own personal rifle, I've never heard of anyone who uses their personal firearms in their profession, as far as I know you are supplied with whatever they want you to use and that's all you have for options. Which is why having the very best AR doesn't make a lot of sense to me. If a guy has a lot of disposable income and that's what he wants to own then that's fantastic and he's a lucky guy but to come on and say the others aren't good enough for whatever is silly. No one is going to be shooting back at you when you're using your personal rifle so even a Norinco or an NEA/BCL will do the trick.
Last edited:
mebiuspower
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Morontario
French SAS Operator (1er RPIMa) from the Task Force Sabre in the Sahel Region.
