When is 'enough gun' 'too much gun'?
- Thread starter ratherbefishin
- Start date
Heard of a similar example to your Bear - a guy used a .257 Wby. Mag. on Moose and complained about the huge volume of bloodshot meat. Not surprised if the bullet impacts at 3500+ fps. Don't think it dropped on the 1st shot.
Although I wouldn't set out to hunt moose with my 25/06 I'd have no hesitation using one on a broadside shot after seeing exactly what it can do over and over.
When and if I hunt moose ill bring my 300 wm and 458wm. Simply I shoot them well and they offer the performance I feel is more than acceptable on the worst day not restricted to that time when all is peachy and just perfect
I am guilty of being overgunned up until this point. I found that everything I hit with my .300WM went straight on through and just left a tiny little would channel. Using too hard a bullet was a problem, too. It wasn't that I was overcompensating, but lacking my own experiences I was following the social norms of what I heard to be adequate, and to use a "premium" bullet always. Then I learned that I was shooting a tiny laser beam through the animal, with the equivalent of a .30-06 coming out of the other side of it into whatever is behind. Quite inefficient. I even had to find out what kind of tracking skills I have on one deer that I shot through the top of the lungs. Combined with seeing the same wound on most of the moose shot by overgunned clients at the lodges I worked for, I realized there was something to this. Especially considering the implications of moose hunting alone with the difficult places that the animal can end up, I was motivated to find a better way. I came to the realization that matching the correct bullet construction to the correct velocity for the correct range for what I want to do is much more important than simply having a big cartridge. I feel that something more efficient and softer shooting will help me to increase practice time, and increase my confidence in my abilities with the rifle.
I was just as guilty with shotguns, too, shooting 3" 12-gauge loads from an 870 clone with an ill-fitting stock. Was that ever brutal. I fixed this problem by getting more efficient with a 20-gauge of proper fit with lighter tungsten-shot loads. Every bit as effective, and it lets me do my part much better which is what really matters. I shoot a lot more now, and my skills are going to higher levels than I aspired to before.
Now I'm working on finding a more appropriate rifle. Last year, I used a Win 94 .30-30. I liked much about it, but there were a couple of things I didn't like either. Now, I'm taking everything I learned from that and putting it into a short, light, handy, all-around bolt gun. So far, my caliber choices are narrowed down to 6.5x55, 7x57, .260, or 7mm-08. With this and all of the right ergonomics (and a lot of practice), I'm confident that I can excel with such a thing.
I was just as guilty with shotguns, too, shooting 3" 12-gauge loads from an 870 clone with an ill-fitting stock. Was that ever brutal. I fixed this problem by getting more efficient with a 20-gauge of proper fit with lighter tungsten-shot loads. Every bit as effective, and it lets me do my part much better which is what really matters. I shoot a lot more now, and my skills are going to higher levels than I aspired to before.
Now I'm working on finding a more appropriate rifle. Last year, I used a Win 94 .30-30. I liked much about it, but there were a couple of things I didn't like either. Now, I'm taking everything I learned from that and putting it into a short, light, handy, all-around bolt gun. So far, my caliber choices are narrowed down to 6.5x55, 7x57, .260, or 7mm-08. With this and all of the right ergonomics (and a lot of practice), I'm confident that I can excel with such a thing.
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I have a 9.3x57 loaded with a 285 gr soft nosed bullet ,it isn't particularly fast,probably only around 2000 fps ,but it has a reputation of hitting like the hammer of ThorI would have liked a 9.3x62,but they were quite a bit more expensive and there were more '57s around at reasonable prices . Seems to be a good combination of bullet type, weight and velocity,kind of like. 30 30 on steroids . .Definitely more recoil than my 65x55 ,but not too excessive either
- Location
- In the shadows of the Rockies
I have a 9.3x74R (Ruger No.1-S) and load 286gr Nosler Partition bullets at 2500 fps muzzle speed. Haven't used it on heavy game yet but would expect it to perform like my .375 H&H Magnum which I have used on Moose. The .375 has only 4% more cross-sectional area than the .366/9.3. Bullet weights and speeds are comparable.
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r34skyline
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Simple rule, widely available ammo choice with decent poke. For me the answer usually comes to 308 or 30-06. Out of a quality gun, good scope, and competent organic thing running it, they tend to usually get the job done. That's my enough option, there is no real too much. If you want more poke because of comfort margin, to be different whatever it is, go nuts.
To much? When you can’t handle recoil. Deer are not harder to kill, but may be harder shots. Hunting over fields and prairie means longer shots. Though dad shot an elk with a 22 high power, it was what was in his hand when he rode up to it. It was not a cartridge of choice. Enough to make a clean kill every time.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
Road hunting is an oxymoron, that should be referred to as driving around shooting at things, not hunting.
Okay, I'll bite. The majority of successful hunters I will wager are simply opportunistic shooters, there is no hunting involved other than they are in game country, and their chances of seeing game are the same as anyone else's. There is no stalking, which to me defines hunting. Folks who hunt from blinds, are simply reverse road hunting, in that the game is encouraged to approach the blind, whereas if road hunting, the "blind" approaches the game. The same applies to hunting from a canoe or from horseback. You are in effect driving around, shooting at things.
There is such as thing as an inappropriate gun for specific types of hunting, but when discussing sporting arms, there is no such thing as too much gun.
I agree that the purest form of hunting, IMHO, is spotting and stalking game; if I am actually spending large amounts of time and money to travel to a distant locale and shoot some funny-looking critter that I will never see at home, then the spot and stalk is the only type of hunt that will be acceptable. I am totally befuddled by guys who fly to Africa, for example, and then sit in a hot, stuffy little blind overlooking an artificial waterhole; they stick an arrow into a kudu or impala or whatever, and then have the audacity to trumpet "Well, we hunted hard for almost 2 whole days before we had a chance to snuff this here crested gazork, but it was worth it!" They tend to hint at some implied moral superiority because they used archery tackle rather than a firearm...and then actually video it to show the world...(and then I kill a few more brain cells by watching it on WildTV...)...
BUT...and this is a big "but"...sitting in a blind is simply a fact of life for much of the hunting that many of us do. I hunt deer on my own land, but you can only stomp around a few dozen or few hundred acres for so long before stinking up the whole place and "burning" your hunting area. We don't all have access to vast tracts of empty wilderness in which to hunt; the use of blinds or treestands is almost essential if you wish to hunt throughout a long season. I have a few trails that I love to stillhunt when conditions are right...and the only way they are ever right is if I have not been sashaying up and down those trails for days on end.
I'll never drive around shooting stuff; I'd much rather walk around shooting stuff, but I'll stand hunt if and when necessary...
BUT...and this is a big "but"...sitting in a blind is simply a fact of life for much of the hunting that many of us do. I hunt deer on my own land, but you can only stomp around a few dozen or few hundred acres for so long before stinking up the whole place and "burning" your hunting area. We don't all have access to vast tracts of empty wilderness in which to hunt; the use of blinds or treestands is almost essential if you wish to hunt throughout a long season. I have a few trails that I love to stillhunt when conditions are right...and the only way they are ever right is if I have not been sashaying up and down those trails for days on end.
I'll never drive around shooting stuff; I'd much rather walk around shooting stuff, but I'll stand hunt if and when necessary...
Most hunting is either drive around shooting stuff, float around shooting stuff, ride around shooting stuff, walk around shooting stuff, wait around shooting stuff, look around and shoot stuff or following things around and shooting stuff, but the odd time you can chase stuff around before shooting stuff. Chasing might just be following really fast though.
Which technique is preferred usually has a lot more to do with where the stuff is than anything else.
Which technique is preferred usually has a lot more to do with where the stuff is than anything else.
Is flesh really that tough ? im sure most of the modern cartridges available with a well placed shot would takedown non dangerous game on this soil. Im on the cheep side and 30cal is my limit... otherwise i couldnt do the target shooting and have the comfort n confidence that i enjoy when hunting...
Too much gun for me comes down to the heavy price tag for shells and i simply just dont see game here in ontario being that tough at all
Too much gun for me comes down to the heavy price tag for shells and i simply just dont see game here in ontario being that tough at all
LOL
I have seen a couple of posts here that agree with my belief that the concept of too much gun never applies to the game being hunted, only to the shooter. If you can't shoot it without flinching, or won't play with it because it hurts, it is too much gun. All the stories about meat loss etc. are due to bad bullet choice, not cartridge choice. I will add that I have never understood those who think shooting game with the smallest cartridge that they think will work. Use at least enough gun.
- Location
- In the shadows of the Rockies
Game calls work. More emphasis on hunting skills. Make the critters go look for you rather than the other way around. Up close I figure all I really need is my iron-sighted 30-06.
Until Yeti shows up.
Until Yeti shows up.
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