Guided Hunt Stigma.

[c-fbmi]

trevj........That was just a wildass guess, I have no idea how many outfitter tags there are, but when I researched antelope outfitters in Alberta, only one name came up and I tried it 2 or 3 different ways and still only got the same one name. I seriously doubt this one outfitter would even get 50 tags, so call it an educated guess........Can anyone clarify exactly how many allotments there are for outfitted non-residents?
I don't see how you could call that prioritizing non-residents, it's just how the numbers work out. You have 40-50,000 residents drawing for 1000 tags and you have 20 or so non-residents purchasing the hunts made available for them. Obviously if you sold every resident, who wanted one, a tag there would be no antelope left in Alberta within 2 years. The other option is to hold an auction and auction off the 1000 tags, now you really have entered the rich mans arena and any fairness at all goes out the window, it all comes down to how much you are willing to pay and how deep your pockets are. I doubt many residents would be in favor of the auction system, even if it were restricted solely to residents.
I don't have the answer as to how to make the other 39,000 residents happy, but I can tell you that taking away the outfitter allotment (what ever that may be) and putting it back into the general draw won't improve your odds one little bit.

 

[Species8472]

trevj........That was just a wildass guess, I have no idea how many outfitter tags there are, but when I researched antelope outfitters in Alberta, only one name came up and I tried it 2 or 3 different ways and still only got the same one name. I seriously doubt this one outfitter would even get 50 tags, so call it an educated guess.......

Me thinks your google must be broken. 13 different outfitter links from the first page of a google search for "Alberta Pronghorn Outfitters."

http://www.albertahunt.com/antelope.htm

http://www.silversageoutfitters.com/antelope.htm

http://livingstoneoutfitters.com/antelope-hunts/

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Triple_S_Outfitters

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Cervo_Ralph

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Milk_River_Outfitters

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/909770_AB_LTD_Big_Horn_Hunting_Adventure

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/925879_Alberta

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Lost_Creek_Outfitters

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Brigden_Outfitting

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Great_Plains_Outfitters_Ltd

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Trophy_Buck_Outfitters

https://www.guidefitter.com/centerfireoutfitters

 

[leeelmer]

Sadly one year after a horrible winter where we lost over half our antelope population there was less resident tags than outfitter tags in Alberta
Resident tags can change year to year but outfitter tags are on a guaranteed allotment for 5 years
In some zones the were 80% more outfitter tags than resident
This being a big problem to residents
In 2016 in total there were just over 600 tags in Alberta with over 40000 people trying to draw them
Outfitter tags??? Well you cant find it?
They say 10% but no published data
APOS wont tell me
Also even if its 60 thats not the whole truth. In one zone they might have over 50% of the tags in that zone.

 

[RojamB21]

You will have many free advisor around hunting but we don't give that much of a crop.

I hunted in or around three continents, excluding South Africa ( wish list ) and hunted locally in Ontario.
We paid to hunt black bears almost each year and I took some clients Moose hunting, so I charge fair share.

I'm not fat rich and after charging my clients some money, I'm still pretty straight , Just Hunt !!!

 

[Trimmer 905]

Me thinks your google must be broken. 13 different outfitter links from the first page of a google search for "Alberta Pronghorn Outfitters."

http://www.albertahunt.com/antelope.htm

http://www.silversageoutfitters.com/antelope.htm

http://livingstoneoutfitters.com/antelope-hunts/

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Triple_S_Outfitters

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Cervo_Ralph

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Milk_River_Outfitters

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/909770_AB_LTD_Big_Horn_Hunting_Adventure

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/925879_Alberta

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Lost_Creek_Outfitters

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Brigden_Outfitting

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Great_Plains_Outfitters_Ltd

http://www.huntalberta.ca/en/Outfitters/Trophy_Buck_Outfitters

https://www.guidefitter.com/centerfireoutfitters

At $9-12K for a hunt,it doesn't matter to most hunters who does or doesn't get a tag. How do you justify those prices?

 

[shoota]

For having done both, they are easier in a sense that you just show up for the fun part. No scouting, no patterning, land prep, food plots, baiting, hours spent retrieving cameras, looking at pics, judging antler size, etc. No stand building or shooting lanes clearing either. I have way more respect for a guy that harvest a trophy on a DIY hunt than a guy with thick wallet and a room full of trophies.

this, and it's more rewarding doing all that yourself makes anything you do get a trophy and that part of Hunting to me is the most enjoyable the shooting part is only mere seconds of the overall Hunting experience. But saying that trying to hunt outside of your province is hard without a guide or local knowledge, I have often contemplated a hunt outside my province but I don't want a typical "guided" hunt like you see on TV if that makes any sense?

 

[hoytcanon]

I have often contemplated a hunt outside my province but I don't want a typical "guided" hunt like you see on TV if that makes any sense?

Negative stereotypes are not "typical."

 

[Ardent]

this, and it's more rewarding doing all that yourself makes anything you do get a trophy and that part of Hunting to me is the most enjoyable the shooting part is only mere seconds of the overall Hunting experience. But saying that trying to hunt outside of your province is hard without a guide or local knowledge, I have often contemplated a hunt outside my province but I don't want a typical "guided" hunt like you see on TV if that makes any sense?

Then hunt backpack mountain game, there is no easy route in that regard. You do that, harvest or not, and you’ve done a hunt nobody in this thread can sneer at you over, guide beside you or not.

 

[hoytcanon]

Then hunt backpack mountain game, there is no easy route in that regard. You do that, harvest or not, and you’ve done a hunt nobody in this thread can sneer at you over, guide beside you or not.

You mean the guide won't carry you in on a pack frame???

 

[phinton81]

Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t most guided hunts for deer, moose, elk, bear etc trophy minded? IE: not meat hunts?

Isn’t that one of the main justifications, big money for better areas with more trophy potential and a guide that knows where to find them?

As a meat hunter who hates taxidermy, guided hunts just don’t excite me. I’ve done a few and found them to be pretty sophomoric, you can tell by the way guides treat you that they see a lot of morons who have no business being in the woods. “Stand here, be quiet, load/unload your gun, shoot him there” etc...they’re almost surprised when they see someone with some woodsmanship and/or shooting/hunting skills.

I stopped party hunting a few years back because I didn’t like being told what to do and nowadays hunting by myself or with a good friend is the most satisfying way to do it.

Money can’t replace your own boot leather, initiative and skills. A guide is a means to an end, all depends what you’re looking for I guess...

Patrick

 

[Ardent]

You mean the guide won't carry you in on a pack frame???

Costs extra!

Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t most guided hunts for deer, moose, elk, bear etc trophy minded? IE: not meat hunts?

That seems the rather simplistic assumption of this thread admittedly.

 

[freddyfour]

Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t most guided hunts for deer, moose, elk, bear etc trophy minded? IE: not meat hunts?

Isn’t that one of the main justifications, big money for better areas with more trophy potential and a guide that knows where to find them?

As a meat hunter who hates taxidermy, guided hunts just don’t excite me. I’ve done a few and found them to be pretty sophomoric, you can tell by the way guides treat you that they see a lot of morons who have no business being in the woods. “Stand here, be quiet, load/unload your gun, shoot him there” etc...they’re almost surprised when they see someone with some woodsmanship and/or shooting/hunting skills.

I stopped party hunting a few years back because I didn’t like being told what to do and nowadays hunting by myself or with a good friend is the most satisfying way to do it.

Money can’t replace your own boot leather, initiative and skills. A guide is a means to an end, all depends what you’re looking for I guess...

Patrick

Sounds like you have employed some sh!tty guides. I look at it as a chance to have an adventure other wise not able to get on my own. Trophy is also subjective to what you are after. I would guess most here are after adventures and memories, not a wall mount.

 

[medvedqc]

Also, residents would not be so angry, if say I apply for a draw, lets say Antelope, and don't get drawn.
Then if I had the cash just like a non resident could pay a outfitter and go with them and use one of there tags.
I think this would be a better option. It would not solve the issue but would help.
Now for myself I would not do this, but I am sure there are a few in Alberta that would.
I was saving for a guided B.C. Grizzly hunt, but that is off the list thanks to BC NDP, (this also took it off the list for B.C. residents, and I am sure you guys would be pissed if non residents could hunt them but residents could not)

yukon is still open for grizz but i do not know for how long.

resident hunbers here are not that happy too ... when you see that you need to be drawn in some areas for sheep when outfitters got a free run ... same for restricted areas for caribou for local when outfitters has no quotas ...

 

[hoytcanon]

Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t most guided hunts for deer, moose, elk, bear etc trophy minded?

I don't consider a client looking for the best animal possible to be a "trophy hunter." Everyone wants the best animal possible... 95% of my clients over the years tried to be "somewhat discerning," but were not willing to go home empty-handed if at all possible... after paying for the hunt, they wanted to go home with an animal. The other 5% of clients were true trophy hunters... they are looking for a large specimen... they usually have a goal in mind and won't compromise on their standard... they will hunt for that one animal right up to the last minute of the hunt, if they don't connect they go home happy for their effort and looking forward to their next excursion... I have rarely had an unhappy trophy hunter, whether they were successful or not.

 

[Ardent]

For having done both, they are easier in a sense that you just show up for the fun part. No scouting, no patterning, land prep, food plots, baiting, hours spent retrieving cameras, looking at pics, judging antler size, etc. No stand building or shooting lanes clearing either. I have way more respect for a guy that harvest a trophy on a DIY hunt than a guy with thick wallet and a room full of trophies.

I outfit & guide for a living and oddly have never seen a camera, stand, bait, food plot, prepped land, or shooting lane and likely never will. Same goes for when in Zimbabwe on the other end as the client. Apparently I missed a step! The immediate assumption we’re principally talking stand hunting and even antlers is telling on the opinions about guided hunts. Those type of guided hunts literally don’t exist here, likewise for most of the OP’s hunts.

Client & guide.

Member Dogleg packing his Grizzly, he also skinned, and in general all we did was hunt together. I’m there as his legallly required hunting partner and friend, nothing he couldn’t do solo. But that’s not the point.

Member Hoytcanon with his client who I hopped in the middle for the photo with, you’re starting to get the picture hopefully. Hoyt guided a lady who skinned better than any of us, a trapper at home and wilderness firefighter. I struggle to see her as somehow lesser for hiring us. This place will do well with more hunting stories and photos and less judgement.

 

[bearkilr]

Yes, I was a professional guide for 8 years, and yes, I did much more work than my clients, and that's the service I wanted to provide. I wanted my clients to have a great experience and not to bust their family jewels doing so. Most, or all of them were rewarded with a nice trophy animal at my expense of working hard. No I never been guided, nor do I want to. Alberta it is the Africa of Canada. Alberta is most diverse with it's ecology, flora and fauna. There is absolutely no need for me to search elsewhere. I have everything here from gophers to moose, and much much more in-between.

For someone as yourself that worked as a guide, that has to be the most arrogant post I've ever read. Evidently your outfitter didn't know your true feelings or he's an idiot.

 

[Ardent]

track’s contention Alberta has the most diverse ecology in Canada is the only surprising aspect of that post.

 

[bearkilr]

track’s contention Alberta has the most diverse ecology in Canada is the only surprising aspect of that post.

True enough, a leopard doesn't change its spots. Don't think they have those in Alberta though...............

 

[Purple shoulder]

Never discount jealousy.

I'm jealous of the guy that can do things like African hunts. Super friggen jealous. But I'd shake his hand and congratulate with a big smile on my face and demand to here all about the hunt.

 

[Dogleg]

All I can say is don't knock anything until you try it.