1871 Snider Mark III Carbine - 7th Infantry (London) Bn (Now RCR). 1st NWMP rifle!

clanquinn

clanquinn

New member
Rating - 100%
19   0   0
Location
Wasaga Beach ON
Fellow folks of CGN,

I recently bought a Snider Mark III Calvary Carbine and just discovered a phenomenal fact:

My Snider has the serial number 4099 and of the 70 known NWMP Sniders, over 20 are in the 4### serial number range.

The Mark III Snider Carbine was the first rifle issued to the North West Mounted Police (NWMP).

I am over the moon happy with this wonderful rifle!

This rifle was issued to the 7th Infantry (London) BN, which is now perpetuated by the Royal Canadian Regiment (RCR).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Royal_Canadian_Regiment

If anyone can share any further details after looking at the pics, please send them my way!

Thanks for the info folks have sent my way about this rifle.

Jim
 

Attachments

  • IMG_20180421_090224348.jpg
    IMG_20180421_090224348.jpg
    64.3 KB · Views: 479
  • IMG_20180421_091652368.jpg
    IMG_20180421_091652368.jpg
    47.5 KB · Views: 477
  • IMG_20180421_091742233.jpg
    IMG_20180421_091742233.jpg
    36.3 KB · Views: 480
  • IMG_20180421_090819888_HDR.jpg
    IMG_20180421_090819888_HDR.jpg
    40 KB · Views: 481
  • IMG_20180421_090745044.jpg
    IMG_20180421_090745044.jpg
    51.5 KB · Views: 480
  • IMG_20180421_090441393_HDR.jpg
    IMG_20180421_090441393_HDR.jpg
    74.2 KB · Views: 482
  • IMG_20180421_090315033.jpg
    IMG_20180421_090315033.jpg
    61.5 KB · Views: 479
Last edited:
Mike Fahey sent the following description to me of the proof marks on my Snider: "From the top; STEEL means a steel barrel (rather than iron), typical on later Sniders. Crown/VR/1P means passed 1st proof (I think that was just the barrel, before assembly). Crown/E/10 is an Enfield inspectors mark. Crown/VR/Crossed pennants/2P means passed the second proof, assembled. Second Crown/E/10 means passed inspection after second proof. Broad-arrow/WD means accepted by British War Department."
 
Butt tang mark 7 shows it was issued in London ON to 7th Battalion. Until about 1875 every infantry battalion had an attached cavalry troop.
 
I'll have to poop on your parade just a bit. If I recall correctly the Snider Carbines used by the NWMP did not have DC in a diamond markings. Klancher's book The Arms and Accoutrements of the Mounted Police shows that the known serial numbers of the NWMP Snider Carbines are all over the place starting with serial number 75 and ending with serial number 9295 so they were not issued in batches like other guns. I have a Snider carbine that is a few numbers away from a known NWMP gun. The serial number of my carbine is 5639 and the closest known NWMP confirmed gun is 5644 but it still does not mean that mine is a NWMP gun. I can hope but without good provenance it's all speculation.

Yours is a lovely carbine but I'll suggest it was a Canadian Militia gun not a NWMP gun.
 
Last edited:
Incurable Collectoer said:
I'll have to poop on your parade just a bit. If I recall correctly the Snider Carbines used by the NWMP did not have DC in a diamond markings. Klancher's book The Arms and Accoutrements of the Mounted Police shows that the known serial numbers of the NWMP Snider Carbines are all over the place starting with serial number 75 and ending with serial number 9295 so they were not issued in batches like other guns. I have a Snider carbine that is a few numbers away from a known NWMP gun. The serial number of my carbine is 5639 and the closest known NWMP confirmed gun is 5644 but it still does not mean that mine is a NWMP gun. I can hope but without good provenance it's all speculation.

Your's is a lovely carbine but I'll suggest it was a Canadian Militia gun not a NWMP gun.
Click to expand...

Agree strongly!
 
I found that these that provide reproduction Snider carbine sight covers and two piece cleaning rods I also found the definitive answer to the colour question regarding the sight covers for the Snider carbine. In Skennerton's book .577 Pattern 1853 Rifle Musket & Snuder-Enfield (S.A.I.S. No. 20), on page 9, he notes that "a black leather sight protector was added in 1862." Thus, colour confirmed!

Maj EGB Reynolds notes in his Enfield book the on 26 April 1890 the British military instituted pull throughs as the cleaning method for service rifles & in 1899 mineral jelly was established to be the best bore cleaner & preservative for rifle metal - with Rangoon Oil for working parts (a petroleum product itself). Thus I use a 100 percent petroleum product on my rifles - Vaseline! And I use Olive oil as well. This combination works well & doesn't have a foul odour like many commercial products & the price is very economical!
 
Last edited:
Thanks Green for the unit info, which indicates a really, really great piece of history for the rifle!

The Canadian Fusiliers (City of London Regiment), which started as the "7th Infantry Battalion, 'Prince Arthur's Own'" in 1866 is perpetuated by the Royal Canadian Regiment (RCR).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Royal_Canadian_Regiment

The RCR is of course one of the premier infantry units of Canada, with simply phenomenal history.

In the 1885 North West Canada period units, such as the 7th Fusiliers out of London Ontario, began standing up their own 'Ambulance Corps' of Stretcher Bearers.

Alexander Campbell, who was the Ambulance Corps Sergeant of the 7th Fusiliers produced a book about his experiences during the 1885 North West Canada Rebellion, An Account of the Advances of the 7th Fusiliers of London to aid in the suppression of the North West Rebellion of 1885, which is all on-line, and drew the following picture of his Ambulance Corps: https://library.usask.ca/nort.../campbell/pages/page_41.html
 
Last edited:
What a nice example of a Snider, I hope you enjoy it for many years to come. After owning my Sargent's model with the fancy sword bayonet for many years I finally had a chance to load up some rounds and shoot it yesterday. What an impressive boom and a satisfying thwack when the 450 grain bullet hits anything of meaningful mass. Its also surprisingly accurate.
 
apu said:
What a nice example of a Snider, I hope you enjoy it for many years to come. After owning my Sargent's model with the fancy sword bayonet for many years I finally had a chance to load up some rounds and shoot it yesterday. What an impressive boom and a satisfying thwack when the 450 grain bullet hits anything of meaningful mass. Its also surprisingly accurate.
Click to expand...

Did you use brass shells and dies, or plastic shotgun shells?
 
Thanks Apu :) you also have an awesome Snider!

I just read Alexander Campbell's book An Account of the Advances of the 7th Fusiliers of London to aid in suppression of the North West Rebellion of 1885 (available on at https://library.usask.ca/northwest/campbell/campbell.html ) and he notes on page 4 that: "Our Rifles were muzzleloading Enfields converted, with a Snyder breach action and gas-pipe barrels realy not fit for service, Our ammunition boxes were stiff heavy and clumsy, and the pack impossible. This equipment came from the Imperial stores and were the same as the imperial troops were burdened with in the war with Russia in 1853 or thereabouts or perhaps at Waterloo."
 
Picture of the bore of my Snider Mark III Carbine

Picture of the bore of my Snider Mark III Carbine.

You can still see the tool markings from when the rifling was cut!
 

Attachments

  • IMG_20180422_101307.jpg
    IMG_20180422_101307.jpg
    98.1 KB · Views: 106
I'm afraid that serial # is not in Don Klancher's book arms and Accoutrements of the Mounted Police 1873-1973 He has a list of the known snider carbines and mine falls between two numbers in the book but no proof it is one .
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom