The trigger tab/bar safety prevents the trigger from moving unless pressed. This helps prevent the gun from firing when dropped, like a SIG320 does. The firing pin block prevents the firing pin from striking the primer unless the trigger is completed depressed to the rear. The third is what is called the drop safety. The striker mechanism known as the "crucible sear" has two wings that ride in tracks within the trigger mechanism housing. Those tracks are parallel until the striker spring is completely compressed(which means the trigger is pulled completely to the rear) at which point the tracks allow the crucible sear to drop down allowing the striker to travel forward and do it's job. The contact between the striker and the crucible sear is continuous until the trigger is pulled with no chance of separation. By the very nature of PASSIVE safeties like those in a Glock, there is no way for ignorant/negligent behaviour or practices to be mitigated. You press the trigger with anything and all three passive safeties disengage and the gun fires, as designed.. Much like a revolver.
Appendix Carry and Muzzle Direction
- Thread starter Ganderite
- Start date
The trigger tab/bar safety prevents the trigger from moving unless pressed. This helps prevent the gun from firing when dropped, like a SIG320 does. The firing pin block prevents the firing pin from striking the primer unless the trigger is completed depressed to the rear. The third is what is called the drop safety. The striker mechanism known as the "crucible sear" has two wings that ride in tracks within the trigger mechanism housing. Those tracks are parallel until the striker spring is completely compressed(which means the trigger is pulled completely to the rear) at which point the tracks allow the crucible sear to drop down allowing the striker to travel forward and do it's job. The contact between the striker and the crucible sear is continuous until the trigger is pulled with no chance of separation. By the very nature of PASSIVE safeties like those in a Glock, there is no way for ignorant/negligent behaviour or practices to be mitigated. You press the trigger with anything and all three passive safeties disengage and the gun fires, as designed.. Much like a revolver.
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^^^^ This is why I think the vid is some kind of training video. The guy does not touch the gun once it's holstered. Unless he was using a horrible Walmart special holster with something trapped in it which activated the trigger, the gun really should not go off.
Yes I forgot about the drop safety and you are right in your conclusion with one exception.
All guns will fire, without "ignorant or negligent behavior", when the trigger gets pulled. The trigger can be pulled simply due to every day actions by the owner. Like bending over as illustrated by the video. There is nothing ignorant of negligent about what he did. If you fall to that belief you are a ripe candidate for a problem.
These passive safeties carry more risk that say a handgun with a manual safety or decocker mechanism or are DAO. Add to that pistols with short light trigger pulls 6lbs or under might be considered light add additional risk.
I get that under certain circumstances appendix carry might be a convenient method of concealed carry but recognize the method carries more risk of unintended discharges than say a OWB carry. You trade additional risk for a different type of concealed carry.
It doesn't get much more complicated than that. I own three of the four types of handguns ( I don't own a DAO handgun). Each carries a certain amount of risk when carried loaded and made ready. The risk factor varies from virtually none REV/Decocker to Striker fired. All can bite you but it takes more things to go wrong for handguns in the bottom of the range than those carrying the highest risk IMHO.
We live in a free country so all of us can decide what risks we want to accept and what ones we don't. When playing IDPA I use an OWB holster. Others use IWB holsters. Personally I wouldn't use an appendix carry gun no matter the style of handgun or for what purpose. Friends in the medical profession have told me how long I have if you blow a hole in your femoral artery never mind the potential loss of my boys. Others accept the risk with striker fired pistols held in appendix carry holsters. To each his own.
Take Care
Bob
All guns will fire, without "ignorant or negligent behavior", when the trigger gets pulled. The trigger can be pulled simply due to every day actions by the owner. Like bending over as illustrated by the video. There is nothing ignorant of negligent about what he did. If you fall to that belief you are a ripe candidate for a problem.
These passive safeties carry more risk that say a handgun with a manual safety or decocker mechanism or are DAO. Add to that pistols with short light trigger pulls 6lbs or under might be considered light add additional risk.
I get that under certain circumstances appendix carry might be a convenient method of concealed carry but recognize the method carries more risk of unintended discharges than say a OWB carry. You trade additional risk for a different type of concealed carry.
It doesn't get much more complicated than that. I own three of the four types of handguns ( I don't own a DAO handgun). Each carries a certain amount of risk when carried loaded and made ready. The risk factor varies from virtually none REV/Decocker to Striker fired. All can bite you but it takes more things to go wrong for handguns in the bottom of the range than those carrying the highest risk IMHO.
We live in a free country so all of us can decide what risks we want to accept and what ones we don't. When playing IDPA I use an OWB holster. Others use IWB holsters. Personally I wouldn't use an appendix carry gun no matter the style of handgun or for what purpose. Friends in the medical profession have told me how long I have if you blow a hole in your femoral artery never mind the potential loss of my boys. Others accept the risk with striker fired pistols held in appendix carry holsters. To each his own.
Take Care
Bob
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In my home town, a butcher across the street from the main teaching hospital stuck a meat cleaver in his femoral artery. The customers carried him across the street to emergency, where he was declared dead. I used to carry a S&W6906, and I actually liked the mag safety since you could holster and draw with the mag out. Nowadays I can't carry, so Glocks are fine.
Cameron SS
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You're fake.
1st, she already had the gloves on.
2nd, she did flinch when the shot went off.
3rd, it was the old guy that called 911.
4th she is not most people. She works in a gun store, knows where the first aid kit is kept, and clearly is confident in the use of tourniquets.
5. The gunshot was not of unknown origin. Any doubt would have been removed by his screams.
Rather than assuming its fake because she isnt a useless coward, why not assume she is an ex army medic or something?
so many unprovable assumptions...
Proficient people have accidents too.
He was near the gun. It was on his person.
How can you cay it clearly was not snagged when it was out of view under his clothes? After 20 views, I cant say with any confidence that the gun was even in the holster. I think he would have noticed if it wasnt, but did you see how quickly he tossed the gun after being shot? Probably zero tension on the holster, meaning the gun could have been pushed out when he bent over. No way we could no for sure from the video.
The gun appears to not have been snagged on his outer shirt, but we have no idea what was going on with his under shirt or underwear.
Clearly there was some encouragement on the trigger. We dont know what gun it is do we?
As for blood, people dont explode with blood in real life. We have no idea how severe the wound is. It didnt even bring him to the ground. In any event the bullet might not have struck him until several inches below. Blood on the holster? Thats even hard to tell from the low quality video.
There are hundreds of possible maybes. Maybe he filed off the trigger guard.
what would that accomplish. He didnt shoot himself while holstering. Poor holster choice and interference with clothing wont be helped by any slide push safety, unless you plan to keep your thumb on it all the time.
The thing I always find weird about these videos is why someone would post it. Maybe this guy will tex grubner himself and post an explainer video of how it happened.
According to a blog on the truthaboutguns, the gun was allwgedly a glock 43 in 9mm and the holster was a gcode incog.
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Still alive
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Guess we'll never know for sure how it all happened.
As to the gear, the Incog is a well built level 2 holster with no straps. It really should not snag a trigger. The guy looked like he inserted the gun carefully. Cameron could be right about the zero tension on the holster. The Incogs have adjustable tension but it should not affect the trigger either way. Most IWB styles can have lower retention as they depend on the tightness of the rig and belt holding it against the body for some of their retention ability.
It is possible he got really lucky and the round went past his junk and out and he was actually not hurt ( except his pride).....hence no blood. Throwing the gun away the way he did was likely not a good idea, seeing as how it had apparently gone off on its own a second earlier!
Re-watched it again. Yeah, probably not a training video.
As to the gear, the Incog is a well built level 2 holster with no straps. It really should not snag a trigger. The guy looked like he inserted the gun carefully. Cameron could be right about the zero tension on the holster. The Incogs have adjustable tension but it should not affect the trigger either way. Most IWB styles can have lower retention as they depend on the tightness of the rig and belt holding it against the body for some of their retention ability.
It is possible he got really lucky and the round went past his junk and out and he was actually not hurt ( except his pride).....hence no blood. Throwing the gun away the way he did was likely not a good idea, seeing as how it had apparently gone off on its own a second earlier!
Re-watched it again. Yeah, probably not a training video.
Cameron SS
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According to the blog it was a through and through. Probably just down the inside of the leg. Might not have gotten much meat.
For what its worth it almost looks like he was carrying in the 12 o clock position or so. Not sure what effect that could have but lots of clothes to bunch up there.
As for the holster I am curious as to how much muzzle sticks out the bottom, not that the g43 has much muzzle to begin with.
After watching a few more times it is definitely on the initial downward move of the bend when it goes off, so I dont see how the gun could be pushed out of the holster and then triggered.
I just cant picture how the clothes would get pulled by the bend, but whatever it was it was there in the holster before he started to bend over. Definitely bizarre.
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A through and through would account for the lack of blood. He was a southpaw and the gun was around the 11 o'clock position. There really should be nothing bunching up there. The Incog is an open ended holster. I was wondering if he was putting the gun into a holster made for a light, thus allowing for more movement but the holster he threw out didn't appear wide enough to have a light feature. The Incog is a solid holster. It does not flex or bend. Ok, the clips flex and bend. The trigger guard is completely covered.
In the end, yeah, who knows? Like I said earlier, the guy appears to know his way around guns, so I agree. Very very strange incident.
You can bet a piece of clothing caught the trigger and the gun went off. The Glock 43 is a popular pistol in the US and fits well with an Appendix Carry rig.
For new shooters, folks with little or no firearm experience I would not suggest any striker fired gun be their first handgun. Any revolver or DA/SA pistol hammer pistol is a much better option. The long first trigger pull along with either a decocker feature or manual safety is a far better option for no other reason than safety....theirs.
Take Care
Bob
For new shooters, folks with little or no firearm experience I would not suggest any striker fired gun be their first handgun. Any revolver or DA/SA pistol hammer pistol is a much better option. The long first trigger pull along with either a decocker feature or manual safety is a far better option for no other reason than safety....theirs.
Take Care
Bob
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Hey Bob,
IDPA allows AIWB carry for their matches? Or is this in the US only?
IDPA allows AIWB carry for their matches? Or is this in the US only?
I miss spoke must have been an Action Shooting match. AIWB would not be legal for IDPA. Strong side either OWB or IWB holsters only. You don't see many of the latter and the ones you do are guys using their carry rigs. I went back and removed reference to Appendix Carry and IDPA. Thanks for catching that. See you in August.
Take Care
Bob
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Still alive
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Copy that! Thanks for the clarification.
Cameron SS
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I carry a full frame 226, IWB, at the 430. Mostly because its the one I shoot most, and am most comfortable with.
Appendix carry is legit and perfectly suited for larger pistols, but it freaks me out.
I dont think an accident is at all likely (if I did I wouldnt carry) but given the choice Id rather have a whoops down the back than the front.
Well we think on similar lines. We accept a certain amount of risk. We both decide how much we want to accept. Your 226 is about as safe as it gets and one could argue IWB and OWB offer about the same opportunity for something to go sideways and the chance is low. Pointing a striker fired pistol, never mind the size, at your privates or worse your opposite leg is just not where I want to be on several levels. Only the most naive think "It can't happen to me because I am always - safe- trained - careful - etc ". At least the simple act of holstering with a hammer gun allows you to place your thumb over the hammer as you holster. You would feel any drawing back of the hammer should your trigger get caught on fabric. That aside, I will stick to OWB/IWB holsters. Others can do what they wish. I have just enough room for what is supposed to there. No room for even a Compact. My former Greek God chest has slipped a bit south it you get my drift.
Take Care
Bob
