Hey Guys,
I've had this rifle since they came out in June and I have put approximately 1200 rounds through mine at this point. Let me share some of my thoughts / Experiences:
Full disclaimer, these are my observations/opinions based on my experiences and skills, your milage may very. I'm no expert but I think at this point I know what I like and dislike in a rifle
Full disclosure that this is a KelTec: I did tighten all screws on the rifle and "lock-tighted" the screws on the top rail. As well as giving it a good cleaning and lubrication when I first got it home. I have had nothing come loose. And I did not clean or lube it again until I hit the 1000 round mark. The action on this rifle is a very simple and unique design due to the downward ejecting. I think this is why it's proving to be a reliable rifle.
Reliability:
The RDB has been 100% with the ammunition I had on hand, I have tried a few different mags I have had available (IWI LARs, 5/30 round PMAGS) all worked fine. I was running Federal Bulk .223 and AE 5.56.
One thing I will mention is that my friend tried a mag of .223 S&B bulk and I'm not sure if it was the primers, but it didn't like it, looked like some light strikes? (maybe really hard primers? Bad Batch? I don't know exactly, I have none of this ammo, but if you have tons of it, be wary).
It locked back on an empty mag 100% of the time for me.
No issues cramming a fully loaded LAR mag in on a closed bolt
Accuracy:
I run a Vortex Strike Eagle 1-6 (which I really don't like!!), I set up a 200 yard zero. My observations are ~2 MOA on average.
Heating the barrel up didn't increase group spread very much. However, this rifle has a non-free floated barrel and I noticed serious POI shift with a Atlas Bipod on a bench and using it on some improvised rests (Trees, rocks, etc where I really pushed my weight in to the rifle).
I would suggest if you want to run a bi-pod and if you do a majority of your shooting at a range on a bench to set up the bipod as close to the trigger guard as possible and to ensure you are not "loading" the bi-pod like you would do with a bolt gun or anything really with a free floated barrel.
I would say that this rifle meets basic accuracy requirements for a semi-auto rifle in it's class, you will hit what you are aiming at if you do your part. If you're looking for a semi-auto that will make real pretty groups on paper, move along...
Trigger: The trigger is excellent for a bull pup. Nice crisp break, no mushiness to it. People say its the best stock trigger you can get in a bull pup. I wouldn't argue with them over that point. I have shot stock triggers on other bullpups they are worse. The trigger on this rifle is better than a stock military trigger on an AR in my experience.
Ergonomics / Build Observations:
I will start by saying this rifle sports a 20inch barrel with a overall length just a "c-hair" over 30 inches. It's an excellent size, it feels solid and it does feel right in the hands to me.
This rifle is fully ambidextrous out of the box, the charging handle can be easily switch to the left or right side. Added bonus for the charging handle is that an "HK ##### Slap" is 100% doable and awesome. I highly recommend it.
The Downward ejection works (makes nice little piles) well with two caveats:
1. If you are going to shoot this rifle prone (and maybe even at a bench) long sleeves are required, you will get burned.
2. The downward ejection is awesome, but the problem is its really difficult/awkward to prove this rifle safe. This will be an issue for some people / range officers.
Recoil: Once I got the gas dialled in where I wanted it, the recoil feels almost non-existent. I would be very interested to replace the A2 Flash hider with a break and see how it feels.
Safety: It's kinda like an HK safety, it seemed too high for the thumb at first when I was doing my first shooting off the bench. However, once I removed the bench from the equation (Prone, kneeling, bringing it up from a low ready) I found the safety to be easy to manipulate and a non-issue. 1200 rounds in, I have zero concerns with it's location. AR style safety is still better though.
Other Observations:
Well guys, that's all I got. I'm happy with this rifle and it's good value at $1500. I'm guessing once the 180 craze fully takes over the Canadian market these guns will be an excellent value on the EE.
This is honestly the first NR Black rifle that I have had that is 100% reliable, I can hit what I'm aiming at and isn't over 1800 dollars. Additionally, you will not have to do anything to it or mod it in anyway for it to be fully functional. It just worked for me.
I hope this helps some of you, I would still rather have an AR-15 and I do plan to do a ATRS Modern-Sporter build. But I will keep this rifle regardless.
Cory
I've had this rifle since they came out in June and I have put approximately 1200 rounds through mine at this point. Let me share some of my thoughts / Experiences:
Full disclaimer, these are my observations/opinions based on my experiences and skills, your milage may very. I'm no expert but I think at this point I know what I like and dislike in a rifle
Full disclosure that this is a KelTec: I did tighten all screws on the rifle and "lock-tighted" the screws on the top rail. As well as giving it a good cleaning and lubrication when I first got it home. I have had nothing come loose. And I did not clean or lube it again until I hit the 1000 round mark. The action on this rifle is a very simple and unique design due to the downward ejecting. I think this is why it's proving to be a reliable rifle.
Reliability:
The RDB has been 100% with the ammunition I had on hand, I have tried a few different mags I have had available (IWI LARs, 5/30 round PMAGS) all worked fine. I was running Federal Bulk .223 and AE 5.56.
One thing I will mention is that my friend tried a mag of .223 S&B bulk and I'm not sure if it was the primers, but it didn't like it, looked like some light strikes? (maybe really hard primers? Bad Batch? I don't know exactly, I have none of this ammo, but if you have tons of it, be wary).
It locked back on an empty mag 100% of the time for me.
No issues cramming a fully loaded LAR mag in on a closed bolt
Accuracy:
I run a Vortex Strike Eagle 1-6 (which I really don't like!!), I set up a 200 yard zero. My observations are ~2 MOA on average.
Heating the barrel up didn't increase group spread very much. However, this rifle has a non-free floated barrel and I noticed serious POI shift with a Atlas Bipod on a bench and using it on some improvised rests (Trees, rocks, etc where I really pushed my weight in to the rifle).
I would suggest if you want to run a bi-pod and if you do a majority of your shooting at a range on a bench to set up the bipod as close to the trigger guard as possible and to ensure you are not "loading" the bi-pod like you would do with a bolt gun or anything really with a free floated barrel.
I would say that this rifle meets basic accuracy requirements for a semi-auto rifle in it's class, you will hit what you are aiming at if you do your part. If you're looking for a semi-auto that will make real pretty groups on paper, move along...
Trigger: The trigger is excellent for a bull pup. Nice crisp break, no mushiness to it. People say its the best stock trigger you can get in a bull pup. I wouldn't argue with them over that point. I have shot stock triggers on other bullpups they are worse. The trigger on this rifle is better than a stock military trigger on an AR in my experience.
Ergonomics / Build Observations:
I will start by saying this rifle sports a 20inch barrel with a overall length just a "c-hair" over 30 inches. It's an excellent size, it feels solid and it does feel right in the hands to me.
This rifle is fully ambidextrous out of the box, the charging handle can be easily switch to the left or right side. Added bonus for the charging handle is that an "HK ##### Slap" is 100% doable and awesome. I highly recommend it.
The Downward ejection works (makes nice little piles) well with two caveats:
1. If you are going to shoot this rifle prone (and maybe even at a bench) long sleeves are required, you will get burned.
2. The downward ejection is awesome, but the problem is its really difficult/awkward to prove this rifle safe. This will be an issue for some people / range officers.
Recoil: Once I got the gas dialled in where I wanted it, the recoil feels almost non-existent. I would be very interested to replace the A2 Flash hider with a break and see how it feels.
Safety: It's kinda like an HK safety, it seemed too high for the thumb at first when I was doing my first shooting off the bench. However, once I removed the bench from the equation (Prone, kneeling, bringing it up from a low ready) I found the safety to be easy to manipulate and a non-issue. 1200 rounds in, I have zero concerns with it's location. AR style safety is still better though.
Other Observations:
- Comes with a 10 round thermold mag. Its a good size for grabbing out of a magazine pouch and is 100% reliable
- Comes with a usable sling.
- You really don't need to do anything out of the box to this rifle, it's good enough out of the box
- Handles rain and somewhat muddy conditions just fine
- It would be an excellent truck gun. Excellent overall length, easy to get in and out of a vehicle with it.
- Can not wait to shoot some coyotes with it!!!
Well guys, that's all I got. I'm happy with this rifle and it's good value at $1500. I'm guessing once the 180 craze fully takes over the Canadian market these guns will be an excellent value on the EE.
This is honestly the first NR Black rifle that I have had that is 100% reliable, I can hit what I'm aiming at and isn't over 1800 dollars. Additionally, you will not have to do anything to it or mod it in anyway for it to be fully functional. It just worked for me.
I hope this helps some of you, I would still rather have an AR-15 and I do plan to do a ATRS Modern-Sporter build. But I will keep this rifle regardless.
Cory
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