Why wouldn't anyone want a trusted gunsmith that would get a barrel on in a hurry if you needed it? What's not to like?
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Why wouldn't anyone want a trusted gunsmith that would get a barrel on in a hurry if you needed it? What's not to like?
Everyone would love to have personal chauffeur too, but there are even less decent gunsmiths around than personal chauffeurs.
It's funny how internet talks go around. First someone asks most generic question possible and everyone is upset that there are no concrete details, yet once you give a specific constrains to chose from the debate goes directly to questioning of the constrains themselves.
It's funny how internet talks go around. First someone asks most generic question possible and everyone is upset that there are no concrete details, yet once you give a specific constrains to chose from the debate goes directly to questioning of the constrains themselves.
I really don't understand the personal chaffeur analogy. I'm in the same line as everyone else for barrels. I just plan ahead so I'm never waiting on a barrel.
Some gunsmiths are starting to offer shouldered barrels for certain actions in certain cartridges on the shelf and ready to go, for those that can't plan ahead. You will be limited to their popular/mass reamer choices and contours, but that's the disadvange of buying "off the shelf".
Some gunsmiths are starting to offer shouldered barrels for certain actions in certain cartridges on the shelf and ready to go, for those that can't plan ahead. You will be limited to their popular/mass reamer choices and contours, but that's the disadvange of buying "off the shelf".
Whether gunsmiths were rare or common isn't what I'm asking. What I'm wondering is why few would want their work done quickly instead of eventually. That just seems odd.
What makes the new 700 action not as good as the old actions? Are the tolerances more sloppy, or are there plastic parts used in the action? When upgrading then action, is it usually just a trigger upgrade? I saw a comparison between the 700 and the savage ba 110 used for the 338 lapua, and they were both very compatible.
I'm wondering why would anyone don't get this:
Why would you do all that if you can get a barrel ready to go and screw it yourself in 5 minutes?
- It takes time and money to pack and mail a rifle to a smith
- It takes time and money to ship a rifle back to you from a smith
- It takes time and money for a smith to fit a barrel
- A smith you want is usually busy, expensive and located at a significant distance
- Smiths you don't want are not that expensive and might be closer, but still first 3 points apply
- Smiths you don't want can screw up your rifle even on a simple tasks, and they do
Why would you do all that if you can get a barrel ready to go and screw it yourself in 5 minutes?
Why would I want a production level chambering job with a mystery reamer and whatever throating they guessed at, when I can drive ten minutes, wander into a shop with a gun case in one hand, a barrel in the other and dummy cartridge in my pocket and be greeted by name by an old friend?
1. If I have a Bighorn TL3, Bighorn Origin, Lone Peak, Impact, ARC Nucleus, ARC Mausingfield (after certain serial numbers), Curtis Custom, AI, DT SRS, etc. - then the gunsmith NEVER has to see the action to spin up a shouldered barrel for it. This list is growing by the week as manufacturers are improving their control on tolerances.
2. If you don't have the above actions, then the gunsmith has to see your action only ONCE. Guess what I do? I call up my gunsmith and order a shouldered barrel to my specs. He does the job and sends the barrel to my house in the mail.
3. I get control over whatever barrel blank brand I want. Not at the mercy of manufacturers making pre-fits out of the more budget blanks. I get Krieger, Bartlein, Hawkhill, Benchmark, Brux, Rock Creek at my disposal. This means I also get to choose my contour, barrel length, twist rate, etc.
4. I'm not limited to the thinner contours. My rifle balances much better with HV and MTU contour barrels. These contours are not an option for barrel nut style pre-fits.
5. I get to use the exact reamer I want, for the projectiles I'm shooting. For my 6BRA barrel, I have my gunsmith use my own reamer. For my 6.5 creedmoor barrel, I use a gunsmiths reamer that is optimized for the 140 Bergers I shoot. It shoots lights out. I'm not at the mercy of prefits which use a generic reamer which is designed to handled most projectiles, but not excel at any given one.
6. I get control over who spins up my barrel - arguably the most important piece of a precision rifle. It's not threaded and chambered in a mass produced factory, by a guy who may or may not know what he is doing.
7. And guess what? My barrels show up in the mail, just like your prefits do. No need to send my gun off to the gunsmith.
I'm of the opinion that the outcome of all of the above makes for a better product. Yes, prefits are generally cheaper (there's a reason for that). And yes, you have to have proper planning to ensure your new shouldered barrel arrives before you burn out your current one, but that is pretty simple logistics.
I can understand why people may want barrel nut pre-fits, and that's fine. You are obviously happy with your pre-fits, and that's all that should matter to you. I'm happy that it does what you need it to. But let's stop pretending that shouldered barrels are such an inconvenience to order and install. That simply isn't true.
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Kthomas
You are tempting me to go shouldered barrel for my 6.5 build.
How do you know when to stop screwing on a shouldered barrel, go by headspace gauge or by torque?
I imagine since theres no barrel nut, you lock the barrel in a barrel vice then spin the action on with an action wrench?
You are tempting me to go shouldered barrel for my 6.5 build.
How do you know when to stop screwing on a shouldered barrel, go by headspace gauge or by torque?
I imagine since theres no barrel nut, you lock the barrel in a barrel vice then spin the action on with an action wrench?
Man, I should've bought a lotto ticket... my poor old crappy saavage 10 feeds dead bones reliably from AICS mags, extracts everything, hasn't had a single light strike, and shoots outstanding groups with every JC prefit I've run on it.
Put your money where you see fit. If you have Ferarri tastes, buy a Ferarri, but if you're a ####ty driver, it won't get you down the road any better than that Mustang.
A good barrel, reloading properly and spending time putting rounds down range are where you will be best putting your $.
I cant afford a Ferarri, but I'll be damned if I cant run a helluva quarter mile with "####ty, inferior, garbage" product.
Put your money where you see fit. If you have Ferarri tastes, buy a Ferarri, but if you're a ####ty driver, it won't get you down the road any better than that Mustang.
A good barrel, reloading properly and spending time putting rounds down range are where you will be best putting your $.
I cant afford a Ferarri, but I'll be damned if I cant run a helluva quarter mile with "####ty, inferior, garbage" product.
The shouldered barrel will "shoulder" up to your action. Generally you will go to a pre-determined torque as specified by your gunsmith. Some bench rest shooters even just go hand tight. I torque mine 80-100 ft-lbs.
No need for go/no go gauges. An action wrench, torque wrench and barrel vice is all that is required. You can even get flats machined near the muzzle of the barrel, and use a big crescent wrench to take your barrel on and off.
It's really simple, takes me probably no more than 2 minutes to do. I swap between my 6.5 Creedmoor and 6BRA barrel on my match gun all the time.
Quite honestly I don't know what you asked anymore. You seem to have a vendetta against shouldered barrels, which I don't understand.
Yes, some of the actions that I mentioned are Savage threads. You don't need a barrel nut to have a gunsmith spin you up a barrel for those actions. You can used shouldered barrels, which I've outlined the advantages on.
Quite frankly I don't care what threads the action has, as that really doesn't matter to me. Glad you found out what you asked. Whatever the h*ll that is.
Now that the pros and cons of shouldered barrels and Savage style barrel nut barrels has been flushed out, everyone can move on.
I'm vocal against Savage as quite frankly there are a lot better budget options coming out these days. They are a poor value proposition when compared to it's peers. That's a fact. The precision rifle budget market has been exploding the past 2 years, and Savages have long been surpassed.
Although i may not care so much for Savage's, I care about having quality products that I can depend on, which is why I buy what I buy and endorse. I care about training, which is why I pursue professional precision rifle training every year. I care about putting what I practice to test in real applications, to see what does and doesn't work - that is why I compete at national level PRS events.
Those are the things I care about. I also care about steering people in the right direction for precision rifles. I've learned a lot from when I first picked up a rifle to where I am at now, and sadly it seems that the Canadian precision rifle community is 10+ years behind the USA in training, doctrine and in some cases equipment. Pretty apparent to me after spending so much time between both borders.
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That's the wife's rifle that has the Lone Peak Fuzion. Still at the gunsmith as we had to wait for the latest generation of the action to be produced.
She started with a TL-3 but hated it at first touch (and quite frankly so did I) so we sold that barreled action. By all reports the Fuzion has rave reviews. The one I got to put my hands on at the Quiet Riot PRS match felt very nice - that match had high winds with horrible fine dust. That Lone Peak ate the dust right up, you couldn't tell that it ate so much dust without any cleaning. I was impressed.
I'm looking forward for the wife to get her rifle. My gunsmith says I'm going to want to get rid of my Mausingfield once we get her Lone Peak Fuzion.
