3gunners rebelling towards 2guns

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667 said:
One gun, two gun or more...
I'll leave it up to the .005% of shooters who actually set up and run matches decide.
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tomo333 said:
EXACTLY. If you don't like the way someone is running a match and you have oh so many ideas to make it better, smoother, faster etc. then run your own.
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tomo333 said:
Can tell by this comment you haven't run too many matches. so now you want to have multiple stage descriptions?
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Could not agree more. It’s always the same guys with the same crew that plan, set up, MD and RO matches. A single day 2 or 3G match takes at least 6 hrs to set up.
I encourage anyone who shoots 2 or 3G to actively volunteer in their group. It takes pressure off the guys who do it repeatedly and helps with introducing new ideas to stage designs. If all you do is come out and shoot a match, you’re really not getting the full idea of what happens behind the scenes.
 
Yycbulletsandbrass said:
I posted this in another thread. What's wrong with allowing competitors to shoot the same stages as the 3 gun shooters but do so with pistol and rifle only. Ignoring the shotgun targets? That would allow the option and wouldn't require any more or less setup? The 2 gun shooters would be a division on their own.
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Here is what we do: you don’t want to shoot the shotgun portion? No problem at all. Naturally we count the ftes and ftns and add them to your score but if that doesn’t bother you it sure as heck doesn’t bother us...in fact it means less resetting so I might start encouraging it ;).

Seriously though, we have a couple of G3G members who can’t shoot shotgun for health reasons (one has a shoulder issue, the other has a detached retina). Far be it for me to tell them they can’t play. People who compete in multigun events generally fall into one of two categories: those who want to have a great time, and those who want to have a great time. The definition is up to you.
 
Just imagine how many matches we would have if every person that shot a 3 Gun match helped at another one with setup, tear down, RO, MD, Scorekeeper or whatever was needed.
Oh Utopia!!
 
Innavedaw said:
Are we expecting the guns to do something if no one is looking? I've only had supervision at a pre-load table at an IPSC Shotgun match (where only the on deck shooter could pre-load)...every other match I've shot with pre-loads, guns were loaded and left on the table until they were staged / brought to the firing line. I've not ever seen or heard of an issue arising from that.
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Of course not. But we all know a lot of the rules are about the optics of safety. Similarly, what’s wrong with carrying a Condition 1-3 handgun in a holster during a match? A holster is the safest place for a loaded handgun but it’s not allowed in any match I know of.
We all know that 99.99% of the time, nothing will happen but it’s the 0.01% that will be plastered all over the news. Having someone to watch over preloaded guns just adds that little safety element ...whatever that means.
 
Still alive said:
Of course not. But we all know a lot of the rules are about the optics of safety. Similarly, what’s wrong with carrying a Condition 1-3 handgun in a holster during a match? A holster is the safest place for a loaded handgun but it’s not allowed in any match I know of.
We all know that 99.99% of the time, nothing will happen but it’s the 0.01% that will be plastered all over the news. Having someone to watch over preloaded guns just adds that little safety element ...whatever that means.
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Difference between a holster and a preload table is that the preload table is not strapped to your waist while you run around the range resetting targets etc.

Handguns falling out of holsters unintentionally is definitely a thing while any gun jumping off a table on its own is not.
 
I see no problem with the notion of running thru the 3 gun stage and skipping all the shotgun targets as a special 2 gun division. Like mentioned, not only would we not have to reset all the shotgun targets .. but the 2 gun guys would cycle thru the stage slightly faster too. The only inconvenience would be setting up the division in the scoring system. But I dont think that would be a big deal either. The club I'm apart of has gone full digital anyways.

The one unfortunate problem I do see however is finding a club that would bother to accommodate 2 gun in the first place. Most clubs here in Alberta have a cap to their match attendance already in place, which means there's already enough people willing to participate in the 3 gun division alone that in order for a club to make room for 2 gunners, theyd be booting out 3gunners who want to attend the setup they already have in place!
 
pauls said:
Difference between a holster and a preload table is that the preload table is not strapped to your waist while you run around the range resetting targets etc.

Handguns falling out of holsters unintentionally is definitely a thing while any gun jumping off a table on its own is not.
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I do get it. A handgun falling out of a properly made and fitted holster is likely more to occur during an actual stage when the competitor is going full speed than during a reset. But an unsupervised table of loaded guns may be handled by an unwary spectator. Again, very very unlikely but, like I said, it’s mostly for the optics of safety. Anyways, this is what I’ve seen in BC matches. Other locales may vary with their rules.
Either way, it’s no skin off my back. I go with whatever rules the MD sets.
 
2 gun is the way to go.
Its only natural... we only have 2 hands.

Besides, 3gun just condones and promotes the toxic masculinity that is plaguing society.
 
Yycbulletsandbrass said:
What's wrong with allowing competitors to shoot the same stages as the 3 gun shooters but do so with pistol and rifle only. Ignoring the shotgun targets? That would allow the option and wouldn't require any more or less setup? The 2 gun shooters would be a division on their own.
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I see no problem with it. I think I may have run a match or two just like that. I think it was as PPC/Handgun/rimfire event, but. that was my decision as MD.
 
I'd like to see use of slings or less use of staging tables

In the case of 2 gun matches if the pistol is meant to be shot first then the rifle can be slung unloaded.
 
I think maybe some more 2 gun matches are in order:

Shotgun/rifle
Shotgun/pistol
Shotgun/PCC

This should solve everyone's fears of actually learning how to shoot and load Shotgun....
Oh yeah....lots of unloaded Shotgun starts....:evil:
 
Djb1 said:
I'd like to see use of slings or less use of staging tables

In the case of 2 gun matches if the pistol is meant to be shot first then the rifle can be slung unloaded.
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Everyone has and us entitled to an opinion.

I do not like slings.
They bring nothing to the game(s) and are not worth the hassle.
It's one thing to look all cool an' s*** standing around with a slung rifle.... It's an entirely different thing to be able to safely navigate a COF with a slung gun.
Been there done that.... Hate it.
YMMV
 
Yeah, shotgun is hard.
The recoil of target loads can be a little much, and learning to reload is tough.

Here's proof:
[youtube]wZE-EDGw2vo[/youtube]
 
Many who ask me about 2 gun at my club (because heaven forbid someone else MD's a match) dont have a shotgun, or a competitive shotgun but have a rifle and handgun.

Id have no problem with 2 gun rifle/pistol and it saves costs in clays. I dont have any issue with 3 gun though either.
 
pauls said:
Yeah, shotgun is hard.
The recoil of target loads can be a little much, and learning to reload is tough.
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Interesting non-sequitur. Thank you for your input? No one is saying shooting a shotgun is hard, the discussion is revolving around match set-up, and equipment cost/usage? I doubt the competitor in your video purchased her own gear, or set up 45lb. pepper poppers. It was an amazing vid when it came out though, I wonder how she's doing now?
On 3gun shotgun usage, I will say it's a dedicated piece of equipment, with dedicated gear. I can understand the cost angle. Fun as heck though:).
 
Not aware what the girl in the video, Caitlin Francis, is up to these days, but I shot with 15 year old Dakota Overland at BRM3G in October, who is about the same size as Caitlin...and WOW!...she was unbelievably confident and skilled and totally kicked butt. In addition to 3G, she’s also a sponsored IPSC Shotgun and USPSA competitor. And her 17 year old twig skinny b/f Riley was pretty incredible as well. My take away from watching these amazing Juniors compete in one of the top 3G matches in N. America was its all about practice and confidence.

Think the majority mostly (half-ass) practice the stuff they are relatively good at and avoid the stuff they are weak in, because they don’t want to get out of their comfort zone. My first shotgun match I got my butt kicked...but man did I have fun...and I got totally hooked.
 
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