Hi All, I have an STI Lawman 4.0 in 9mm and have spoken to a couple of IPSC shooters about using it for the classic division (I only shoot on production so far). Anyway, they advised me not to do it as apparently a 4.25" barrel has a lot of recoil and harder to hit targets due to its short sight radius. Their other advise is to get rid of the commander and buy a full size pistol. I am new to IPSC and just learning to be a good shooter so any input would be greatly appreciated. I would like to ask other IPSC shooters here on their experiences with using this kind of platform for IPSC competitions.
Using of a Commander Size 9mm 1911 for IPSC
- Thread starter chavacano
- Start date
Screw that. Shoot what you have. There are 100 things to learn and work on before recoil management will be the thing that holds you back. Get out there, shoot, gain experience. Take a course or two if you can. Learn how to shoot, and the other 100 things in IPSC, and "upgrade" your gun down the road if you want to. 
Back in the day, a US shooter from Wenatchee, Washington used to attend our IPSC matches on the coast. He shot a matched pair of .45 ACP Colt Combat Commanders done by King Precision Gunworks. He kicked a lot of a$$ with the full sized 1911s and yes, he was shooting a major 230 gr load.
I have two Remington Commanders in .45 ACP, one blued, one SS. I shoot them in IDPA against the 9mms whose only advantage is mag capacity. In my opinion, the Commander is the size the 1911 should have been made in from the get go.
I have two Remington Commanders in .45 ACP, one blued, one SS. I shoot them in IDPA against the 9mms whose only advantage is mag capacity. In my opinion, the Commander is the size the 1911 should have been made in from the get go.
Still alive
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Rainy mosquito infested part of BC
You're a new shooter by your post. No matter what you shoot, you likely wont be competitive against the other more experienced shooters anyways. As long as the gun is reliable, use it! Look on the bright side, if you can shoot a Commander well, your future Shadow will be a piece of cake!
The one thing I would change on your gun is get good hi viz FO sights. And reliable mags.
The one thing I would change on your gun is get good hi viz FO sights. And reliable mags.
- Location
- Maple Ridge, BC
you can tune a 9mm 1911 to shoot soft with a nice mild load. if you don't reload check FOC's low-recoil 9mm. Might have to chrono to ensure it makes PF out of your particular pistol
Thank you all for the input. I started shooting on IPSC last year using a shadow 2 but I have used 1911's for concealed carrry prior to me moving here to Canada. After seeing a lot of shooters using 2011 and 1911 in IPSC, my past history with the 1911 was piqued, hence me getting a 1911 in commander size
This is my first year if IPSC.
There is so much to learn about competing, that for a newbie the pistol does not matter much, so long as you can shoot and reload it. An all steel Commander would probably have less recoil than Tupperware pistol.
Shoot it and enjoy the sport.
There is so much to learn about competing, that for a newbie the pistol does not matter much, so long as you can shoot and reload it. An all steel Commander would probably have less recoil than Tupperware pistol.
Shoot it and enjoy the sport.
You can shoot whatever you want; the primary determinant for your performance will be you (rather than your gear). Ross Seyfried won an IPSC World Championship with a Commander-length 1911, IIRC, but that doesn't mean that a shorter pistol isn't a competitive disadvantage. Your competition-minded advisers - in recommending a full-size pistol - were merely assuming that you'd prefer to have every possible advantage.
in additional how reliable your gun is out weights how long the barrel or how much recoil... A jam or malfunction will cost you time and completely disrupt your flow and stage planning.
Shoot with the gun you most confident with. Your goal is to land all your shots in alpha zones as fast as possible (and avoid the no-shoot) so who cares if it is dead center or touching the edge
Shoot with the gun you most confident with. Your goal is to land all your shots in alpha zones as fast as possible (and avoid the no-shoot) so who cares if it is dead center or touching the edge
A steel frame Commander in 9mm is a pussy cat.
Seyfried did NOT shoot a Commander-size 1911. He won his matches shooting a standard 5" length barrel, tuned by Pachmayr, if I recall correctly. He was billeted at the same home in Newport News, Virginia along with me and another members of the Canadian Team the year he lost the title. Richard Heinie was there as well. There was a lot of talk about guns and loads, etc. He shot 5.1/231 with a 230 gr LRN as did most of the top guns of the era.
BTW - back in the day, IPSC rules required that 1/4 of a match score be comprised of 'draw & fire' exercises. We shot single rd draw & fire out as far as 25 yds in 2 second time frames from a 'hands up' start and if you didn't shoot all 'A's, you didn't make the cut, 6" groups not being all that rare. We also shot out to 50 yds with a slightly more generous time frame.
Gun mods consisted of hi viz sights, lowered/dimpled ejection ports, tuned extractors, long ejectors and trigger jobs; checkering and beveled mag well if you could afford it. Many shot guns with just sights and trigger jobs. It was a different game than today, not yet devolved from Jeff Cooper's "Combat Pistol Shooting" philosophy before the "gamesmen" took over and it morphed into what the game is today.
oooh boy there is some history! Thanks Sharps '74
as others have said, hit the decks with your commander, wonder if it would be suited for Classic? I claim high ignorance when it comes to the jammomatic, err I mean 1911, but I'm sure either Standard or Classic will work for you and your guns.
as others have said, hit the decks with your commander, wonder if it would be suited for Classic? I claim high ignorance when it comes to the jammomatic, err I mean 1911, but I'm sure either Standard or Classic will work for you and your guns.
In that era, you could count on having to shoot weak handed in 'draw & fire' as well. The game was quite athletic then, requiring going over 6' barricades, shooting while hanging onto a rope from either side of a wall, prone, etc. We had a US Viet Nam vet at one of our Nationals who was on crutches having lost a leg as a door gunner. He threw his crutches over the wall, climbed over, leaned against the wall to shoot, retrieved his crutches and moved on. Watching him brought a lump to your throat.
We told him he could have a by on the obstacles and he said - "No one over there gave me a break and damned if you're going to." Made the couch potatoes cringe who thought things were too tough for them.
I remember shooters from the "Rainier Combat Team" of Seattle going prone to shoot single draw & fire at 25 yds! No sh!t. And they made it in 2-1/2 seconds. They wore a military style uniform that consisted of tan pants and shirt with crests and creases that would make a Marine proud. Several were vets.
Yeah, it was a different game then, not necessarily better, just different, the emphasis now being on close, quick & dirty. The .45 ACP ruled and the 9mm was almost a joke. Trigger jobs were a dark science, hit or miss depending on the 'smith. One told me he lost money on every trigger job. Now it's expected a 1911 will have a decent pull out of the box as well as the basic mods that were once hi tech.
We told him he could have a by on the obstacles and he said - "No one over there gave me a break and damned if you're going to." Made the couch potatoes cringe who thought things were too tough for them.
I remember shooters from the "Rainier Combat Team" of Seattle going prone to shoot single draw & fire at 25 yds! No sh!t. And they made it in 2-1/2 seconds. They wore a military style uniform that consisted of tan pants and shirt with crests and creases that would make a Marine proud. Several were vets.
Yeah, it was a different game then, not necessarily better, just different, the emphasis now being on close, quick & dirty. The .45 ACP ruled and the 9mm was almost a joke. Trigger jobs were a dark science, hit or miss depending on the 'smith. One told me he lost money on every trigger job. Now it's expected a 1911 will have a decent pull out of the box as well as the basic mods that were once hi tech.
Figured I would respawn an old thread as I feel it is relevant in the Canadian world of fools where the guns you have are the guns you are stuck with to compete. I agree with many here that, if you are comfortable with a commander 1911 and can shoot it accurately 3/4 of an inch won't be that significant. I am stuck with using a Aluminum frame! commander next weekend to shoot classic minor because my "good" match pistol is in 45 and the 8 round limit IS significant. The trick to being good at Practical pistol is repetition. Dry fire for speed then live fire to learn what you need to see quicker and how to control recoil. That is how to transition between decent to good to great. And the gun just need to do what you want it do do 100% of the time. It needs to cycle every single time. Feed, fire, eject feed and drop mags the rest you will only get from effort and sticking to one platform. I'll let you know how the match went. I usually shoot prod optics, will be very interesting,
It's a 9mm. There is no "lot of recoil". Use it and enjoy the match. - dan
