Mysterious CIL 950T! Help!

Irons78

Irons78

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Hi all - I bought this 950T from an online auction awhile back, and I'm stumped as to what action model this is. It's a single shot, currently chambered in 223 with a super heavy bull barrel, and sitting in an epoxy bedded target stock! The trigger is extremely light and with minimal effort it shoots ragged hole groups with 40gr Amax bullets and 26.6gr of Varget at 100yds. The throat is very short so bullet weight/length is pretty much limited to 55gr. I loaded some 68gr HPBT and they were set WAY back into the case and were tumbling on paper. The barrel is 28" and 3 full turns of the cleaning rod tells me it's a 1:9.3 twist. It's a very peculiar rifle. Current plan is to take it to the local smith and have it throated for longer/heavier bullets.

Anyways here's some pics, and curious to get feedback on what action model this is. I'm specifically curious as I'd like to put this into a nicer stock but no idea what inletting model to order!

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made by savage for CIL and possibly the ontario rifle association way way back, that's not the factory barrel, it would have had a barrel with a savage style barrel nut on on. That is the original 50's style fully adjustable savage trigger before they got cheap, nice find.
The bolt head is slightly different on that rifle then a standard savage and the bolt faces are not interchangeable without some work. All 950T actions are long actions as well.
 
Nice. Someone added a middle screw as well as they originally only came with two. Triggers are fully adjustable.
What does the stock look like?
 
Buckmastr said:
Nice. Someone added a middle screw as well as they originally only came with two. Triggers are fully adjustable.
What does the stock look like?
Click to expand...

It appears to be a maple laminate with some sort of lacquer clear coat. The middle screw you mentioned is strange, as on this stock it appears integral to the action. The trigger guard is held in place by the rear action screw and a long departed wood screw!

As ugly as it all looks, the rifle is solid when assembled and torqued, and shoots incredible groups with light bullets. Go figure.

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that's a typical prone stock, there are lots out there exactly the same made from the same laminate, some may know who made them if they are not factory, possibly Rempil from out west or possibly someone else back east
 
Buckmastr said:
I just re-did the same rifle in 223 Rem as well. Refinished an original 950 t stock and cerekoted the rest of it.
https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/1842016-My-CIL-950T-project
What kind of stock did you have in mind?
Boyds should inlet for it. I believe it's the intermediate action length.
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Oh man, drooling over that refinished stock! I was thinking either Boyds or B&C.

I think this rifle needs the throat lengthened to shoot heavier bullets. The 1:9 twist is being "wasted" on 40 grain bullets no? In that regard, here's a pic of some load development 3 shot groups with Varget and 40gr AMAX at 100yds. I was using a SWFA fixed 10x.

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Yeah the stock turned out pretty good. Thanks.
For whatever reason the throat in my rifle is also shorter than I would like. 9 twist as well with 70 gr bergers seated to 2.30". 20 thou jam or so!
I should have checked this before getting it painted as it would have been an easy throat job. But it shoots good and I'm just going to live with it as I can still get over 3000 fps with very little if any powder compaction.
Mine also shot 40 gr Fiocchi vmax factory loads into a 0.5" when I first scoped it.
Looks like yours is a good shooter too. It's a great day with a good rifle when several 22 calibre bullets find their way into a single hole!
 
Buckmastr said:
Yeah the stock turned out pretty good. Thanks.
For whatever reason the throat in my rifle is also shorter than I would like. 9 twist as well with 70 gr bergers seated to 2.30". 20 thou jam or so!
I should have checked this before getting it painted as it would have been an easy throat job. But it shoots good and I'm just going to live with it as I can still get over 3000 fps with very little if any powder compaction.
Mine also shot 40 gr Fiocchi vmax factory loads into a 0.5" when I first scoped it.
Looks like yours is a good shooter too. It's a great day with a good rifle when several 22 calibre bullets find their way into a single hole!
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Absolutely! I might just refinish the stock and stain it and clean up/sand some of the lines. Still debating on throating it, I'd like to shoot out to 300 one day!
 
It would be interesting to see how that laminate would take a dark stain if stripped and sanded a bit.
These old heavy single shots sure shoot well. And considering the price when compared to a rem 40x single shot...
I’ll even admit to shooting a savage.
Good luck on your build, keep us posted.
 
What twist is in that barrel?
it is not a factory job obviously, as the 950T came in 308, and the barrel nut has been deleted.
The third action screw was a popular addition back in the day.
Nice prone stock as well
That is a Savage J action BTW , and they shoot very well right out to 1K with irons.
Cat
 
Barrel is 1:9.3. Thanks for the note about the 3rd action screw, that was really the mystery! I'm thinking with 3 action screws that receiver will be extra solid within the stock.
 
Irons78 said:
Barrel is 1:9.3. Thanks for the note about the 3rd action screw, that was really the mystery! I'm thinking with 3 action screws that receiver will be extra solid within the stock.
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1:9.3 sounds like a good barrel for the 69 grain Sierras.
That is exactly the reason the third screw was installed in many match rifles, the theory is to keep the action as evenly bedded as possible in the stock .
When you consider the amount of strain on the action from that heavy barrel, and the amount of flex that a stock can get, it would seem to make sense.
Dunn if it works or not as my scores can be as lousy with three action screws as two! LOL!
I was told once they were put in because the Savage rear screw is behind the trigger, but I also have two Sportcos that have three screws.........
Cat
 
catnthehatt said:
1:9.3 sounds like a good barrel for the 69 grain Sierras.
That is exactly the reason the third screw was installed in many match rifles, the theory is to keep the action as evenly bedded as possible in the stock .
When you consider the amount of strain on the action from that heavy barrel, and the amount of flex that a stock can get, it would seem to make sense.
Dunn if it works or not as my scores can be as lousy with three action screws as two! LOL!
I was told once they were put in because the Savage rear screw is behind the trigger, but I also have two Sportcos that have three screws.........
Cat
Click to expand...

Just picked the CIL up from the smith, had the throat extended to fit 69gr match bullets. Now the fun adventure of load development all over again lol!

Was wondering what your opinion is on the order of tightening down the screws? I'm thinking torque in the area of 50 inch pounds? I might also relieve some material at the back to float the tang. Any advice appreciated!
 
start at the front most screw ( closest to the recoil lug) tighten all 3 to 10 inch pounds, then tighten the front and middle to 40 inch pounds going up 10 inch pounds at a time.

load some mid range ammo all the same and shoot groups while adjusting the rear screw up 5 inch pounds at a time until the groups shrink right down, if they open back up then loosen the rear screw and retorque to the sweet spot, now start your load development
 
Irons78 said:
Just picked the CIL up from the smith, had the throat extended to fit 69gr match bullets. Now the fun adventure of load development all over again lol!

Was wondering what your opinion is on the order of tightening down the screws? I'm thinking torque in the area of 50 inch pounds? I might also relieve some material at the back to float the tang. Any advice appreciated!
Click to expand...
Like YoDave stated, screw torque is very subtle, much like changing the brace height on a stick bow- too much at a time and you go right past the sweet spot!
And every rifle can be a bit different as well, so go slow , log your sequence and results, so when you do get a good point you can replicate it.:cool:
Cat
 
So as Cat knows, my father was a reputable long range shooter and owned one of these CIL 950T rifles which was his 6.5 BR rifle in the end, with an RKS gain twist barrel that shot incredibly well with 107gr SMK.

However, his lone .223 long range rifle which is a Remington 788 had a 28.5" barrel that gives 3 full turns on the cleaning rod = 9.5 twist. He shot 80gr SMK's i believe out to a 1000. I am a small bore shooter so am out of my element when discussing all the ballistic numbers. i just relay this information as your barrel seems very similar and you may want to consider an even heavier bullet, depending on the distance you are shooting.

its interesting how even an extra .25 revolution makes a difference ... at 3.25 revolutions it computes to an 8.75 twist....
i'm open to all other's observations on all this math...
Ciao!
 
yodave said:
start at the front most screw ( closest to the recoil lug) tighten all 3 to 10 inch pounds, then tighten the front and middle to 40 inch pounds going up 10 inch pounds at a time.

load some mid range ammo all the same and shoot groups while adjusting the rear screw up 5 inch pounds at a time until the groups shrink right down, if they open back up then loosen the rear screw and retorque to the sweet spot, now start your load development
Click to expand...

Thank you sir! I'll be sure to jot this info down in the CIL rifle notebook. Glad I asked the questions, lots of help here!
 
Sorry for the late reply, just came across this post. I can tell you a little more about the stock, but not sure about who fitted it to the barreled action.

The stock is, or resembles exactly a Hans Adlhoch laminate stock. Hans lived in Victoria, was a cabinet maker as far as I recall and shot small Bore for Canada in the 1976 Olympic Games as well as multiple other world level events. I met Hans when I started back into Full Bore shooting in the 90’s. He had a great sense of humour, was a fairly unconventional personality and a great shot.

ht tps. ://olympic.ca/team-canada/hans-adlhoch/

Some of the 3P influences show in the pistol grip angle and wide fore end.

He made up those stocks in a very simple low cost laminate and handful of BC shooters used them years back. I have one sitting in my safe right now.

The bedding and pillar installation looks a little rougher than what I saw as examples of his work or other local guys so I’m not sure who did the fitting and bedding. A shooter from Washington state had him make up one of those stocks in a beautiful two tone Walnut and it was finished to perfection. Otherwise they were the light Color as seen in yours.

Hope that helps shed a little light.
 
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