45/70 Newbie help after first ladder test

Potshot21

Potshot21

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Moose Country, Ontario
Hello CGN,

I finally got a chance to shoot some loads I worked up for my Marlin 1895 45/70.

I loaded up 325 gr. Hornady FTX bullets atop IMR-4198 and CCI 200 primers. I was following Hornady's manual and loaded 10 rounds for each of the following charge weights:
-45.8 grain
-46.9 grain
-47.4 grain
-47.9 grain (max)

The manual said that at 47.9 grains should yield 2150 fps, however my chrony had the average at 1967 fps. None of the cases showed any pressure signs. Additionally, 47.9 grains gave me the best grouping save for the one flyer that I pulled.

So now that I have that all done, I'm wondering where to go from here. I'm tempted to slowly creep up on the max charge weight to get some more velocity out of my projectiles and see if the groups continue to shrink. At the same time, I still relatively green to the reloading game and am a little uncertain if that's the right thing to do. I like the idea of faster moving bullets, but I also like my face and hands being intact!

Any advice from the seasoned veterans out there would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!
 
Not sure I’ve heard fast and 45/70 in the same sentence....

I’m not a reloading guy but a 45/70 guy, I love my 450gr buffalo bore heavy hitters, you don’t pay to see George Foreman to hit the speed bag you pay to see him knock the heavy bag off the chains!
 
The load in the Manual was Max for 'their' barrel. If you have no pressure signs then I'd work it up a bit higher if you want to see if the group shrinks some more.

That said 2000fps from a 45-70 must be a bit of a whack.

FWIW Lyman 50th has same bullet, same powder Min 38.2 (1581fps) Max 41.5 (1796fps) - they also have a caveat regarding trimming brass shorter with that bullet to maintain an acceptable OAL for the lever action.
 
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How long is your barrel? As mentioned, factory test barrels are typically 24". If you're shooting an 18" barrel, velocity will be affected. Try setting g a cardboard box around your target and fire from 25-30yrds. See how much, if any un-burnt powder you can find. If there is, you're pretty much at max for that powder. You can of course try different powders and bullets. I tend to favour 400gr SN Speers for hunting and cast for plinking.
 
According to the Hornady manual, it is in fact the same rifle and barrel length that I'm using.

So if barrel length is the same, I'm curious why am not getting the extra 110 fps out of the same charge weight.
 
There are a number of reasons for stats to be off including age of the powder, type/quality of primer, weather, equipment failure (yours or theirs), etc. You mentioned hunting. The numbers you are getting are more than plenty for any game on this continent��. If it's accurate, go for it. Other than that, try another batch on a warm sunny day and see what results you get.
 
Yes, my goal for this loading is hunting moose/deer/bear at a maximum range of 150 yards. I suppose you make a good point, according to their ballistic calculator, the increase in velocity only yields an extra 40 foot-lbs at 150 yards. I'll try and load up the same again and try again on a nicer day and see if it makes a difference. Perhaps it is best not to push it too far.
 
Each barrel is different, there will always be a velocity difference between barrels. Also temperature has more effect on velocity than you might realize, and this effect varies with different loads. Guarantee the velocity in the manuals were recorded in summer temperatures, probably indoors. Your conditions at this time of year were likely much colder = lower velocity. Don't sweat it, with the 45/70 velocity isn't really a factor on game, either for killing effectiveness or maximum practical range.
 
Well I managed to get out again today with some fresh reloads. It's either my chronograph seeing low speeds, or simply I'm not getting the same velocity as in the manual. Either way I think I dialed in on a good hunting load! One of my test groups came in under an inch. Probably just a fluke, was pretty hard seeing these targets today with the aperture sights, but still plenty accurate enough for tagging out game.
 
Potshot21 said:
Well I managed to get out again today with some fresh reloads. It's either my chronograph seeing low speeds, or simply I'm not getting the same velocity as in the manual. Either way I think I dialed in on a good hunting load! One of my test groups came in under an inch. Probably just a fluke, was pretty hard seeing these targets today with the aperture sights, but still plenty accurate enough for tagging out game.
Click to expand...

Under an inch?? Holy smokes, with a 45-70 I'm happy with an MOA of pie plate!! Well done sir.
 
IMHO, pretty much any 45-70 load will very quickly drop an NA critter. If it were me, I'd simply go with the most accurate load, and learn its ballistics if you go much past 100 yds. The extra hitting power won't do much, as the critter won't notice much difference in the initial shock, and if the billet goes through, then any leftover power is simply wasted. The ideal scenario would be the bullet just coming out the other side and dropping on the ground right there, to give you a exit wound for tracking.
 
I agree, I'm not too concerned with pushing it any further. I've noticed when loaded up to the high end, it looks as though the brass about a 1/4 inch from the rim and up is being stretched/stressed. No bulge in the cases, but there is a visible change in appearance of the brass.

The rifle is most likely quite more accurate than I am to be sure. However, that is the best group in recent memory with this rifle, and I'm even more satisfied that I managed it with open sights! I've been practicing alot more with them and it may be starting to pay off some.

So I ended up with:
47.5 grains of IMR-4198
325 grain Hornady FTX
1960 fps/avg

I think that'll tip em over good enough at the ranges I've set.
 
Ashcroft said:
Each barrel is different, there will always be a velocity difference between barrels. Also temperature has more effect on velocity than you might realize, and this effect varies with different loads. Guarantee the velocity in the manuals were recorded in summer temperatures, probably indoors. Your conditions at this time of year were likely much colder = lower velocity. Don't sweat it, with the 45/70 velocity isn't really a factor on game, either for killing effectiveness or maximum practical range.
Click to expand...

I have pretty much always found published data (especially factory ammo) to be a tad optimistic.
 
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