45 lc

My understanding is they’ll no longer do that for firearms that are of a restricted caliber presently, and converted by you or your gunsmith.
 
Wally1966 said:
I think the conflicting information presented as of late, is full of holes.
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What part of the conflicting information are you referring to?

I sent a PM to Newby asking that he start a thread here so we can sort this act out, as his experience is contrary to what most of us have seen over the last while.

It would be in the best interests of the antique community to know where we stand as to the current state of things.
 
Far as I have understood, about 2014 when that big Swiss debate and regulation took change, so did the RCMP's interpretation of Antiques and the conversions that were going on with them. Before 2014, a guy could convert 45colt pre-98's and get Antique status. Could convert 38-40's, 44-40's etc into non listed calibers and get antique status for them too. AFTER 2014 & the interpretation change the only ones that qualify are pre-98 guns that began life from manufacturer in the now obsolete 41colt, 44 russian, 455 eley etc etc... those all remain antique and can be converted to any non listed (other) caliber if you wish, just like before, and still remain an antique.

I myself had my last letter done by the cfc on a Colt 8-10 months ago I guess, and there were no issues getting it at all. Albiet, it was just a plain old obsolete 41colt. I choose to letter mine on the simple fact that Officers recognize the format they're printed in, and I do carry mine for ranch-work, so I'd rather have the letter along in case of a confrontation someplace along the way and am checked for having such a sixgun along ... That said, I too have an ATC for trapline carry but it's strictly related to trapline carry (only). I have and do expect to run into CO's going forward and I can tell you from experience that they are happy to see (Antique status) paperwork with the RCMP emblem on it that's laid out in such similar fashion to what the ATC's they see for trappers & forestry n whatnot are. Officers are-not as unfamiliar with individuals carrying legal restricteds holding ATC's as what people are led to believe. There are more ATC's issued and out n about than most people realize.

Anyway. So no, the antique status letters aren't mandatory paperwork to have [and the techs at the cfc will tell you that too], BUT, because they're so similar and recognizable comparing to the way an ATC layout is done (which officers do see), they're easy legitimate insurance to have and keep along in any case where you may get checked out for having something on your hip... I have been checked, questions asked and conversations ensued, but by my RCMP status letter, all was deemed 100% and everyone went along their way A-ok. The point of the letter simply and 100% being just to simply things if a guy's ever checked out. It comes down to the individual whether or not you feel that's enough reason to get one... but it's surely why I have 'em on mine
 
whiskeywillow said:
Far as I have understood, about 2014 when that big Swiss debate and regulation took change, so did the RCMP's interpretation of Antiques and the conversions that were going on with them. Before 2014, a guy could convert 45colt pre-98's and get Antique status. Could convert 38-40's, 44-40's etc into non listed calibers and get antique status for them too. AFTER 2014 & the interpretation change the only ones that qualify are pre-98 guns that began life from manufacturer in the now obsolete 41colt, 44 russian, 455 eley etc etc... those all remain antique and can be converted to any non listed (other) caliber if you wish, just like before, and still remain an antique.

I myself had my last letter done by the cfc on a Colt 8-10 months ago I guess, and there were no issues getting it at all. Albiet, it was just a plain old obsolete 41colt. I choose to letter mine on the simple fact that Officers recognize the format they're printed in, and I do carry mine for ranch-work, so I'd rather have the letter along in case of a confrontation someplace along the way and am checked for having such a sixgun along ... That said, I too have an ATC for trapline carry but it's strictly related to trapline carry (only). I have and do expect to run into CO's going forward and I can tell you from experience that they are happy to see (Antique status) paperwork with the RCMP emblem on it that's laid out in such similar fashion to what the ATC's they see for trappers & forestry n whatnot are. Officers are-not as unfamiliar with individuals carrying legal restricteds holding ATC's as what people are led to believe. There are more ATC's issued and out n about than most people realize.

Anyway. So no, the antique status letters aren't mandatory paperwork to have [and the techs at the cfc will tell you that too], BUT, because they're so similar and recognizable comparing to the way an ATC layout is done (which officers do see), they're easy legitimate insurance to have and keep along in any case where you may get checked out for having something on your hip... I have been checked, questions asked and conversations ensued, but by my RCMP status letter, all was deemed 100% and everyone went along their way A-ok. The point of the letter simply and 100% being just to simply things if a guy's ever checked out. It comes down to the individual whether or not you feel that's enough reason to get one... but it's surely why I have 'em on mine
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That is my, and I believe most folks' understanding of the current state of affairs. If you read the thread at the link I posted, Newby states he had no trouble getting a letter for a Colt (assuming SAA) in 45acp. No mention of original caliber was made. My understanding, gained here, was that a caliber converted antique had to proved originally in an antique caliber before a letter was issued. From what I could gather from the other thread, that wasn't an issue.
I would just like to know the actual facts of the matter and the current situation...as I'm sure we all would.
 
BrotherRockeye said:
What part of the conflicting information are you referring to?

I sent a PM to Newby asking that he start a thread here so we can sort this act out, as his experience is contrary to what most of us have seen over the last while.

It would be in the best interests of the antique community to know where we stand as to the current state of things.
Click to expand...

The part about getting antique letters by converting the 45lc's to 45acp/44 spl etc.. I tried and it was a no go. I know if it's in 41 colt 455 etc. you can convert and get it lettered antique still.
What newby was saying is totally new to me.
 
whiskeywillow said:
Far as I have understood, about 2014 when that big Swiss debate and regulation took change, so did the RCMP's interpretation of Antiques and the conversions that were going on with them. Before 2014, a guy could convert 45colt pre-98's and get Antique status. Could convert 38-40's, 44-40's etc into non listed calibers and get antique status for them too. AFTER 2014 & the interpretation change the only ones that qualify are pre-98 guns that began life from manufacturer in the now obsolete 41colt, 44 russian, 455 eley etc etc... those all remain antique and can be converted to any non listed (other) caliber if you wish, just like before, and still remain an antique.

I myself had my last letter done by the cfc on a Colt 8-10 months ago I guess, and there were no issues getting it at all. Albiet, it was just a plain old obsolete 41colt. I choose to letter mine on the simple fact that Officers recognize the format they're printed in, and I do carry mine for ranch-work, so I'd rather have the letter along in case of a confrontation someplace along the way and am checked for having such a sixgun along ... That said, I too have an ATC for trapline carry but it's strictly related to trapline carry (only). I have and do expect to run into CO's going forward and I can tell you from experience that they are happy to see (Antique status) paperwork with the RCMP emblem on it that's laid out in such similar fashion to what the ATC's they see for trappers & forestry n whatnot are. Officers are-not as unfamiliar with individuals carrying legal restricteds holding ATC's as what people are led to believe. There are more ATC's issued and out n about than most people realize.

Anyway. So no, the antique status letters aren't mandatory paperwork to have [and the techs at the cfc will tell you that too], BUT, because they're so similar and recognizable comparing to the way an ATC layout is done (which officers do see), they're easy legitimate insurance to have and keep along in any case where you may get checked out for having something on your hip... I have been checked, questions asked and conversations ensued, but by my RCMP status letter, all was deemed 100% and everyone went along their way A-ok. The point of the letter simply and 100% being just to simply things if a guy's ever checked out. It comes down to the individual whether or not you feel that's enough reason to get one... but it's surely why I have 'em on mine
Click to expand...

This is what I believe to be true as well.
 
It appears that we are not alone in our understanding of how things are since 2014. I searched the RCMP website (and still am) but can find no changes to "policy on interpretation"

https://www.facebook.com/NFACANADA/...n-a-number-of-questions-rega/599658430102257/


March 30, 2014 ·

ANTIQUE PISTOLS RECLASSIFIED

Recently there have been a number of questions regarding the RCMP's reclassifications of antique handguns. This issue is particularly troubling due to the misunderstanding surrounding antique handguns in the first place. Lets start off with how the antique firearms regulations have historically been applied in Canada. Here is the exerpt from the RCMP's site:

Handguns: manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than .22 Calibre Short, .22 Calibre Long or .22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges, other than a handgun designed or adapted to discharge .32 Short Colt, .32 Long Colt, .32 Smith and Wesson, .32 Smith and Wesson Long, .32‑20 Winchester, .38 Smith and Wesson; .38 Short Colt, .38 Long Colt, .38-40 Winchester, .44‑40 Winchester, or .45 Colt cartridges.

Ever since the act was introduced, this has been interpreted the same way. If the firearm in question was produced prior to 1898 and is not chambered in the calibers listed above, or the firearm has not been altered to fire those calibers, it was recognized as an antique under the firearms act. As an example, If you owned a Colt revolver built prior to 1898, which was rechambered from 38 Long Colt (on the exemption list) to 38 special, or 44 Special (not on the list) It was recognized as an antique. This firearm can be bought and sold without a license, and shot anywhere you can legally discharge a non restricted firearm.

Several weeks ago at the same time that the Swiss Arms and CZ858 became prohibited, the RCMP changed their interpretation of the law, affecting the classifications of many antique firearms. Now, the RCMP does not recognize that same firearm as being antique because it was originally built in a non antique caliber. The FRT #'s which historically showed these firearms as antique, have now been changed to restricted and prohibited. There are a number of issues with this, including the fact that antique letters have been issued for these guns for many years, showing them as antiques.

They have been imported, de-registered, sold and traded without licenses as allowed under the act. It is our opinion that the only solution here is to change the firearms act to recognize all firearms prior to 1899 as antique.
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Wally1966 said:
The part about getting antique letters by converting the 45lc's to 45acp/44 spl etc.. I tried and it was a no go. I know if it's in 41 colt 455 etc. you can convert and get it lettered antique still.
What newby was saying is totally new to me.
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Me as well, and why I have invited him to start a thread here detailing it. If the RCMP have changed their "interpretation" back to what it was originally, it would be nice to know.
 
here's the original stuff:

Originally Posted by Dingus
NEW ANTIQUE FRT CHANGES and Addendum to altered cartridges handguns

OK there was and Addendum to the Altered Centerfire Antique Handguns just done when the FRT changes from that swiss rifle went into effect.
There is a NEW CFC Policy on altered antique handguns ..
Im the messenger so dont shoot me i dont make CFC policy i have to deal with it just like everyone else.

this is my interpratation of a conversation on the new addendum.

The new Addendum says that a gun must be in and antique cartridge to start with then it can be altered to 45 acp its still antique.
Im going to stick with 45 acp here as and example in this PM but its not hard to figger out 38 Sp and 44 Sp ext are also effected.
So all Pre 1898 webleys that were antique in 455 but altered to 45 Acp are ok
All french 1873s that were altered to 45 acp are OK.
Why because they started life as perscribed antiques when they were original in 455 and 11 mm.
Now if you have a SAA colt that was 45 colt they will not grant that gun antique status even if its changed to 45 acp.
If the SAA colt was 44 40 and it was changed to 44 sp or 38 sp same thing no go.
The handgun must have started life as a prescribed antique or they wont grant it antique status.
So any 41 Colts can be changed to anything not on the No list so can 455 and 44 russian anything not on the stupid cartridge list to start with.
41 long colts will be very popular now because of this addendum so if you have one id hang onto it.
Keep in mind theres no way to tell what most SAA colts were in originaly as alot were just frames built by guys like Bob christy or other gunsmiths in the USA this policy will effect guys wanting to deregister there SAA colts in Canada where CFC can see which cartridge they were registered in.
This new addendum is mainly aimed at people who want to deregister SAA colts that are Antique by age but not by caliber in Canada i guess there was alot of this happening.
Its New policy im not saying its law as i dont see how they can change SOR/98-464 with policy im by no meensd a lawyer .
They just wont grant antique letters to guns that were not antique by cartridge and age anymore or deregister them.
They will do each gun on a one by one case just like they always have.
Anyway thats all i know for now.
I do not know how this effects the guns already lettered they may grandfather the ones out there now as the other option would get expensive for them fast.
Im just posting what i know about the addendum so people can be prepared for it.

CFC alowed handguns in the past to be deregistered that were restricted handguns in Canada they made that choice to do it so if they now say that was all a mistake this could cost them alot.
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Originally Posted by H Wally
I can confirm what Dingus' is saying - I called and asked to deregister a colt in 44-40 that has been rechambered to 44 Russian and they said it won't go through since they're writing new policy that limits what guns can be given antique status.

They're focusing on the "designed or adapted to" line of the criminal code definition, meaning that once a revolver is designed to fire a no-go cartridge, it will always be legally considered to be chambered in that cal.

So like Dingus says:
A .455 Webley gun is ok because it was never in a no-go cal.
A 45 Long colt gun can never be deregistered because once chambered for 45 Long colt, it will always be legally considered to be in that caliber.
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My apologies to the OP if this is going off the rails.

In my opinion, if Mark says it's so and Hugh confirms it that's good enough for me. Without any proof to the contrary I think that Wally1966's original statement was accurate.
 
it kinda seems if you adapt it to shoot a center fire cartridge of 44 spl it would jive with this statement. but then you are stuck with the fact that when you purchase a saa in 45 lc it's registered. so you would somehow have to prove it was adapted and get it de registered? that doesn't sound like it would work. probably causes too many questions.
you know the hilarious thing about this whole thing is that nobody would shoot anything other than cowboy loads in these things anyways. so caliber is kinda moot. :)
 
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