Noob question about registering a lower

So I'm curious... I have a BCM lower coming. I'm mating it with a 16" .223 wylde barrel. Let's say down the road I build another upper for it because ARs are banned and I can't just put the upper on a new lower. Would I have to keep a version of the original upper that it was registered with whenever I brought the rifle to the range? Maybe I like 14.5 or 16" for one use, but a 18-20" upper for another use... Were I to put my 20" upper on it and get stopped, would I be in violation of the law? Would I always have to transport it as a 16" and swap uppers at the range, technically speaking? It seems overly complicated....
 
hbean said:
It is a "status" change going from a "frame/receiver" to a "firearm", how you transport your firearm as a whole or as separate upper and lower is irrelevant, an AR is treated the same as any breakdown rifle or multi-cal rifle like the Thompson Center arms, Pro Hunter and Encore. long as all the pieces are their and you can mate the two halves together without any tools it is a fully functioning rifle capable of discharging a round.

If you think you can just keep it registered as a receiver only, take the time and read the exact wording of your ATT it only only says "firearm", no where is the words "frame and receiver" mentioned.
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You can absolutely keep it registered as a "frame only" and have multiple uppers for it on your trip to a shooting range. Legally, as long as you dont keep an upper mated to a lower for more than 30 days you dont have to report it.

firearm means a barrelled weapon from which any shot, bullet or other projectile can be discharged and that is capable of causing serious bodily injury or death to a person, and includes any frame or receiver of such a barrelled weapon and anything that can be adapted for use as a firearm
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cdndfs said:
So I'm curious... I have a BCM lower coming. I'm mating it with a 16" .223 wylde barrel. Let's say down the road I build another upper for it because ARs are banned and I can't just put the upper on a new lower. Would I have to keep a version of the original upper that it was registered with whenever I brought the rifle to the range? Maybe I like 14.5 or 16" for one use, but a 18-20" upper for another use... Were I to put my 20" upper on it and get stopped, would I be in violation of the law? Would I always have to transport it as a 16" and swap uppers at the range, technically speaking? It seems overly complicated....
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Has to be a permanent change for over 30 days for you to worry about different barrel lengths.
 
BCreserveMP said:
Easy-peasy. Apart from the 45 minute wait to talk to someone at the CFO it was painless. "4-6 week wait" for the new document. Oh well.
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I did the same thing today, I have a lower up for sale and was registered as 16.5 barrel length, in case someone wants to buy my 10.5 complete upper, I thought might as well call in and re register lower as 10.5. And told the same thing, 4-6 weeks wait, well...
 
People who trigger lock/cable lock all their firearms while they are locked in a safe must own a crapload of locking devices :rolleyes: I choose just to follow the RCMP storage regulations.
 
hbean said:
It is a "status" change going from a "frame/receiver" to a "firearm", how you transport your firearm as a whole or as separate upper and lower is irrelevant, an AR is treated the same as any breakdown rifle or multi-cal rifle like the Thompson Center arms, Pro Hunter and Encore. long as all the pieces are their and you can mate the two halves together without any tools it is a fully functioning rifle capable of discharging a round.

If you think you can just keep it registered as a receiver only, take the time and read the exact wording of your ATT it only only says "firearm", no where is the words "frame and receiver" mentioned.
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For restricteds, a "frame/receiver" is the same as "firearm".

Read this:

mistero said:
You can absolutely keep it registered as a "frame only" and have multiple uppers for it on your trip to a shooting range. Legally, as long as you dont keep an upper mated to a lowe for more than 30 days you dont have to report it.
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squidxm said:
People who trigger lock/cable lock all their firearms while they are locked in a safe must own a crapload of locking devices :rolleyes: I choose just to follow the RCMP storage regulations.
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To each his own. But if I can afford nine $1000+ guns, which I can, I can afford nine $15 trigger locks. It's another layer of safety and convenience.
 
Here is the exact wording of law.
[FONT=&quot]Conditions[/FONT]
  • 4 (1) Subject to section 5, the Registrar shall attach to a registration certificate that is issued in respect of a firearm the condition that the holder of the certificate shall advise the Registrar, within 30 days after the modification, of
    • (a) any modification to the firearm that results in a change of class of the firearm;
    • (b) in the case of a firearm registered as a frame or receiver only, any modification that makes it capable of discharging ammunition;
    • (c) any modification to an altered automatic firearm; and
    • (d) any modification that results in the firearm ceasing to be a firearm.
  • (2) Subject to section 5, the Registrar shall attach to a registration certificate that is issued in respect of a firearm the condition that when the type, action, calibre or gauge of the firearm is modified, the holder of the certificate shall advise the Registrar of the modification,
    • (a) if the modification is intended to be permanent, within 30 days after the modification; and
    • (b) if the modification is not intended to be permanent but still exists 30 days after it is made, without delay after that period.
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A separated AR upper falls under the condition outlined in 4 (2) (b).
 
hbean said:
Here is the exact wording of law.


A separated AR upper falls under the condition outlined in 4 (2) (b).
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That's interesting.

So, say for the sake of argument they don't process my re-registry because of this new category for ARs and I'm stuck with a "receiver only" registration, I can still build it and take it to the range indefinitely as long as the upper isn't attached for more than 30 consecutive days?

That's bonkers.
 
carsmovies said:
If you have a gun "safe" you don't need to lock your restricted separately. Only if they are stored in a locked cabinet for example.
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Poppycock.

The only time this has gone to court, the judge ruled a safe is a "lockable metal container" or something to that effect. Thus, snap on cabinets are safes, and do not require locks on restricted firearms for storage.
 
hbean said:
Here is the exact wording of law.


A separated AR upper falls under the condition outlined in 4 (2) (b).
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I dont know if you realize it but you defeated your own argument with this statement. A separated upper is not modifying anything - it is just a piece of metal.
 
hbean said:
Here is the exact wording of law.

Conditions

  • 4 (1) Subject to section 5, the Registrar shall attach to a registration certificate that is issued in respect of a firearm the condition that the holder of the certificate shall advise the Registrar, within 30 days after the modification, of
    • (a) any modification to the firearm that results in a change of class of the firearm;
    • (b) in the case of a firearm registered as a frame or receiver only, any modification that makes it capable of discharging ammunition;
    • (c) any modification to an altered automatic firearm; and
    • (d) any modification that results in the firearm ceasing to be a firearm.

  • (2) Subject to section 5, the Registrar shall attach to a registration certificate that is issued in respect of a firearm the condition that when the type, action, calibre or gauge of the firearm is modified, the holder of the certificate shall advise the Registrar of the modification,
    • (a) if the modification is intended to be permanent, within 30 days after the modification; and
    • (b) if the modification is not intended to be permanent but still exists 30 days after it is made, without delay after that period.


A separated AR upper falls under the condition outlined in 4 (2) (b).
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Read subsection (b) again very carefully.

If the "modification" exists after 30 days it was made, then a license holder is subject to report this change (attaching an upper to a receiver) to the registrar.

An attached upper is not a permanent modification, because it can be removed at anytime. The intention of making it a permanent modification becomes so (in the eyes of the law) only after the upper has been attached for more than 30 days.

When the upper is removed on the 29th day, subsection (b) and its condition are no longer met.

I am not sure why you don't understand this.
 
A separated AR upper and lower is still treated as a complete firearm just like a TC Pro Hunter and every takedown rifle and shotgun. Thinking your AR lower is not a firearm by simply separate them during transport you will lose that argument in court everytime.
 
hbean said:
A separated AR upper and lower is still treated as a complete firearm just like a TC Pro Hunter and every takedown rifle and shotgun. Thinking your AR lower is not a firearm by simply separate them during transport you will lose that argument in court everytime.
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You're not listening nor are you reading, concisely.
A REGISTERED "frame/receiver" is a firearm for the purposes of registration and definition as per legislation.

This discussion is about when said "frame/receiver" is to be re-registered (registrar contacted) with a declared barrel length/permanently modified.

Whether an upper is attached or not does change the status of "frame/receiver". It is still a firearm.
 
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hbean said:
A separated AR upper and lower is still treated as a complete firearm just like a TC Pro Hunter and every takedown rifle and shotgun. Thinking your AR lower is not a firearm by simply separate them during transport you will lose that argument in court everytime.
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Ok
Since you are not listing to a bunch of us on here, let me ask you these 2 questions:

1) Who or what is treating a separated AR upper and lower as a complete firearm?
2) What is the legal authority for that? Please cite a relevant section(s) of the Criminal Code and/or Firearms Act.
 
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