Your advice on an used metal lathe

MBiz

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Hello everyone,
I would like to buy an used basic metal lathe. I need 30 inches between the spindles, an automatic feeder (not sure if it is the proper expression) and to be mounted on ball bearing not babbitt. Can you recommend something and how much should I spend.
Thank you
 
I started to work on lathes in 1950 and have owned 6 or 7 since then.
If possible you should spend some time apprenticing or visiting a friend who does lathe work.
This will give you a better understanding of the features and size you need.
They are all heavy and usually difficult to install. You may need a 210 volt power supply.
My present lathe is Chinese and is adequate for a home shop like mine
Good luck,
Jack C.
 
I started to work on lathes in 1950 and have owned 6 or 7 since then.
If possible you should spend some time apprenticing or visiting a friend who does lathe work.
This will give you a better understanding of the features and size you need.
They are all heavy and usually difficult to install. You may need a 210 volt power supply.
My present lathe is Chinese and is adequate for a home shop like mine
Good luck,
Jack C.

Thank you Jack,
My only friend to show me how to use a lathe is you tube. I am mechanically inclined and can fix large belt sander and woodworking machinery. So I hope I will be able to learn from You Tube. May I asked you the model and the brand of your lathe?
Cordially
 
An automatic feeder is not a usual feature on an engine lathe. It's more something you would fit to the lathe when and if you find a need for one. Or when you say "automatic feeder" what feature is this you're asking about? A feeder usually suggests a collet chuck with a floating handle on the outboard end so you can feed long lengths of bar through and advance it a bit for the next part. Or are you referring to the the usual automatic carriage and cross slide travel that moves one or the other under power?

If that is the case and you're actually just looking to find a machine with the usual power feed of the carriage and cross slide then you'll want to find a lathe with a quick change gearbox. Otherwise it's awkward to change out the gears to get the right feed speed. Be aware that a lot of the newer models have a speed changer that is not a real and proper quick change box. Those are rather limited and rely on a combination of gearing changes on the back side and then selecting "multiples" with the gearbox. So rather limited compared to a "proper" fully featured QCGB.

You're likely looking at finding a 12x36" or perhaps a 13x40.

Price wise it's hard to say. New machines can be had from Busy Bee but at up around $5K. Depending on your patience deals on used lathes come up now and then. But you also need to know what to look for on used machines to avoid broken gears, overly worn beds and a number of other possible issues. That's a lot to learn about in a hurry and avoid a machine full of issues. But if you know what to look for you can get used machines with lots of good life left in them. The best I can suggest for price is to start looking at the Craigslist or similar that apply to your area and watch ALL of the lathes, big and small, and gain a feel for the local pricing. Then jump on a machine which is in good shape and doesn't have any broken gear teeth.

Price wise
 
Thank you Jack,
My only friend to show me how to use a lathe is you tube. I am mechanically inclined and can fix large belt sander and woodworking machinery. So I hope I will be able to learn from You Tube. May I asked you the model and the brand of your lathe?
Cordially

YouTube is definitely your friend. I learned how to cut threads from watching Tom's Techniques and was able to complete a few of my gunsmithing projects myself instead of contracting out the work. It's a good feeling accomplishing something on your own. Also, if you find a used lathe and are unsure about it, checkout a website called Lathes.co.uk. They list almost every manufacturer and have a ton of info on history of the company's and specific models. I've used it a bunch of times after finding old lathes on Craigslist.
 
Check out Tubal Caine on Youtube, he's got all the answers. :) Metal working machinery seems to be cheaper and more common in the East. Think it's due to it being our manufacturing base in the past. Atlas , Craftsman lathes have pot metal gears, made me suspicious of them. :confused:

Grizz
 
All of the posters are giving you good advice.

Jack C. may likely be giving you the best advice for your pre novice level of understanding and experience.

I don't know your situation, such as availability of a mentor or your location and access to electrical outlets.

It's been my experience that every make of lathe out there is very similar as to operation but the controls are in different positions or look different.

Chinese lathes don't come with instructions and it takes some trial and error to get things in perspective.

Then you have to decide what you're going to use your lathe for and how precise you need it to be without having to shim a three jaw chuck. Four or Six jaw chucks eliminate the need as you have to dial in your center to zero.

Spindle diameter is also very important, maybe more important than the working distance between centers, depending on your needs.

Then you have to decide which suits your needs better, a quick change gear box or a back gear set up. Both are good when you learn how to use their capabilities.

OK, one other thing not mentioned is the floor the lathe will rest on.

Some small lathes can be set up on a solid/level bench top. NOT THE LATHE YOU DESCRIBE IN YOUR POST. It will be to big.

As for a floor, ideally it should be concrete, thick enough that it won't crack under the weight and vibration. For a hobby lathe, a normal four inch thick floor is fine. The big thing is a floor sturdy enough to take the weight without flexing. The previous shop I used had a regular wood floor consisting of 2x10 floor joists on 16 in centers with a 3/4 in plywood top. It wasn't stable enough. I had to glue/screw a couple of 3/4 in 4x8 foot sheets of plywood to the floor under the lathe bases to make it all rigid enough.

Next, the lathe HAS TO BE LEVEL to run true. This can't be stressed enough. It may get some jobs done but for really precise stuff it all needs to be true wherever you can place a level to check. A decent machinist level should be used.

BOOKS ARE YOUR FRIEND. There's lots of stuff on lathe operations on the internet but having a hands on hard copy has a lot of advantages.
 
Bearhunter is leading you onto some of the aspects that you need to learn about along the way. As he is suggesting the setup and support is just as important as buying a machine that is in good shape. On the other hand you've got a lot to learn before you start trying to work to super tight dimensions. Learning that can be done nicely enough on a lathe that isn't set up and trued to the finest degree.

If/when you get a lathe consider too that you can learn a lot and add to your lathe tooling by making a lot of your own accessories. Things like tail stock die holders and holders to hold a dial gauge in a tool holder so it sits right at the center axis height. And lots of other goodies. And if you make it a chance to learn to hold to desired tolerances with each project you'll learn a lot from even simple jobs.
 
Bearhunter is leading you onto some of the aspects that you need to learn about along the way. As he is suggesting the setup and support is just as important as buying a machine that is in good shape. On the other hand you've got a lot to learn before you start trying to work to super tight dimensions. Learning that can be done nicely enough on a lathe that isn't set up and trued to the finest degree.

If/when you get a lathe consider too that you can learn a lot and add to your lathe tooling by making a lot of your own accessories. Things like tail stock die holders and holders to hold a dial gauge in a tool holder so it sits right at the center axis height. And lots of other goodies. And if you make it a chance to learn to hold to desired tolerances with each project you'll learn a lot from even simple jobs.

The lathe is cheap, wait till you need to buy tooling. I was lucky , I got a full complement of tooling with mine. still trying to figure how to use some of it. :)

Grizz
 
An automatic feeder is not a usual feature on an engine lathe. It's more something you would fit to the lathe when and if you find a need for one. Or when you say "automatic feeder" what feature is this you're asking about? A feeder usually suggests a collet chuck with a floating handle on the outboard end so you can feed long lengths of bar through and advance it a bit for the next part. Or are you referring to the the usual automatic carriage and cross slide travel that moves one or the other under power?

If that is the case and you're actually just looking to find a machine with the usual power feed of the carriage and cross slide then you'll want to find a lathe with a quick change gearbox. Otherwise it's awkward to change out the gears to get the right feed speed. Be aware that a lot of the newer models have a speed changer that is not a real and proper quick change box. Those are rather limited and rely on a combination of gearing changes on the back side and then selecting "multiples" with the gearbox. So rather limited compared to a "proper" fully featured QCGB.

You're likely looking at finding a 12x36" or perhaps a 13x40.

Price wise it's hard to say. New machines can be had from Busy Bee but at up around $5K. Depending on your patience deals on used lathes come up now and then. But you also need to know what to look for on used machines to avoid broken gears, overly worn beds and a number of other possible issues. That's a lot to learn about in a hurry and avoid a machine full of issues. But if you know what to look for you can get used machines with lots of good life left in them. The best I can suggest for price is to start looking at the Craigslist or similar that apply to your area and watch ALL of the lathes, big and small, and gain a feel for the local pricing. Then jump on a machine which is in good shape and doesn't have any broken gear teeth.

Price wise

Pretty sure he's looking for power feeds and thread gearbox, not production equipment.

Suspect, given the location of the OP, that English is not his first language.

I'd say you are about on point, as far as the size he is like to be looking for.

I'll suggest that he looks pretty hard at the current suppliers at retail of metal working machinery, if only to familiarize himself with the features and options in the size range. Grizzly Tools, King, Busy Bee, even. Between those three, a fella will at least get an idea of what a lathe was or is selling for at retail, to see how the price offered compares.

You can accomplish a lot more on a minimal tooling budget with a lathe, than you ever will with a shoestring budget tooling up a milling machine!

Lots of great videos out there, almost as many good books, some really good websites, and lots of data available online through a search engine, that was never easy to find back when having a copy of Machinery's Handbook was consider a requirement.

If you have to buy just one book, buy Technology Of Machine Tools by Krar. Senior High School/College level metalwork shop text book. Awesome book. Buy an older copy, or a used copy from a used book place, new copies are running pretty close to a hundred bucks, because, who better to rape on book prices, than students! An older copy will have all the same good basic info, but will have less about CNC and such more modern technology, which is pretty handy to have if you are gonna make a living at it, but not so handy if all you really need is some instructions to follow using manual machinery.

Don't buy Machinery's Handbook unless you can buy a copy for under $20. Giant book of reference tables and data, not a how-to book. You can find it all on line, if you feel the need to look the stuff up.
 
South Bend's How to Run a Lathe is a classic for basic operation of a traditional lathe.

You're right. The thing is, with novices it can be difficult to ascertain what the control levers are for and sometimes where they're located.

Even with the available videos, every machine in them has a slightly different set up.

Usually, there will be a rudimentary drawing with a description of the controls. The trouble comes when the novice has no idea what the nomenclature means or what the control actually does.

I often get a novice that has inherited a lathe or milling machine/mill drill. They are completely out of their depth, even when they know the names of the components. They also need to know what the components are capable of and how they interact with the other components. That's the first major part of the learning curve for most. After that, they can usually figure things out from there

I am not a proponent of purchasing a cheap, often sloppy machine to start on. Start with the good stuff right from the get go and very likely save a lot of time and aggravation in the long run.
 
South Bend's How to Run a Lathe is a classic for basic operation of a traditional lathe.

It's pretty basic, and really light on details. You pretty much have to understand it was written in an era when grade school kids were expected to be able to safely run a lathe in shop classes, and the book was a refresher for folks wishing to pick it up again many years later.
But it can be got in print form for well under 20 bucks, and is a reasonable enough investment at that. It can be found online to download too. Worth a look through.
 
It's pretty basic, and really light on details. You pretty much have to understand it was written in an era when grade school kids were expected to be able to safely run a lathe in shop classes, and the book was a refresher for folks wishing to pick it up again many years later.
But it can be got in print form for well under 20 bucks, and is a reasonable enough investment at that. It can be found online to download too. Worth a look through.

Think there are actually a couple of versions out there, one more detailed than the other, both very dated and specific to the South Bend lathe of the time, a very primitive machine by today's standards. . Interesting reading but there are better out there for the money.

Grizz
 
I have a 12x36 Grizzly and it meets with most of my needs. Certainly large enough for gunsmithing projects. I do most of my work with carbide insert tooling, but do all threading with hand sharpened hss. Once you get into chambering, you can spend a lot of money on each caliber / cartridge. Reamers, bushing sets, your choice of rod if you chamber through the headstock, quality indicator, piloted centre drill, perhaps piloted counterbore, and I'm sure I've forgotten some of what I've bought for each cartridge. You could certainly buy a rifle for that amount of money, but it just wouldn't be the same fun. I'm fortunate in that I once pursued the career of machinist, so I took courses at our community college and worked in the field. It's good to understand lathe operation before applying it to a specific field like gunsmithing.

If you are really interested, I would suggest you take a course on general lathe operation. Having an opportunity to use quality equipment, instruction, minimal tooling (they don't want students to have to buy a lot, or break their expensive tooling or instruments ) projects designed to build your skills progressively, is valuable.
 
Years ago I bought a metric Southend 10K lath with 35" centres. I put thousands of hours on it.
It came with a 6" chuck that was missing one set of jaws. and no tooling. I replaced the 3 jaw
chuck bought a face plate, a 4 jaw chuck for it, a live centre and a tail-stock chuck.
I made all the rest of the tooling for it. My experience running a lathe started in high school metal shop.
YouTube is your friend!

Terry

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I built the bench and moved the motor and drive below the lathe from behind it.

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A follow rest and rocker tool holder I built.

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Carriage stop.

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The rocker tool holder worked very well.
 
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Steady rest I made from a slice of hydraulic cylinder.

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Radius tool

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Carriage mounted drill chuck that doubles as a parting tool holder.

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Some tooling that I made a living with that was built with the old Southbend lathe.

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I replaced the Southbend with machine about ten years ago.
 
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Think there are actually a couple of versions out there, one more detailed than the other, both very dated and specific to the South Bend lathe of the time, a very primitive machine by today's standards. . Interesting reading but there are better out there for the money.

Grizz

I have enough books that I have a lot of them boxed up on pallets. I like books, and they all have something to teach a fella if he takes the time to look them over.

I have at least two of the many versions of How To Run A Lathe, as well as a fair collection of the 'Projects' books South Bend put out.
I have the Atlas Lathe book too, which covers some stuff that South Bend did not, like setting up to wind coils, and the like, neat stuff to read about, and to file away in the back of your mind, in case the need ever arises.

Technology of Machine Tools by Krar is pretty much my go-to book, if you gotta have just one. But who can stop at just one, eh? :)

There are a LOT of decent books, and I can think of at least six different periodicals from four countries, worth subscribing to, as you simply won't find the information all together like it is in them.

A subscription to Home Shop Machinist magazine is a pretty good place to start. Home Shop Machinists Workshop is another. Both from the same publisher in the States, usually available in better stocked magazine rack stores too. Projects, ideas, adverts for all manner of useful and not so useful tools, and a pretty good overview of the available stuff out there for hobby machinist types.
 
Hello everyone,
I am very grateful for the tremendous advice that you have provided in response to my query.
The response has been more then I anticipated.
Thank so much
 
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