A different perspective on bear defense.

W

Why not?

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Always hearing that bear spray is better than a firearm for protection. Here's an interesting research observation of actual attack situations.

https://www.ammoland.com/2019/08/handgun-or-pistol-defense-against-bear-attack-73-cases-96-effective/#axzz5wdJB1jXk

Handguns were 96% effective in 73 cases.

I have always carried a rifle in the bush. Hunting, fishing, berry picking, chasing mountains, photography; only needed to kill one bear in over 50 years. That one fell literally at my feet. Reloaded and touched his eye with the muzzle of the 270. No blink. If there would have been, there would have been another boom instantly.

My bet has always been on the rifle, and still is.

Ted
 
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I'm not surprised by the findings. Having a handgun sure beats using a rock and shouting expletives. Each situation is unique.
 
Interesting. That's much higher than the success rate reported in a previous study that was comparing spray to guns, where spray was found to be much more effective (it was like 90% to 60% or something like that I want to say. Hopefully someone else remembers the study I'm talking about and can link it here. I'll look for it later tonight when I'm off work if nobody else does it sooner).
 
Suther said:
Interesting. That's much higher than the success rate reported in a previous study that was comparing spray to guns, where spray was found to be much more effective (it was like 90% to 60% or something like that I want to say. Hopefully someone else remembers the study I'm talking about and can link it here. I'll look for it later tonight when I'm off work if nobody else does it sooner).
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Thing about using any firearm, or even bear spray, is you've got to have the presence of mind and knowledge to use them correctly, which can be difficult in the heat of the moment.

Grizz
 
Friends of mine are hunting in the north west of Fort Nelson area they are on a 9 day pack in hunt they are a young couple in their early 30's this is their first hunting trip their main hunting rifle for this trip is a stainless Tikka T3 in 30-06 that they bought off of Remington Jim the scope is a Leupold VX3 2.5-8x36mm duplex reticle that they bought from gunsmith Gary Flatch in Langley their hunting loads are my 165gr Accubonds @ 2880fps in my 22" barrel.

They were going to take another Tikka in 6.5 CM loaded with 140gr bullets but they decided that they wanted something for bear defense so I lent them my JM stamped Marlin 1895GS in 45-70 set up with XS Sights ghost ring sights that I used for defense when I was working solo as a self employed free miner it is even set up with a Wild West Guns tactical light mount and a Surefire tactical light.

The loads I sent along with the Marlin are 350gr Swift Aframes @ 2100fps and 550gr WLNGC Craters @ 1550fps.

They did not take pepper spray...
 
Bear spray is effective, and it has the advantage of being non lethal, if the situation has a viable non lethal solution. And sometimes, that's a consideration. Personally I feel a bit more secure with a good gun, doesn't have to be stamped JM or AR or anything specific, just something up for the job. Here's a novel idea, why not carry both, gives you options. And don't forget your most effective weapon, your kāpostu.

Sometimes, deadly force is required, I get it. Bob Marley said it best, "Total destruction, only solution".

Will bear spray deter a rabid skunk, I've kicked them with my work boots, they don't deter that easy. Personally I'm more afraid of a rabid skunk than a black bear, I know I have a chance of scaring off a black bear. For rabid skunk, I'll vote shotgun, no non lethal solution IMNSHO. For black bear, I like my 35 Rem. No Grizzly or Polar in my back yard, but if there were, I'd vote 375 H&H or 416 Rem Mag. Somehow my confidence level with just bear spray, against a Polar, not there. I suppose if I had bigger nutz, I'd just carry a Bowie knife and call it a day.

Nitro
 
Had plenty of bear encounters over the years but never an attack scenario. This year on me dog walk trail I've had the buggers cross in front & behind me as well as lookin' at me from the sides of the trail. It's blackberry time & I'm always grabbing some fer my pooch whilst wandering. The only thing I carry on the daily 5k is a 5' bamboo staff for warding off other dogs if needed & knocking off low hangin' leaves an such. ( By thwacking the bush on yer travels, ye let the buggers know that yer comin' an they'll generally mosey on.)

When I was hunting bear, I always set the bear into the situation & not the other way around. Too many folks tend to blunder into bear territory like they be hustling into the store which makes for boo-boos, along with packing along improperly sealed food items.

As fer bear spray, I wouldn't bother. Too many breezy days in my area to get a good result with that stuff. I reckon it be seasoning for the shmuck that stops & yells at a mamma bear with cubs. Best to always be aware and move carefully in the bear's zone.

That said, I'd sure like to be allowed to carry a 6" barreled M29 S&W on me wanderings cause ye never know. There be some wonky critters out there.
 
I vaguely recall Jeff Cooper suggesting a .357 magnum snubby. The rationale being that you have something to use when you are wrestling the bear. At that point spray and a long gun would be less useful.
 
While I had my remote area ATC I went thru appr 10 different handguns.

The two best that I came up with were my 5" barreled Glock 20 in 10mm loaded with my 200gr WFNGC - 800X @ 1200fps reloads and my shortened by Gunnar at Armco in Prince George to 4.25" barrel Ruger Super Redhawk also installed a .330" green fiber optic front sight post and a Crimson Trace laser grip chambered in 454 Casull loaded with 240gr & 300gr XTP-Mags, 360gr WLNGC's, 390gr WLNGC's and my favorite when I was in big bear country 405gr WLNGC's @ 1300fps.

While packing the SRH in 454 Casull I never once no matter what wild animal I encountered felt under gunned.
 
at body-contact distances a snubby 3" 357 revolver is good enough
there was a piece of news 2 years ago about a guy who did just that (but not without injury)
 
we can't even limit ourselves in Canada
but when the going gets tough, the pistol is closer than the rifle (paraphrase to the "the shirt is closer than the coat")
 
SHELL SHUCKER said:
Had plenty of bear encounters over the years but never an attack scenario. This year on me dog walk trail I've had the buggers cross in front & behind me as well as lookin' at me from the sides of the trail. It's blackberry time & I'm always grabbing some fer my pooch whilst wandering. The only thing I carry on the daily 5k is a 5' bamboo staff for warding off other dogs if needed & knocking off low hangin' leaves an such. ( By thwacking the bush on yer travels, ye let the buggers know that yer comin' an they'll generally mosey on.)

When I was hunting bear, I always set the bear into the situation & not the other way around. Too many folks tend to blunder into bear territory like they be hustling into the store which makes for boo-boos, along with packing along improperly sealed food items.

As fer bear spray, I wouldn't bother. Too many breezy days in my area to get a good result with that stuff. I reckon it be seasoning for the shmuck that stops & yells at a mamma bear with cubs. Best to always be aware and move carefully in the bear's zone.

That said, I'd sure like to be allowed to carry a 6" barreled M29 S&W on me wanderings cause ye never know. There be some wonky critters out there.
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Good choice for southern Van isle
Camp Cook said:
Friends of mine are hunting in the north west of Fort Nelson area they are on a 9 day pack in hunt they are a young couple in their early 30's this is their first hunting trip their main hunting rifle for this trip is a stainless Tikka T3 in 30-06 that they bought off of Remington Jim the scope is a Leupold VX3 2.5-8x36mm duplex reticle that they bought from gunsmith Gary Flatch in Langley their hunting loads are my 165gr Accubonds @ 2880fps in my 22" barrel.

They were going to take another Tikka in 6.5 CM loaded with 140gr bullets but they decided that they wanted something for bear defense so I lent them my JM stamped Marlin 1895GS in 45-70 set up with XS Sights ghost ring sights that I used for defense when I was working solo as a self employed free miner it is even set up with a Wild West Guns tactical light mount and a Surefire tactical light.

The loads I sent along with the Marlin are 350gr Swift Aframes @ 2100fps and 550gr WLNGC Craters @ 1550fps.

They did not take pepper spray...
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Good choice for Fort Nelson area
 
The advantage a handgun has over a long gun is that its worn, therefore always with you; whereas you might have to go and get a long gun. In order for any gun to be effective in a lethal encounter, marksmanship must be applied. Marksmanship tends to suffer when we're under stress, but the more competent we are with that gun, the less stress there is, and the less our marksmanship is impaired, so the greater our chances of success. Experience in game shooting also reduces stress, because you know how the game will react to being shot. Without that knowledge, your chances of success are decreased. But hunters as a group are predisposed to making a chest shot, but while a shot through the lungs is fatal, it is not a stopping shot, and knowing the animal that is killing you will die is of little comfort. The first shot you make might intentionally be non-lethal, particularly if you are responding to an attack on another person. It is useful to pre-program your actions prior to going afield, so your reaction time is significantly reduced.

So the choice of rifle, shotgun, or handgun matters not, its marksmanship that solves the problem. Experience puts the problem in perspective, and enables you to make good decisions. Pre-programming your response reduces reaction time. Once the bear has decided on his course of action, all that is left to consider are the target indicators, the target angle, and if there is anything in the background that should not be shot.

 
Boomer said:
The advantage a handgun has over a long gun is that its worn, therefore always with you; whereas you might have to go and get a long gun. In order for any gun to be effective in a lethal encounter, marksmanship must be applied. Marksmanship tends to suffer when we're under stress, but the more competent we are with that gun, the less stress there is, and the less our marksmanship is impaired, so the greater our chances of success. Experience in game shooting also reduces stress, because you know how the game will react to being shot. Without that knowledge, your chances of success are decreased. But hunters as a group are predisposed to making a chest shot, but while a shot through the lungs is fatal, it is not a stopping shot, and knowing the animal that is killing you will die is of little comfort. The first shot you make might intentionally be non-lethal, particularly if you are responding to an attack on another person. It is useful to pre-program your actions prior to going afield, so your reaction time is significantly reduced.

So the choice of rifle, shotgun, or handgun matters not, its marksmanship that solves the problem. Experience puts the problem in perspective, and enables you to make good decisions. Pre-programming your response reduces reaction time. Once the bear has decided on his course of action, all that is left to consider are the target indicators, the target angle, and if there is anything in the background that should not be shot.

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Sorry, that would make me quake in my boots. Reminds of that line from Jaws, Your'e gonna need a bigger boat. :redface:

Grizz
 
Camp Cook said:
Friends of mine are hunting in the north west of Fort Nelson area they are on a 9 day pack in hunt they are a young couple in their early 30's this is their first hunting trip their main hunting rifle for this trip is a stainless Tikka T3 in 30-06 that they bought off of Remington Jim the scope is a Leupold VX3 2.5-8x36mm duplex reticle that they bought from gunsmith Gary Flatch in Langley their hunting loads are my 165gr Accubonds @ 2880fps in my 22" barrel.

They were going to take another Tikka in 6.5 CM loaded with 140gr bullets but they decided that they wanted something for bear defense so I lent them my JM stamped Marlin 1895GS in 45-70 set up with XS Sights ghost ring sights that I used for defense when I was working solo as a self employed free miner it is even set up with a Wild West Guns tactical light mount and a Surefire tactical light.

The loads I sent along with the Marlin are 350gr Swift Aframes @ 2100fps and 550gr WLNGC Craters @ 1550fps.

They did not take pepper spray...
Click to expand...

That country has monster Grizz and no salmon runs. The sound of a shot is ringing the din er bell. Had a 60" bull taken by a big boar. At least that time, i didnt get chased. To old and broken to do the windfall olympics anymore.
 
I'm surrounded by bears in Central Frontenac near Sharbot Lake. There is a small waste sight about half km from my house. I have a cell phone video from 2 weeks ago 30 feet from a mother with 3 cubs. It's posted on Instagram actually. They are very used to people, maybe to used to people. But still makes you pretty damn nervous knowing there are several bears with 500 meters of your house at all times and pass through your yard almost daily. Could be just riding the lawn tractor on the wrong day and get my ass torn to peices.

I keep a mag fed shotgun ready and mags loaded with magnum slugs when out in the yard. Best way to protect myself quickly and legally. We also keep bear spray around but that's more for my wife. But I have seen a mother bear run through bear spray like it wasn't there. Plus in a haste wind can blow it back in your own face etc. And I may never get to a gun in time. It's not like I carry an 8 or 10 pound long gun on my person out there.

A couple years ago I know the township shot most of the bears around my house. They drove into the dump, heard some magnum rifles shooting in there soon after. No bears for a few months after that. But they are all back again and I see they are live trapping and relocating them lately. I see them hauling them out with the large cage traps on trailers now and then.

As far as handguns, I have been seriously thinking about applying for permission to carry on my own property. I know they will grant trappers and workers in remote areas. At least then I can do work outside and have a sidearm ready on my person. But I do realize that might not even be enough in certain situations. And not to mention the coyotes and fishers and so on...

Handgun is not ideal bear defense. But a shotgun 20 yards from where I am outside is even worse.
 
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