Looking to learn Israeli Point Shooting,
- Thread starter rci2950
- Start date
And that’s okay, but why on earth would you deem condition 3/point shooting of any merit without any formal training?
There’s a very good reason not a single respectable instructor would teach either of these.
Let’s break this down.
Condition 3: the notion that carrying without an empty chamber is inherently safer, perhaps in the event you have a brand new shooter that has never fired a gun from a holster but that then begs the question why are you shooting live from a holster you’ve never trained with? Ive always recommended new shooters practice at minimum 2 weeks if not a month of consistent dry fire practice from their holster of choice before taking it to the range and doing it live.
Point shooting: why on earth would gun makers, gun fighters, and recreational shooters put sights on a gun for the last 100+ years if all you needed to do was point and shoot? The idea should be to accurately put rounds on target, not to look cool, end of story.
Here’s where these two combined fall apart as a method of carry and shooting.
Safety:
Condition 3 is supposed to be consider the safest way to carry the gun, which for all intents and purposes on an untrained individual I would agree, but throw point shooting into the mix and now you have some rookie spraying bullets all over the place, likely missing the intended target.
You’re either too unskilled with a gun and holster your gun in condition 3, making you too unskilled to point shoot or you are a trained individual that can point shoot competently which would completely negate the notion that you need to carry condition 3.
Speed:
The idea of point shooting is based on shaving precious miliseconds in a defensive shooting situation by not “wasting” time acquiring a good sight picture on target, yet it’s perfectly acceptable to waste those precious milliseconds racking the slide and going through the Mr Roboto like motions of presenting a gun from condition 3.
None of these concepts make sense, and as others said I’d highly recommend re-evaluating you’re desired outcome. Perhaps seek professional training or at the least enjoy the plethora of SOLID information to new pistol shooters that is out there on the internet.
Also, to the pissed off and angry people criticizing this post so intensely by calling him a troll, thank you for your service in helping someone admittedly new to this. (Said with deep sarcasm)
I was hoping someone could link that vid I mentioned earlier..
One of the earlier points the voice over makes is...
Being a good shot at the range means nothing when you are moving on rough ground and being shot at.....
Everything is one handed and they were training with tracers.. that training was for staying alive in a high threat area
Not holes in paper ..
One of the earlier points the voice over makes is...
Being a good shot at the range means nothing when you are moving on rough ground and being shot at.....
Everything is one handed and they were training with tracers.. that training was for staying alive in a high threat area
Not holes in paper ..
We shoot CQB with an empty chamber so that we can safely invite shooters without a holster qualification to join in the fun.
Shooting and reloading is against the clock, so we have to draw, rack, shoot reload and shoot. And hit a small target at least once - otherwise none of the hits count.
If you want to practice with an empty chamber in the holster - shoot CQB. It is the only discipline I know of that works that way.
Shooting and reloading is against the clock, so we have to draw, rack, shoot reload and shoot. And hit a small target at least once - otherwise none of the hits count.
If you want to practice with an empty chamber in the holster - shoot CQB. It is the only discipline I know of that works that way.
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I was thinking condition 3 because it is safer? not really sure. I will look into ECQC. Thank you for the advice.
I am in Nova Scotia.
I am just looking for something to improve my knowledge and to have fun with it. I love larpy stuff so this one caught my eye.
Not looking to kill anyone. Just looking to have fun and maybe become good at something.
I am starting to get the feeling I picked the wrong style. I am open to suggestions.
Honestly that's what I was thinking....
sure there is. Reason why I am looking at it.
Why would you say I am a troll for asking questions? I am looking for something to do. If you don't approve of what I have found then by all means suggest something better.
I have done shotgun drills like this to improve my clay shooting. Now I am on to the pistol.
Looks like a good video. I will watch it when I get the chance.
I really don't want to accidentally shoot myself in the leg. that's why starting from an empty chamber was my initial preferred starting point. I am looking for a list of simple drills to perform at home that will improve my overall performance. I also don't get why I was called a troll. I asked the question looking for alternative suggestions. I have gotten a few.
That’s a fair a reasonable concern to have, as unfortunately many have done that. But, like everything it just comes down to practice.
Simple dry fire drills like drawing from the holster, being slow and methodical, always being conscious of where your trigger finger is, bringing up the gun and acquiring your sights, still being conscious of that trigger finger and once you have your sights acquired then you work your fundamentals of a proper trigger pull, and click.
Just do that over and over and over and over again until it becomes second nature. Don’t worry about the high speed crap that social media loves to purvey, just be slow and methodical about it and you’ll build good muscle memory on your draw.
I do this almost ever othery night still after 7-8 years of shooting, you know why? Because like you, I don’t want to shoot myself either.
And don’t worry about the CGN goon squad, don’t take it personally when someone that can not offer you anything of positive or knowledgeable nature does just that. You get good at subjective reading over the years.
What might make some sense training Israel’s soldiers a certain manual of arms does not necessarily make much sense for the rest of humanity. I was in the Canadian forces infantry and I believe we were trained condition 3 with the browning hi power. I think they did this for the sole purpose of lowering the risk of shooting ourselves or our buddies. Hardly a ringing endorsement.
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Nova Scotia is a little too far for me to invite you out to the range for some help, i'm afraid, but I will echo the importance of dry fire and practicing from your holster if you're currently uncomfortable with the idea of having a live round chambered on the draw. Dry fire practice, and a black badge course would likely go a long way for you right now
1riot1ranger
CGN Regular
- Location
- Calgary, AB
Nova Scotia has some great shooters. Reach out and get your IPSC Black Badge.
easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Greater Vancouver, BC
I don’t know the Israeli Point shooting technique. What I know is my uncle sent many Japanese soldiers to Nirvana using some kind of point shooting technique, including shooting from the hip. He was a guerrilla fighter and had practically unlimited supply of 45acp Hardball for practice and dispatching the enemy. He kept his 45 pistol after the war and I remember seeing it as a young boy.
He told me that pistols are for short range, which is cqb in today’s lingo. He used Garands for serious distance work. He told me at or within pistol range, up to 10-15 meters, one-handed point shooting is the only way to go.
Big JD-From the hills
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Saskatchewan.
They also fired there Thompsons from the hip allot too. Seen something on tv a few years ago now, an older vet(75+years old)of one war or another was still an absolute dead shot shooting bowling pins from the hip at 25 yards or so.
I see a coupe of problems with learning the "Israeli Technique" first is that the Israelis don't actually use it any more, which probably says a lot. The second is that carrying in Condition 3 is pointless, since you're going to be on a hot range when you draw anyway, why handicap yourself? That handicap becomes potentially life ending in a real world situation, but that's not really germane in the legitimate Canadian context. Next, while it is certainly possible to develop the ability to hit man sized targets point shooting at medium range, it certainly isn't easy, cheap, or efficient - certainly without a fair amount of time behind the trigger. Learning to operate a pistol safely, efficiently and accurately is pretty tough with the sights, and good instruction, without either, it's likely to be expensive, risky (depends entirely on you) and frustrating.
As mentioned, get professional instruction, also as mentioned Earl's courses are terrific.
my .02 - it's worth what you paid for it.
As mentioned, get professional instruction, also as mentioned Earl's courses are terrific.
my .02 - it's worth what you paid for it.
Yup, because there is no advancement in techniques since the 40's...
