Fire forming rifle brass without a bullet?

TrevorF

TrevorF

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I was told today I could fire form brass using pistol powder and a wax plug stuffed into the case neck. Im familiar with the cream of wheat method, well by familiar I mean I know it's a thing.
Anyone have any experience with this supposed wax method?
 
I used a piece of cotton ball in the mouth of the case to hold the C.O.W. in and a quarter piece of toilet paper to act as the wad between the powder and C.O.W. wax seemed possibly messy. Out of curiosity, what are you forming?
 
COW and wax plug are essentially the same thing. Load some fast powder, plug it and shoot it. Keep adding powder until the brass comes out with full sharp shoulders instead of just rounded out shoulders. Both are a bit messy as you need to clean out the bore of COW and wax afterwards.

Loading a real bullet and using a starting charge is a nicer method, especially if you aren't doing too many or the bullets you are using can be had for cheap. Plus you can use these laods for initial zeroing and some practice.

What cartridge are you looking to fireform for?
 
I wanted some "cheap" 458 Win Mag brass for significantly reduced cast bullet loads. Started with previously fired 7mm Rem Mag brass. 14 grains Unique, 1/4 of TP as separation wad, fill to base of neck with COW, another piece of TP. Fire at the sky. Resize in FL 458 Win Mag die. Trim as needed. Got that powder charge recipe here on CGN.
 
I have tried making 12g FH shells lately. Turn down a .50 case head and thread on some steel, turn in a 12 gauge rim, 30gr bullseye and about a 1/4 sheet of blue shop towel jammed in with a 380gr .54" cal black powder bullet on top for some mass and a bit more shop towel. I'd use cream of wheat, but I don't want to have to clean it all up and a bullet is easy to catch.

Now, I'm firing it remotely from the next room :)

Tomorrow I am going to try the turn down the .50 shell head 8-12 thousandths and epoxy on a high brass shotgun metal head method so I can use shotgun primers instead of bmg primers. It's also a 10 minute procedure instead of like an hour to make each case.

The goal is to see how fast I can shoot a special light weight projectile into armour. I super prefer the odd jobs over the classic NIJ over and over and over testing.

Someone asked me today if I could ever go back to a normal job. I don't think so.
 
I use Elmers wood glue (the same white stuff your kids use at school) instead of wax over the COW. the total purpose of the wax or glue isn't to help build pressure (the COW does that), it just holds the COW in place during loading/handling, keeps the COW from polluting the action...haven't found any reason to clean a gun afterwards neither, all the COW stays in the cartridge until fired and is totally expelled by the blast.

Just load your chosen powder charge ( I usually use 8-10 gr Unique)then fill case with cow to the shoulder-neck junction and then just a dollop of the glue to set overnight.
 
I’ve read that you can just shoot straight up, no wadding at all. Read this on another site.
Guy was using pistol powder and oiling the cases to help with the forming.
Sorry I couldn’t find the link just now.
 
Thanks for the replies. Is there data out there for this? Which pistol powder, how many grains (dependent upon the caliber) and how much COW?

I'm working with 7.62x40WT. The parent case is .223. Once fire formed and then resized in the 7.62x40 die it doesn't return to the .223 size. So if I could start with fire formed cases it would save a step in load development due to the increased case volume of the fire formed cases.
 
TrevorF said:
Thanks for the replies. Is there data out there for this? Which pistol powder, how many grains (dependent upon the caliber) and how much COW?

I'm working with 7.62x40WT. The parent case is .223. Once fire formed and then resized in the 7.62x40 die it doesn't return to the .223 size. So if I could start with fire formed cases it would save a step in load development due to the increased case volume of the fire formed cases.
Click to expand...

3-4 grains of pistol or similar powder, maybe a tad less on your case.

I use 5 grains in 308 sized cases.

COW about 1/4 way up the neck, then the TP projectile.
 
Potashminer said:
I wanted some "cheap" 458 Win Mag brass for significantly reduced cast bullet loads. Started with previously fired 7mm Rem Mag brass. 14 grains Unique, 1/4 of TP as separation wad, fill to base of neck with COW, another piece of TP. Fire at the sky. Resize in FL 458 Win Mag die. Trim as needed. Got that powder charge recipe here on CGN.
Click to expand...

Would be nice to know what the abbreviations COW and TP stand for !
Looking at a 7mm. Rem. Mag Casing and comparing to a 458 Winchester Mag. Casing I would thing they would split upon Fire forming, how did you make out ?

Cheers
 
there's all-time around here saying that you can use just a primer in a rifle brass to do it I told him you need to have more than just the primer for them is cursing my name calling me an idiot
 
I use 14 grains of Unique (Cause I have lots)in magnum cases, Cream of wheat (Generic because its cheaper) and the cheapest bars of soap I could find which happened to be Ivory. (all you can carry for a buck, and you can still use the bars in the shower if you don't mind it looking like a soap eating wood-pecker invaded your home. They do that). You don't need a wad in between the powder and COW and its safer for the barrel if you don't.

Its not an exact science, start small on the charges and increase until the cases are formed out fully.
 
8mm Lebel to .41 Swiss (10.4mm) trimmed to length after fire forming. I used 42mm length instead of 38mm for ease of feeding .44 cal pistol bullets from tube magazine.
COW and melted candle wax seal. Used old powder measure to dispense COW into case.

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TP:
Wife buys tons of it when on sale.
She complains you never put a new roll on dispenser.
When you do, she complains you didn't put it on the "Right Way"
You wisely don't say that your way is recommended for cat owners, since you don't have any cats. :)
 
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