Prewar Belgian Hi-Power?

[stang]

So what have I got gentlemen, please share your knowledge with me on this.
I have an repro stock that makes it a lot of fun to shoot.

 

[can14]

Looks like one the serial number would confirm it

 

[Horilka]

Acceptance markings look like Belgium pre war military acceptance. Serial number could confirm it.

 

[stang]

Looks like one the serial number would confirm it

Added 5 digit sn
Value?

 

[Horilka]

That's indeed pre-war Belgian military contract. Two issues are non-original magazine and poor grips condition. Not very common handgun at all.

 

[Cameron SS]

Added 5 digit sn
Value?

Looks like mine, but I have the basic sights and bakelight grips. Based on the markings and number I'd say definitely pre-war, probably around 1936 ish based on the number. Condition on mine is about as rough as yours, but your serial number is much lower. I've had people offer up to a grand, but the online auction numbers tend to hover close to $500. Hard to say what yours is worth. As with all things its worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

If you look beside the belgian inspector proof mark there should be a letter. You can check that against this list to see who inspected it, and what years they were active.

 

[can14]

To bad they scrapped the slide taking it apart. That's a common issue because people do it wrong

 

[canuck]

Looks like mine, but I have the basic sights and bakelight grips. Based on the markings and number I'd say definitely pre-war, probably around 1936 ish based on the number. Condition on mine is about as rough as yours, but your serial number is much lower. I've had people offer up to a grand, but the online auction numbers tend to hover close to $500. Hard to say what yours is worth. As with all things its worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

If you look beside the belgian inspector proof mark there should be a letter. You can check that against this list to see who inspected it, and what years they were active.

$500?
Really?
I certainly wouldn't let mine (vv) go for anything near that - I've always thought the pre war HPs were very much collectible and worth much more than that

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[stang]

Looks like mine, but I have the basic sights and bakelight grips. Based on the markings and number I'd say definitely pre-war, probably around 1936 ish based on the number. Condition on mine is about as rough as yours, but your serial number is much lower. I've had people offer up to a grand, but the online auction numbers tend to hover close to $500. Hard to say what yours is worth. As with all things its worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

If you look beside the belgian inspector proof mark there should be a letter. You can check that against this list to see who inspected it, and what years they were active.

It's got the *A so it should be 1911-1940, and I do have original mag.

 

[Cameron SS]

$500?
Really?
I certainly wouldn't let mine (vv) go for anything near that - I've always thought the pre war HPs were very much collectible and worth much more than that

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I wouldnt let mine go that low either, but I did find several US auction listings around that price that looked about as rough as the OPs.

Mine just has the square block rear sight and bakelight/plastic grips. It was closer to the end of the pre war production run. And heavily used. No idea what a reasonable offer would be but yeah $500 wouldnt be it IMO.

 

[hatman1793]

The Chicoms loved the so-called tangent sights that they specified to the John Inglis company making BHP's for the Canadian contingent that their contract had to have them.

As we all know the tangent sight is mostly pointless. 300 yards for a standard 9mm 124 ball round is a pipe dream. They look cool though....

 

[stang]

The Chicoms loved the so-called tangent sights that they specified to the John Inglis company making BHP's for the Canadian contingent that their contract had to have them.

As we all know the tangent sight is mostly pointless. 300 yards for a standard 9mm 124 ball round is a pipe dream. They look cool though....

True enough but with the shoulder stock to much fun to shoot way out there with.

 

[canuck]

I wouldnt let mine go that low either, but I did find several US auction listings around that price that looked about as rough as the OPs.

Mine just has the square block rear sight and bakelight/plastic grips. It was closer to the end of the pre war production run. And heavily used. No idea what a reasonable offer would be but yeah $500 wouldnt be it IMO.

If I'm not mistaken, a pre-war HP with fixed sights is much more uncommon than the tangent sight model

 

[Cameron SS]

If I'm not mistaken, a pre-war HP with fixed sights is much more uncommon than the tangent sight model

Interesting. I've not seen that documented anywhere but anecdotally I've seen far more with the tangent sites than ones like mine. While we are on the topic, Anyone know a good smith who can do a tune up on an old HP? My pistol doesn't cycle as reliably as I'd like.

 

[canuck]

Interesting. I've not seen that documented anywhere but anecdotally I've seen far more with the tangent sites than ones like mine. While we are on the topic, Anyone know a good smith who can do a tune up on an old HP? My pistol doesn't cycle as reliably as I'd like.

So, I went looking for the reference to my postulation and, from Anthony Vanderlinden's first edition of "The Belgian Browning Pistols" - page 170:

...The High Power pistol was offered in two variations. The military variation with tangent sights and a slot on the frame to accept a shoulder-stock and the commercial variation without slot and with fixed sights. The price and size of the High Power pistol made it unpopular on the commercial market, and few prewar fixed sight models were ever sold.

Manufacturing went through numerous small modifications during the German occupation. FN maintained some of the wartime manufacturing practices after the liberation. The fixed sight model became the standard military as well as the commercial model. The tangent sights and slotted frame became optional.

Further down the page he mentions that the Bakelite grip panels were introduced under German occupation - years 1943 to 1945 - with FN using the remain stockpiles of these grips after liberation.

Based upon that info, I would suggest that your High Power may be of immediate post-war production - not pre-war

 

[Cameron SS]

So, I went looking for the reference to my postulation and, from Anthony Vanderlinden's first edition of "The Belgian Browning Pistols" - page 170:





Further down the page he mentions that the Bakelite grip panels were introduced under German occupation - years 1943 to 1945 - with FN using the remain stockpiles of these grips after liberation.

Based upon that info, I would suggest that your High Power may be of immediate post-war production - not pre-war

My understanding is that there was no post war production in belgium because the factories all got destroyed. I'd be happy to verify with any info you have, but the last time I found a register of serials numbers on the internet the serial number coincided with a 1938 production date. Bakelight grips could have been an aftermarket swap.

Thanks for this.

 

[stang]

So, I went looking for the reference to my postulation and, from Anthony Vanderlinden's first edition of "The Belgian Browning Pistols" - page 170:





Further down the page he mentions that the Bakelite grip panels were introduced under German occupation - years 1943 to 1945 - with FN using the remain stockpiles of these grips after liberation.

Based upon that info, I would suggest that your High Power may be of immediate post-war production - not pre-war

What about the proof marks, do they indicate pre or post war?

 

[canuck]

My understanding is that there was no post war production in belgium because the factories all got destroyed. I'd be happy to verify with any info you have, but the last time I found a register of serials numbers on the internet the serial number coincided with a 1938 production date. Bakelight grips could have been an aftermarket swap.

Thanks for this.

According to Blake Stevens, page 151 "The Browning High Power Automatic Pistol", the Belgians took directorship of (what was left of) the FN factory 3 months after the Normandy invasion and were back producing High Power pistols before the war ended
Also, according to him, the first postwar guns had no mag safety and a letter A prefixing the serial number.

One sure way to know if a pistol is prewar is if the cam slot in the lug on the bottom of the barrel is rounded or squared off - the slots were squared off in the last run of Belgian production (that is, provided the barrel is original!)

 

[canuck]

What about the proof marks, do they indicate pre or post war?

 

[stang]

Here's hopefully a better pic of the markings, it has all of the ones in your post?