Oh ya!!! try 300gn FPHP bullets out of a 45-70 or 458 at about 2400fps thru the ribs of a deer! Take my word for it there IS overkill!
Overkill ???????
- Thread starter 303carbine
- Start date
Oh ya!!! try 300gn FPHP bullets out of a 45-70 or 458 at about 2400fps thru the ribs of a deer! Take my word for it there IS overkill!
As I haven't actually been out hunting and have only read opinions, I would have to say my viewpoint would be coming from an ethical and researched stand point.
First, I would rather an overkill instead of an underkill. no use in making an animal suffer for its death.
Second, wasted meat in my opinion removes some of the factor for killing the animal....resulting in overkill...the animal has died for your reasons, the least you can do is effectively use it to your means.
For deer I myself would like to use my 250 savage but due to area constraints I will be forced to use a shotgun. I am still researching whether to use buckshot or slug.
For moose I have a 303 british or a 308 win, which I hear both should be adequate.
If rifles were allowed in my area, would I use my 303/308 on deer? Why bother, my 250 has virtually no recoil and is my favorite and most comfortable rifle to shoot with. If I only had a 303/308 then I would research into the different cartridges available and use the most optimal one (in this situation I hear the 150gr for 308)
First, I would rather an overkill instead of an underkill. no use in making an animal suffer for its death.
Second, wasted meat in my opinion removes some of the factor for killing the animal....resulting in overkill...the animal has died for your reasons, the least you can do is effectively use it to your means.
For deer I myself would like to use my 250 savage but due to area constraints I will be forced to use a shotgun. I am still researching whether to use buckshot or slug.
For moose I have a 303 british or a 308 win, which I hear both should be adequate.
If rifles were allowed in my area, would I use my 303/308 on deer? Why bother, my 250 has virtually no recoil and is my favorite and most comfortable rifle to shoot with. If I only had a 303/308 then I would research into the different cartridges available and use the most optimal one (in this situation I hear the 150gr for 308)
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its more to do with bullet type, than weight
a 130 grain Triple Shock will out penetrate and most likely damage less meat than a 165 grain SST or Ballistic Tip.
Wrong Way
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Slug. You're done researching. Trust me.
X2. "Buckshot" is not suitable for deer...regardless of what they call it. Slugs.
Overkill could be defined in different categories.
1. More bullet weight than needed.
2. More velocity than needed.
3. More caliber (bore size) than needed.
4. More shots than needed.
Only #2 and #4 cause excessive waste of meat.
.
1. More bullet weight than needed.
2. More velocity than needed.
3. More caliber (bore size) than needed.
4. More shots than needed.
Only #2 and #4 cause excessive waste of meat.
.
My concern is that so many hunters with big guns (or semi-autos) are trying to make up for their inability to shoot well. Inability to shoot well comes from a lack of practice. A lack of practice comes from expensive ammo in a gun the hurts to shoot.
Deer are easy to kill. A 30-30 has all the power needed. More power just destroys more meat. The exception is those who hunt the long distance shots in the West. Here in the east deer and moose are usually short range shots. 20 yards is about my average.
If we are not talking long range , the 308/30-06 family of cartridges is far more than adequate for deer and just fine for moose. Assuming the hunter can hit the boiler room.
My grandfather had a ranch in northern BC (Smithers area). Each year for 50+ years he shot 2 moose. One for the family and one for the local hospital. He used a M94 Winchester 30-30 rifle. I once asked about the power of the 30-30 on what were quite big moose. He said he always shot them in the ear and they dropped in their tracks. He said only once did one not drop and he had to track it for a day before getting it.
I am not suggesting 30-30 as a moose rifle as a choice, but at close range it would take out a lung or heart. A big magnum is not required.
I want to go elk hunting one day. I would take my 338 or 375 mag, just because I already have them and want to try them out. I would not hesitate to use a 30-06 with a premium bullet.
Deer are easy to kill. A 30-30 has all the power needed. More power just destroys more meat. The exception is those who hunt the long distance shots in the West. Here in the east deer and moose are usually short range shots. 20 yards is about my average.
If we are not talking long range , the 308/30-06 family of cartridges is far more than adequate for deer and just fine for moose. Assuming the hunter can hit the boiler room.
My grandfather had a ranch in northern BC (Smithers area). Each year for 50+ years he shot 2 moose. One for the family and one for the local hospital. He used a M94 Winchester 30-30 rifle. I once asked about the power of the 30-30 on what were quite big moose. He said he always shot them in the ear and they dropped in their tracks. He said only once did one not drop and he had to track it for a day before getting it.
I am not suggesting 30-30 as a moose rifle as a choice, but at close range it would take out a lung or heart. A big magnum is not required.
I want to go elk hunting one day. I would take my 338 or 375 mag, just because I already have them and want to try them out. I would not hesitate to use a 30-06 with a premium bullet.
How can something be too dead? IMO there is no such thing as overkill but there is such a thing as excessive meat damage.
Shoot a grouse in the breast with a .45-70 and see what happens; to dead no a mess you can't serve to guests yes.
Shoot a grouse in the breast with a .45-70 and see what happens; to dead no a mess you can't serve to guests yes.
Well if your definition of "overkill" is "too dead" then I suppose your right!
But most would consider the definition of "overkill" as "going to far", or "too much"
For instance taking a tractor transport to move a kitchen chair is "overkill"
You don't have to "too dead" the chair to do it!
Using a gun, way too large for the job is "overkill" even if you don't hit anything.
.375H&H 235 Speer HotCore with enough IMR 4350 to make it reach the magical Varmint Velocity of 3000fps. To some this may seem like overkill but I think that deep down inside of us there is the need to every once in a while perform these gast atrosities.
BTW this guy went at least 8ft in the air doing the helicopter spin before coming to rest in this pose
BTW this guy went at least 8ft in the air doing the helicopter spin before coming to rest in this pose
- Location
- Vancouver Island BC
Same load, same day! Use enough gun was the theme of the day
This is one of Bonez's favotite pics
The other theme of the day......take no prisoners
Heartless bugger for sure
The reason I took that rifle on the chuck hunt was actually spawned by a thread here about recoiling rifles and the ability to shoot them acurately. I sighted the rifle in in the same feild as we shot chucks. First with some 300's to get it near and then the 235's. I shot 28 chucks that afternoon. 18 with out a miss. 14 of those were with the .375. Yes not one miss with the magnum. The first pic I posted was an offhand standing shot @ 100 yrds. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS OVERKILL ladies
The reason I took that rifle on the chuck hunt was actually spawned by a thread here about recoiling rifles and the ability to shoot them acurately. I sighted the rifle in in the same feild as we shot chucks. First with some 300's to get it near and then the 235's. I shot 28 chucks that afternoon. 18 with out a miss. 14 of those were with the .375. Yes not one miss with the magnum. The first pic I posted was an offhand standing shot @ 100 yrds. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS OVERKILL ladies
Threemorewishes
CGN Regular
- Location
- Ottawa Ontario Canada
I once shot a field mouse with a 12 gauge from about 10 feet....it disappeared! Probably could have used a pellet gun but this way I did not have to pick up the carcass.
