Buffer weight calculator

greg olmstead

CGN Regular
Rating - 100%
27   0   0
Location
alberta
So I'm trying to develop a reference table for buffer weights, bcg weight and gas system length. I have quickload to get pressure at the gas port with each gas system, max chamber pressure and case capacity.

It will all be calculated with max loads for each caliber with a .093" gas port. I will be calculating gas volumes, bore volumes and the volume of the gas system.

For reference of a properly gassed system I am using a .093" gas port, carbine buffer, standard weight bcg rifle length gas system 223 with a max charge of h4895 (25.8 gr)and a 55 gr bullet making 55000 psi chamber pressure, 3157 fps and 15875 psi at the gas port. A total volume of gas created at 93.41% of propellant burnt is 1561cc or 95.26 cubic inches of gas. (All smokeless powder makes 1 liter of gas per gram of powder burnt. Doesnt matter what powder it is as all double base smokeless powders are the same base and create the same amount of gas. It's the retardant coating on the powder that dictates burn rate.) Burn rate dictates how much powder will be burnt in the duration of the projectile traveling down the barrel. That's why the 93.41% is there. Bullet weights will also change the amount of propellant burnt

So my question is for you fine folks is, is there anything else I should consider in my calculations other than case capacity, max pressure, gas system length, gas port diameter, gas volume, pressure at gas port, pressure at muzzle, barrel length, bullet weight charge weight, bcg weight and gas system volume assuming that a standard spring rate buffer spring is being used.

So far in my preliminary calculations I have noticed the 204 ruger makes 20626 psi at the port and the 30 Remington AR makes 11865 psi with the 7.62x39 making only 9894 psi which is only 888 psi more than a 223 has at the muzzle on a 20 inch barrel.

I understand that every rifle is different and I just want to create a base line people can reference for new builds on non mainstream cartridges like the 30Rem Ar and others.

For those who have built a 7.62x39 or 30 rem ar or 450 bushmaster where is the gas port? Rifle, mid, carbine or pistol. My numbers are saying a 450 BM should have a pistol length gas system. Is this right?
 
For those who have built a 7.62x39 or 30 rem ar or 450 bushmaster where is the gas port? Rifle, mid, carbine or pistol. My numbers are saying a 450 BM should have a pistol length gas system. Is this right?

I built a 7.62x39 Modern Sporter. The barrel is made by IBI and is 19" long with a mid length gas port. I'm using a standard carbine length buffer spring and carbine length H buffer (3.8oz). I didn't measure the gas port size.

The rifle functions 100% but to be fair I've only shot Hornady Black 123gr SST factory ammo through it. I never tried it with crappy ammo like Barnul or MFS which generally runs a little on the lighter powered side.


Also Ruger makes a 450 BM AR-15 with an 18.6" barrel and according to their specs it has a carbine length gas port.

https://store.prophetriver.com/ruge...ger-elite-452-ar-trigger-restricted-mfg-8522/
 
Sounds like there is a big need for this technical data. Lots of questions on AR threads concern the question "What kind of buffer should I use?"
Thanks for taking the time. Sounds like you've put quite a bit of thinking into this. My only suggestion is make room for other technical advances down the line.

Also lots of people are using silent spring systems because the standard spring (sproingg sound) annoys them. Is there a need to accommodate these speciality add ons?

Also I think the goal of a properly gassed system should be defined at the outset. What does a properly gassed system look like? Some shooters say that case ejection between 3 and 4 o'clock is a properly gassed system. It this all there is to it or is there more?
 
For those who have built a 7.62x39 or 30 rem ar or 450 bushmaster where is the gas port? Rifle, mid, carbine or pistol. My numbers are saying a 450 BM should have a pistol length gas system. Is this right?
I have all of those calibers working on acr's and they all use carbine length gas systems on an 18.6 barrel
 
So far I have calculated all volumes on my max load 223 20 inch barrel .750 gas journal. The total internal volume of the rifle including the case bcg gas port gas tube and bore volume. I have 17.575cc of volume. The round creates 1561cc of gas when ignited. This tells me it take 1543.43 cc of gas to move a total mass of 190.98 oz which includes a force of 176.37oz to fully compress the spring and a 3 oz buffer. Now I just need to figure out the formula to make 190.98 oz equal 3 oz with 1543.43 cc of gas used
 
Last edited:
I think I have it figured. I used my formula to spit out a buffer weight needed of 3.88 oz for a 6.5 grendel. 20 inch barrel .093 gas port

And a 2.95 oz buffer for the 223

These are loads from quickload to get the max load of certain powders. Each powder is going to be different due to different charge weights needed to get a max load.
 
I have all of those calibers working on acr's and they all use carbine length gas systems on an 18.6 barrel

ACR's can't be compared to an AR15 barrel being used on an actual AR15 with a normal bolt (Gas Expansion) regardless of the location of the gas port. Given the ACR uses a piston and so on, no discernible data from one will apply to other. They're entirely different systems.
 
Last edited:
I think I have it figured. I used my formula to spit out a buffer weight needed of 3.88 oz for a 6.5 grendel. 20 inch barrel .093 gas port

And a 2.95 oz buffer for the 223

These are loads from quickload to get the max load of certain powders. Each powder is going to be different due to different charge weights needed to get a max load.

You may need to look at what your calculating - the gas flows into the bolt through the Carrier Key. The gas expands and drives the bolt forward, away from the carrier causing it to rotate in the carrier and unlock from the extension, subsequently driving the Bolt Carrier Assembly rearward. I don't think your calculations of gas/volumes have anything to do with the internal volume of the "piston" that is created by the Bolt in the Carrier, and the necessary gas required to make that system function.
 
You may need to look at what your calculating - the gas flows into the bolt through the Carrier Key. The gas expands and drives the bolt forward, away from the carrier causing it to rotate in the carrier and unlock from the extension, subsequently driving the Bolt Carrier Assembly rearward. I don't think your calculations of gas/volumes have anything to do with the internal volume of the "piston" that is created by the Bolt in the Carrier, and the necessary gas required to make that system function.

Never mind that, gas cools down as it travels down the tube. Cooled down gas loses density, thus less volumetric pressure
 
Back
Top Bottom