Best HD option in .223?

[PinaKaleada]

We established you think plinking targets on a static range is the equivalent of training and gun fighting in non permissive environments

So you advocate for the ricochet iron pan method as an effective tactic in a gun fight? Because if you can do it on the range that makes it valid in a gun fight right?

You going to answer or dodge?



This has to be some kind of record for CGN having to actually argue that the proper thing to do is use your sights in a gun fight inside your house. If this wasn't so sad it would be hilarious

Shawn

Let me change this up a little bit. At what distance do you, Shawn, be ok with point-and-shoot?

For example:
1.) Anything further than 1 ft
2.) Anything further than 2 ft
3.) Anything further than 1 m
4.) Anything further than 2 m

Whats your distance? I'm trying to imagine you aiming with sights, a target 1 ft away

No seriously, whats your distance when you wouldn't use the sights and just point-and-shoot?

 

[shawn]

It aged really well because, barring a small population 28(a)(i)(ii), the approvals, are not for the purpose of defense. Claiming otherwise is obtuse.

I made no claim to what percentage of applications were approved for what. You claimed it did not exist, it does

Shawn

 

[shawn]

Let me change this up a little bit. At what distance do you, Shawn, be ok with point-and-shoot?

For example:
1.) Anything further than 1 ft
2.) Anything further than 2 ft
3.) Anything further than 1 m
4.) Anything further than 2 m

Whats your distance? I'm trying to imagine you aiming with sights, a target 1 ft away

No seriously, whats your distance when you wouldn't use the sights and just point-and-shoot?

Already posted, stop dodging

can you guarantee that all your rounds will land within a 10 inch circle under stress in the dark when you were not planning on a gun fight at 5m. All the while your target is moving, unlit, the target is at an oblique angle, and you cant see the 10 inch circle because it is under one or more baggy layers of clothes

Shawn

 

[PinaKaleada]

Already posted, stop dodging



Shawn

Answer: I cannot guarantee, but I'd guess it would be the same hit rate if it's on a target thats moving.

Actually scratch the above. You can't really "aim" at a moving target that close. You can try to follow it with your sights, but you're certainly lagging behind or just reacting to the movements.

Bonus: Using your sights means the bottom half of the "situation" is obscured. It's actually detrimental to use the sights at those distances. Have you thought about that? You say you train right? lol


So now question to you: At what distance do you give up aiming? My arms reach 2ft out, do you aim at a target at 2ft? Aim a contact shot?

 

[mclmm]

I made no claim to what percentage of applications were approved for what. You claimed it did not exist, it does

Shawn

I made no such claim.

 

[shawn]

Answer: I cannot guarantee, but I'd guess it would be the same hit rate if it's on a target thats moving.

Actually scratch the above. You can't really "aim" at a moving target that close. You can try to follow it with your sights, but you're certainly lagging behind or just reacting to the movements.

Bonus: Using your sights means the bottom half of the "situation" is obscured. It's actually detrimental to use the sights at those distances. Have you thought about that? You say you train right? lol


So now question to you: At what distance do you give up aiming? My arms reach 2ft out, do you aim at a target at 2ft? Aim a contact shot?

LOL do you actually read what you write?

Now we cant aim at a moving target. And if your sights are taking up half of your vision you are doing it wrong. Your questions are hilarious and already been answered. You need to take a course it will all be covered there. They will teach shooting from retention and how to aim

Shawn

 

[shawn]

I made no such claim.

You are correct, you implied it, and was proven wrong

Shawn

 

[PinaKaleada]

LOL do you actually read what you write?

Now we cant aim at a moving target. And if your sights are taking up half of your vision you are doing it wrong. Your questions are hilarious and already been answered. You need to take a course it will all be covered there. They will teach shooting from retention and how to aim

Shawn

You haven't answered. Maybe I missed it but why don't you tell me again.
At what distance do you give up aiming and go with muscle memory?

And if your sights are taking up half of your vision you are doing it wrong.

Wait.. are you doing it wrong? At certain distances, the dot actually covers the point of impact........How is the bottom 2/3s of your target not covered if you're aiming center mass.....

 

[shawn]

Wait.. are you doing it wrong? At certain distances, the dot actually covers the point of impact........How is the bottom 2/3s of your target not covered if you're aiming center mass.....

LOL you are playing a game you are completely unqualified for

1) Not what you said, you are now changing what you said to try and BS your way though trying to catch me in something:

Using your sights means the bottom half of the "situation" is obscured. It's actually detrimental to use the sights at those distances

2) Situation has now turned into point of impact as you realized what you posted was retarded
3) Your BS is growing form 1/2 to 2/3
4) You are now inventing how physics work, If you are aiming at center of mass how is it possible to cover 2/3 of the target and still hit center of mass at the ranges you spray and pray at?

You can try and BS your way through this all you want, it is not going to change the fact that you obviously have not had training, have not actually done this and do not know what your are talking about.

Shawn

 

[shawn]

You haven't answered. Maybe I missed it but why don't you tell me again.
At what distance do you give up aiming and go with muscle memory?

Short answer is never. But shooting from retention you are not using the sights to aim

Shawn

 

[PinaKaleada]

LOL you are playing a game you are completely unqualified for

1) Not what you said, you are now changing what you said to try and BS your way though trying to catch me in something:



2) Situation has now turned into point of impact as you realized what you posted was retarded
3) Your BS is growing form 1/2 to 2/3
4) You are now inventing how physics work, If you are aiming at center of mass how is it possible to cover 2/3 of the target and still hit center of mass at the ranges you spray and pray at?

You can try and BS your way through this all you want, it is not going to change the fact that you obviously have not had training, have not actually done this and do not know what your are talking about.

Shawn

Reason why 2/3 is also physics. The center of mass of a "target" is actually located high up, so you would be covering the bottom 2/3s. You get it?

Furthermore, for you to get a sight picture on center mass at 5m, you actually need to aim higher, more like sight picture #3. (Sight #2 is for 10-25 yards for glocks)

So I'm going to revise my answer: You would actually be chasing the "head" with your aiming, since anything under the head would be covered.

It's not practical at all.

 

[Still alive]

Are we still talking .223 here or handgun?

Why would one need to aim higher with a pistol at 5m to hit center of mass? Or are you talking hold over with optics on a rifle?

 

[PinaKaleada]

Are we still talking .223 here or handgun?

Why would one need to aim higher with a pistol at 5m to hit center of mass? Or are you talking hold over with optics on a rifle?

Reason is the sights are for 10-25yards. To hit something at 5m, you would need to "cover" the target, or aim a little higher.

 

[shawn]

Are we still talking .223 here or handgun?

Why would one need to aim higher with a pistol at 5m to hit center of mass? Or are you talking hold over with optics on a rifle?

Hey now,

Let not confuse the argument with something else he probably has no clue about.

Hes just getting it sorted out with head shots now while point shooting LOL

Shawn

 

[PinaKaleada]

Hey now,

Let not confuse the argument with something else he probably has no clue about.

Hes just getting it sorted out with head shots now while point shooting LOL

Shawn

No, I'm talking about center of mass. Again, #2 is for 10-25 yards. For anything like 5m, you would need to use #3, which basically covers your target except for the head. So your aiming will basically be chasing heads TO get the center of mass impacts at 5m.

(You definitely twisted my words there, no one is talking about head shots)

So you say you train right?

 

[shawn]

No, I'm talking about center of mass. Again, #2 is for 10-25 yards. For anything like 5m, you would need to use #3, which basically covers your target except for the head. So your aiming will basically be chasing heads at 5m.

(You definitely twisted my words there, no one is talking about head shots)

It's not practical at all.

1) what ever you are posting is not coming up
2)

which basically covers your target except for the head. So your aiming will basically be chasing heads TO get the center of mass impacts at 5m

OK so you are "chasing heads" but not shooting at them. If thats not the perfect example of why you should aim I dont know what is LOL

Shawn

 

[Still alive]

Reason is the sights are for 10-25yards. To hit something at 5m, you would need to "cover" the target, or aim a little higher.

I’m sorry....what? 9mm at 5m won’t drop that much, regardless of where the sights are set. We are talking a hypothetical HD situation here, right? Get your flash sight picture, front sight on target and go. Getting up at 3am isn’t the time to be shooting tight groups.

 

[PinaKaleada]

I’m sorry....what? 9mm at 5m won’t drop that much, regardless of where the sights are set. We are talking a HD situation here. Get your flash sight picture, front sight on target and go. Getting up at 3am isn’t the time to be shooting tight groups.

It's not exactly a drop that you're dealing with, but the sight is for 10-25. Anything before 10 yards and after 25 yards are going to be low.

So for a target 5m, you will likely be covering most of the target in order to get shots on center mass.

Hence, I've been trying to tell him that aiming at 5m is not practical.

 

[shawn]

You also know that when people say center of mass in the real world, not during plinking time, its not a reference to the A Zone on a target right? Its the center of visible mass of the target, could be an elbow, could be face, could be right foot, could be the 4inch wide strip of person if they are facing side ways etc etc

Shawn

 

[shawn]

No, read this carefully. It's not exactly a drop that you're dealing with, but the sight is for 10-25. Anything before 10 yards and after 25 yards are going to be low.

So for a target 5m, you will likely be covering most of the target in order to get shots on center mass.

Hence, I've been trying to tell you that aiming at 5m is not practical.

You cant be real can you? You are going full retard

Shawn