Controlled round feed real life benefits

Maybe use micrometer or caliber to check your extractor - should be 3 or 4 thou tension with a cartridge rim under it - pushing case rim against those little stops on the other side. A worn extractor might release a cartridge also - should be able to snap a cartridge on to the bolt face and it should be fairly snugly held in there. Should not "fall off".
 
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guntech said:
If both the controlled round feed action and the push feed action are working properly it doesn't really matter which you have. If one is not working properly, that one will be a pain in the ass.

It is more important the owner familiarize himself with what ever he has... and know how it works. Panicking and not operating the bolt properly is an operating error, not a design failure of the action.

You don't have to cycle rounds into the chamber to unload a push feed... just operate the bolt far enough for the round to pop up, raise the muzzle and pull the bolt back and dump the round out the port.
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Exactly.
I've owned and used both, and while I admire the controlled feed, it hasn't offered me any real advantage.
 
Potashminer said:
Why not? said:
SuperCub said:
....One thing I do note is that the bolt needs to be worked assertively in order to get it to feed and eject properly. No gingerly bolt working like the 700s. If (at the range) you pull the 98 bolt back slow, the empty case will just pop of the extractor and sit in the top of the magazine.
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You have a poorly fitted extractor. The extractor should hold the case firmly against the bolt face. Enough so that you can pull open the bolt stop/ejector, and completely remove the bolt with the case or loaded round still on the bolt.
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Maybe use micrometer or caliber to check your extractor - should be 3 or 4 thou tension with a cartridge rim under it - pushing case rim against those little stops on the other side. A worn extractor might release a cartridge also - should be able to snap a cartridge on to the bolt face and it should be fairly snugly held in there. Should not "fall off".
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Yes. Easy fix though, as there are literally thousands of them available.
Ted
 
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SuperCub said:
Most of my rifles in the past have been 700s. No problems with any of them at the range or hunting.

Saying that, I am currently working up loads for an FN98. Extractor is original so cases have to be fed from the mag and not singly inserted into the chamber which is ok just different. One thing I do note is that the bolt needs to be worked assertively in order to get it to feed and eject properly. No gingerly bolt working like the 700s. If (at the range) you pull the 98 bolt back slow, the empty case will just pop of the extractor and sit in the top of the magazine.
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You have a poorly functioning Mauser. Although you can extract cases with a mechanical ejector gingerly enough to have the case fall back into the magazine if angles are correct.

Mechanical ejection is not controlled round feeding though. But the two systems are often paired with each other.
 
Assuming both rifle and ammunition are functioning properly the last variable is the shooter. CRF can be a bit more forgiving when it comes to short stroking
 
"more grip on the rim" - I read that often as a reason why mauser style extractors are better. I have pulled half a rim off a case stuck in my loading die - everyone has to do that at least once, right? But I have never seen or experienced a smaller push feed type extractor rip a chunk off the rim, where a mauser extractor would have pulled it out? I am sure it was a thing with iffy ammo in WWI era - not so sure it is a "practical, real life" advantage any more???

From drawings in Kuhnhausen's shop manual, I am not sure that even 50% of that mauser extractor claw is actually bearing on the cartridge rim in the first place???
 
I've never seen it either, looking at my browning a bolt and my sako av my m70 extractor looks bigger and has a wider grip on the rim. It makes me think that it would have more pull power. jmo.
 
SuperCub said:
One thing I do note is that the bolt needs to be worked assertively in order to get it to feed and eject properly. No gingerly bolt working like the 700s. If (at the range) you pull the 98 bolt back slow, the empty case will just pop of the extractor and sit in the top of the magazine.
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Potashminer said:
Maybe use micrometer or caliber to check your extractor - should be 3 or 4 thou tension with a cartridge rim under it - pushing case rim against those little stops on the other side. A worn extractor might release a cartridge also - should be able to snap a cartridge on to the bolt face and it should be fairly snugly held in there. Should not "fall off".
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Thanks to those who responded. ..... I should clarify my original statement and relay that the case does not "fall off" the extractor at any point except when it contacts the ejector.

If I pull back on the bolt slowly (at the range trying to keep the brass on the bench) when the case contacts the ejector it pops off the extractor and just sits in the mag well. If I operate the bolt faster, it works perfectly as it should. Just different than what I am used to with the 700.
 
-Bolt feel, better with a slick CRF than a push feed, as the extractor doesn’t have to be popped over the rim by force on closing.
-Ruggedness, CRF extractors are by nature beefier units than the small extractors on push feeds, which admittedly work fine.
-Soft extraction is easier with a blade ejector CRF.
-Ability to cycle rounds out of the mag through the action with a CRF, without closing the bolt, is handy.
-Push feed is generally used as a manufacturing simplification, rather than a design improvement.
-Contrary to popular belief most CRFs are easily modified to accept single round feeding, directly into the chamber, if desired. I find this a non-concern personally and just feed singles from the mag regardless.
 
Freyr_255 said:
Ok, I'll concede this point. I guess I've never had a round not chamber before that wasn't feed angle related so didn't really think of it as much of an issue to have a round aligned and not chamber. I guess dirt, but presumably if that was the case the other shells would have a similar issue. Perhaps a malformed casing or the wrong cartridge. Presumably these second two are easy to mitigate with a little attention though lol!
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This is a factory .250 Savage Winchester Silvertip: luckily I was already in the habit of running every round through the chamber before going out. Otherwise that might have been embarrassing. ( sorry for the crappy auto-out-of-focus picture). I'll admit that most of my ammo problems have been self inflicted... bullet seated too far out, case shoulder not bumped back, etc, and I catch these early on. Still, it's a lot easier to fix when you can just bang on the bolt handle.

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Anything I've shot with a crf could have been killed with a pushfeed. And vice versa. The only real world difference is on internet forums where imaginations and what-ifs are free to run wild.
 
Same, here’s a factory .375 H&H I pulled out of the box on an African DG hunt. #### happens, and even if it’s not once in a lifetime Zimbabwe or dangerous game it can ruin a hunt. This one if it wasn’t spotted would have got very sticky, for sure.

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9.3mauser said:
This is a factory .250 Savage Winchester Silvertip: luckily I was already in the habit of running every round through the chamber before going out. Otherwise that might have been embarrassing. ( sorry for the crappy auto-out-of-focus picture). I'll admit that most of my ammo problems have been self inflicted... bullet seated too far out, case shoulder not bumped back, etc, and I catch these early on. Still, it's a lot easier to fix when you can just bang on the bolt handle.

View attachment 392330View attachment 392331
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Well...if you've ever bought new winchester brass this shouldn't be surprising lol! I had like 4 bags I bought one time that had about a 5% throw away on them due to manufacturing defects like cracked and crumpled necks(1-3 per bag of 50). But yes, the point is taken that ammunition can have defects in it.
 
Ardent said:
Same, here’s a factory .375 H&H I pulled out of the box on an African DG hunt. #### happens, and even if it’s not once in a lifetime Zimbabwe or dangerous game it can ruin a hunt. This one if it wasn’t spotted would have got very sticky, for sure.
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This is why I run every round I use on a hunt through the rifle. 100% verification that every round will chamber... even after all the other QC checks when loading them.
 
Potashminer said:
"more grip on the rim" - I read that often as a reason why mauser style extractors are better. I have pulled half a rim off a case stuck in my loading die - everyone has to do that at least once, right? But I have never seen or experienced a smaller push feed type extractor rip a chunk off the rim, where a mauser extractor would have pulled it out?
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Pretty much. You can beat on a Rem 700 extractor to the point of damaging the bolt handle. Sako type extractors I would assume can take the same, but I've never had the need to test it. If the extractor is good to begin with, you'll damage something else first. And if your rifle gets stuck up so badly you're beating bolt handles, safe to say that getting that particular stuck case out isn't the end of your problems.
 
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