My son turns 13 here in a two months, he has been working on the online Hunter Safety course and he is ready to write the test and do his PAL course. I want to get him a shotgun of some kind for the fall. I hunt grouse, ducks and geese mostly and I just use my Browning BPS for all that, it works great. Unfortunately my son is very small for his age, he weighs just 80lbs and is quite short. Besides the gun being way to big for him, I think 3" BB shells would put him on his butt in a hurry. I was thinking about a gun to use just when we are grouse hunting, so it would have to be light enough he can carry it all day as I sometimes cover 15-18kms a day walking when I hunt grouse. Kind of in the dark on this one, being a big guy, I mostly have experience with 12 gauge guns, never really played with 20G or 410 too much. Used to have a 410 for grouse, but the 12 gauge is a better gun for a do all kind of gun. Any suggestions on a smaller, lighter gun that won't beat him up too bad? For budget I would say $700 max.
Best shotgun for a very small person
- Thread starter FLYBYU44
- Start date
I did some research when I got into this and bought a Browning BPS in a .410 for grouse hunting. After a few years I switched to a Cooey single shot 20 guage, I wish I had started with that. The recoil isn’t that bad and the success rate for me (a new shooter) is higher. Plus a 20 ga is more versatile of a shot.
So, I recommend a 20 ga over a .410. Also, a single shot break barrel is a safe, light, easy first gun. Cooeys can be had for under $300 take the other $400 of your budget and get him a decent .22 with an inexpensive scope.
I know nothing about kids and shooting though, so this advice is worth what you paid for it! Good luck!
So, I recommend a 20 ga over a .410. Also, a single shot break barrel is a safe, light, easy first gun. Cooeys can be had for under $300 take the other $400 of your budget and get him a decent .22 with an inexpensive scope.
I know nothing about kids and shooting though, so this advice is worth what you paid for it! Good luck!
I started off with a 20ga when i was younger, but man that thing kicked. It had a solid buttplate and fit me very poorly. If it fit better and had even a half decent pad on the end i think i would have been fine with it. Even now i use 20ga for anything but ducks, so it's certainly capable.
As long as he can handle the recoil well, something like this turkish single shot should work fine, you can adjust the stock down to fit him and it's not so long and barrel heavy. The downside will be as it gets lighter, it kicks more, but the buttpad looks pretty decent.
https://frontierfirearms.ca/midland-backpack-20ga-3-22-barrel-syn/
If not there's lots of similar options in 410 to start him out, then move on to 20ga later on.
As long as he can handle the recoil well, something like this turkish single shot should work fine, you can adjust the stock down to fit him and it's not so long and barrel heavy. The downside will be as it gets lighter, it kicks more, but the buttpad looks pretty decent.
https://frontierfirearms.ca/midland-backpack-20ga-3-22-barrel-syn/
If not there's lots of similar options in 410 to start him out, then move on to 20ga later on.
gunrunner100
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- NW Ontario
I would choose a 20g over a 410, mostly for hunter success. As for recoil, you can use low base shells with a reduced powder charge.
Take a look at the "Youth" models offered by Mossberg (510) and Remington (870).
Take a look at the "Youth" models offered by Mossberg (510) and Remington (870).
Mossberg Youth 20 gauge - versatile and lasting
id agree with this, start off with the lightest loads available. he may be so happy with the gift he might not even mention the recoil. even if it kicks the snot out of him at first .
keep in mind , next year he will be 14 then before you know it 16 and he will be in the fields with his buddies lighting stuff up.
if its first firearm , he will probably never sell it either. so a good solid .410 might be just as fun for him to start , and grow old with. but keep in mind he will pretty much need a bigger shot once he hits 16
id agree with this, start off with the lightest loads available. he may be so happy with the gift he might not even mention the recoil. even if it kicks the snot out of him at first .
keep in mind , next year he will be 14 then before you know it 16 and he will be in the fields with his buddies lighting stuff up.
if its first firearm , he will probably never sell it either. so a good solid .410 might be just as fun for him to start , and grow old with. but keep in mind he will pretty much need a bigger shot once he hits 16
A gas operated semi auto youth gun in 20 gauge will provide reasonable weight and light recoil. Mossberg makes one for a reasonable price. If he can handle a little more weight, a 12 gauge gas operated semi auto youth gun with light loads might be a better choice.
Forget about the 410 or a 20 gauge single shot. You should be able to find a Remington 11-87 20 gauge Youth model, synthetic stock at that price range. Both my daughters learned to shoot with that gun, at around that age. Shorter stock and barrel so it is lighter and still balanced well. 20 gauge will take geese if you want to. And recoil is really helped by the gas action. A light pump will have much sharper recoil, and remember that the smaller butt pad of a youth gun will increase the pressure on the shoulder so every bit of reduction helps.
Unfortunately my girls won't let me sell the gun yet!
Unfortunately my girls won't let me sell the gun yet!
Ohh Brobee..................ware art thou?
Post #12
https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/2091103-Looking-for-a-good-junior-shotgun
Post #12
https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/2091103-Looking-for-a-good-junior-shotgun
How short is your son? At 14 years old I was 5 foot 3 inches at least and around 85 pounds. Once I got my hunting license I got a Remington 887 in 12 gauge from my father as a gift. It was my first shotgun. Even though I was very light and short the 12 gauge never hurt my shoulder very much thanks to the fantastic recoil pad. If I were you I would not buy a youth model because very soon he will start to grow once he enters high school and that money will be wasted. Even though that 887 was very big for me at that time, however I just learned to get accustomed to it and probably gained a lot of muscle using it as well. Get a maverick 88 in 12 gauge not a 20 gauge or 410. In fact the youth 20 gauge shotguns have just as much felt recoil as a standard 12 gauge pump action as perceived by the shooter because they are lighter in weight.
I don't find that the Cooey single shots are that light a gun, considering how little there is to them. I do find that they just seem to kick harder too. I used to have a .410 Cooey 84, but now have/periodically use an 84 in 20ga. I'd steer away from them for a young, small-framed shooter.
There really is no cheating physics though, to deliver enough energy ethically I wouldn't go less than a 20ga...and the recoil that comes with it. Unless it's a semi, I think recoil among the Mossberg 500s and Remington 870s will be about the same. The Mossberg will probably be a slightly lower weight, due to the aluminum recevier.
For lowest recoil-a semi will be best but it'll probably be the heaviest of the guns to tote around on long hikes, and cost the most out of the gate.
When I was faced with this same challenge, I picked-up a Remington 870 Youth, 20ga. It has a 21" barrel with Remchoke, shorter buttstock, spongy recoil pad, laminate stock, etc. There is (was?) one model even smaller than that, but I'd steer away from it. (SO small that most kids would likely outgrow it quickly) This was supposed to be an interim, "get them started with it then sell" shotgun, but it's still sees allot of action even though they're all adult-sized now. Even my wife prefers it on the odd occasion she comes out for clays, and it's been a great gun for introducing new shooters to shotguns.
With respect to kids/recoil-my daughter used to shoot 1oz slugs from my 12ga when she was about 10 years old, yet my youngest son only started agreeing to shoot 12ga target loads when he hit 17. And he's about 6'2"/250 lbs! lol I think when kids see some positive results/targets hit with a heavier-recoiling gun than they're used to, it can reshape the pain/gain thought process.
One last note on the 870 Youth-I also like this model because of the laminate stock. Ours is in need of some attention now (thin finish wearing off in spots) but I've found the synthetic stocks on the Express-grade guns to be very abrasive. A long session of clays, and I look like I have a rash on my right cheek=missing skin. lol
There really is no cheating physics though, to deliver enough energy ethically I wouldn't go less than a 20ga...and the recoil that comes with it. Unless it's a semi, I think recoil among the Mossberg 500s and Remington 870s will be about the same. The Mossberg will probably be a slightly lower weight, due to the aluminum recevier.
For lowest recoil-a semi will be best but it'll probably be the heaviest of the guns to tote around on long hikes, and cost the most out of the gate.
When I was faced with this same challenge, I picked-up a Remington 870 Youth, 20ga. It has a 21" barrel with Remchoke, shorter buttstock, spongy recoil pad, laminate stock, etc. There is (was?) one model even smaller than that, but I'd steer away from it. (SO small that most kids would likely outgrow it quickly) This was supposed to be an interim, "get them started with it then sell" shotgun, but it's still sees allot of action even though they're all adult-sized now. Even my wife prefers it on the odd occasion she comes out for clays, and it's been a great gun for introducing new shooters to shotguns.
With respect to kids/recoil-my daughter used to shoot 1oz slugs from my 12ga when she was about 10 years old, yet my youngest son only started agreeing to shoot 12ga target loads when he hit 17. And he's about 6'2"/250 lbs! lol I think when kids see some positive results/targets hit with a heavier-recoiling gun than they're used to, it can reshape the pain/gain thought process.
One last note on the 870 Youth-I also like this model because of the laminate stock. Ours is in need of some attention now (thin finish wearing off in spots) but I've found the synthetic stocks on the Express-grade guns to be very abrasive. A long session of clays, and I look like I have a rash on my right cheek=missing skin. lol
I suggest you go to the Mossberg website and download their catalog. They make several suitable options, in both pump and semi-automatic, that have the shorter length-of-pull that your son will require.
In particular, look at the 510 'Mini Super Bantam', the 505 'Youth', the 500 'Youth Super Bantam', and the SA-20 'Youth Bantam'.
<https://www.mossberg.com/category/application/youth-shotguns/>
<https://www.mossberg.com/>
In particular, look at the 510 'Mini Super Bantam', the 505 'Youth', the 500 'Youth Super Bantam', and the SA-20 'Youth Bantam'.
<https://www.mossberg.com/category/application/youth-shotguns/>
<https://www.mossberg.com/>
As others are suggesting a youth 20 gauge would be a great investment, particularly those that can grow with a young person as they do. There are lots of offerings that feature spacers for the stock or have after market support offering additional stocks.
Remington's 870 and 1187 youth, Browning BPS Micro or Winchester's SXP compact if he is large enough to find them comfortable and Mossberg's Bantam or SA-20 are smaller options.
Remington's 870 and 1187 youth, Browning BPS Micro or Winchester's SXP compact if he is large enough to find them comfortable and Mossberg's Bantam or SA-20 are smaller options.
- Location
- Western Manitoba
I discovered the same. I bought a Cooey 840 (so actually a Winchester Cooey) in 28 gauge for our grandson. Somewhat dismayed to discover it is essentially same dimensions as the 840 12 gauge, right through the front end of the forearm - so barrel walls are MUCH thicker at the action, since barrel OD is the same size. But - from our son, the young fellow handles it well - that extra weight apparently helps with the "buck" - such as it might be in a 28 gauge. Have read that you have to go to the Cooey in 410 to get a smaller receiver, etc. I believe that fit is a lot of it - small enough around grip for small hands, length of pull correct to get the thing mounted easily, and so on. And then kids grow. So what finally gets to be fitted well in the Spring, might end up too small by that same Fall.
Great points. And, not that the OP is leaning towards a Cooey...but...I've also been a bit surprised by how many people find the hammer difficult to #### on these guns. A bit like the cocking knob on the Cooey 22s (39s, 75s, etc.). Lots of people suggest Cooey 22 single shots as a kid's first gun...but my kids never liked shooting them for that reason.
Maybe kids were tougher/stronger back when Cooey's were being made. lol
Look at the Mossberg SA-20 or Weatherby SA-08 Youth models.
20ga, short LOP, and 24in barrel.
I bought a Weatherby when I got my instructor certification and have used it a lot with kids as young as 11.
Light recoil, reliable if kept reasonably clean, and well within your budget. Easy to resell too. Lots of folks have tried to buy mine.
20ga, short LOP, and 24in barrel.
I bought a Weatherby when I got my instructor certification and have used it a lot with kids as young as 11.
Light recoil, reliable if kept reasonably clean, and well within your budget. Easy to resell too. Lots of folks have tried to buy mine.
I would disagree with your statement of it being wasted money. First, if it gets the kid shooting and loving guns, its not wasted money. Second, unless you get absolutely hosed on the purchase price, you can sell the gun once he outgrows it and recoup most of the cost. If you buy a used gun you can probably sell it for the same price as you bought it for, thus being out very little money at the end of the day.
For the OP, a 410 works fine for ground swatting grouse, but hitting one thats airborne requires either extreme skill or extreme luck. I'm sure most of us have missed plenty of grouse with a 12ga, let alone the little 410. That said, some kids just aren't big enough to use anything else, and I'd much rather a gun that is less versatile but my kid wants to shoot than a gun that will beat them up and make them dislike shotgunning.
I would look for a youth gas-operated autoloader that fits his frame more than anything, then either find or load up some reduced hunting loads. My son is a shorty too, 13 years old, not quite 5 feet yet, but he can fire my full-sized Silver with light target loads (which cycle reliably). The recoil comes from powder and shot mass acting on the weight of the gun, so the less of both (or the heavier the gun), the less recoil there will be. Often, 20's are built on smaller frames which mean lighter guns which mean more recoil.
