FTR rulebook concerning equipment

So you must subscribe to the theory that runout is not relevant as well huh.

I dont need to quote anyone any of you place on a pedistal I revert to basic logic. You are all more than welcome to disniss logical conclusions if it makes reloading faster for you or easier.

A fired case has no runout on the OD between body and neck because the chambers are concentric in these areas.

If the necks have been turned then the inside neck will also be concentric.

If you do not neck turn, you are at the mercy of manufacturing tolerances of neck wall thickness. Anything you do with such cases is limited to that variable. Again, you are free to do what you want, but this logic is not disputable.

When I say tight neck, don't take me quite so literally. I do not mean tight as in force the bolt closed, or binding in some way. I mean reduced neck diameter to a diameter that is just clear of the neck wall thickness plus the decided clearance... whatever the shooter feels he wants.

Back to runout... The more you resize the brass, the more runout you create. You will never get really low runout on loaded rounds if you are reducing necks by 0.010-0.015"... Reduce that clearance and you reduce runout. This is a direct correlation.
 
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Maple57 said:
So you must subscribe to the theory that runout is not relevant as well huh. I didn't make that stmt and i am not sure why you seem so argumentative

I dont need to quote anyone any of you place on a pedistal I revert to basic logic. You are all more than welcome to disniss logical conclusions if it makes reloading faster for you or easier.

I do not like to basing decisions on logical guess when there is empirical evidence available, your free to share your empirical evidence with us and we can debate, but basic logic vs empirical evidence

A fired case has no runout on the OD between body and neck because the chambers are concentric in these areas. Agree

If the necks have been turned then the inside neck will also be concentric. Should, yes also agree

If you do not neck turn, you are at the mercy of manufacturing tolerances of neck wall thickness. Anything you do with such cases is limited to that variable. Again, you are free to do what you want, but this logic is not disputable.
Here is where our processes differ. i don not know what you do to size necks, bushing and something, or bushing only. I use bushing and mandrel / pin gauges. The mandrel expands the neck on the inside moving any imperfections to the outside. Depending on the size of the mandrel will give you x amt of consistent neck tension.

I also didn't make any stmt about neck turning. I commented we disagree with running a tight chamber. Neck turning has benefits


When I say tight neck, don't take me quite so literally. I do not mean tight as in force the bolt closed, or binding in some way. I mean reduced neck diameter to a diameter that is just clear of the neck wall thickness plus the decided clearance... whatever the shooter feels he wants.

Sorry this is still too vague a stmt; loaded rounds are .338 -.339 my exampled above indicated F class shooters are looking for clearance of .003 and .005 which would be .341 or .342 chamber. Reloaders spend big dollars buying measuring tools calipers and micrometers to be able to measure and get consistent result. You could help everyone understand what you mean by tight neck with an actual number.

Back to runout... The more you resize the brass, the more runout you create. You will never get really low runout on loaded rounds if you are reducing necks by 0.010-0.015"... Reduce that clearance and you reduce runout. This is a direct correlation.
Partially agree the more sizing the more chance you will induce runout. I don't have any evidence to support neck clearance greater than .010. you wrote .010 to .015.
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MartyK2500 said:
So what would be the ideal weight objective to account in for raingear and mirage band?
Are people aiming 17lbs 8oz? +? -?
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Weigh the gear you want to use.. there is alot of methods and varying weights. If I were to gear up for rain, I would make a semi rigid 'awning' that can be attached to the scope base. with the winds that typically come with the rain, plastic bags and tarps were found wanting very quickly. I want my ammo in a big bag with rags so I can keep my fingers dry before handling.... get under this awning and put the shell in the receiver.... then the awning can be used to direct the case down if you have an ejector (I don't).

The awning would be clear and protect the receiver opening and side so water can't be blown up and into the receiver. It would not weigh much

Jerry
 
manitou210 said:
Marty its 2021 the best shooters I have seen are all shooting Berger 200 to 215 gr not SMKs
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My testing of all popular options up to the Berger 230's showed that the new Gen 200gr MK's is my favorite bullet. Has gotten me on a number of podiums but I stopped in 2018. haven't shot the current gen 215's but the older gen wasn't for me.

Jerry
 
Mystic Precision said:
My testing of all popular options up to the Berger 230's showed that the new Gen 200gr MK's is my favorite bullet. Has gotten me on a number of podiums but I stopped in 2018. haven't shot the current gen 215's but the older gen wasn't for me.

Jerry
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200 smk new gen #2231. Few people have got these bullets to work well in 9 or 10 twists, Jerry is in the minority. Cdn guys up here who test to the nth degree couldn't get the fliers to go away, they eventually abandoned the bullet for Berger which gave better results.

Here is a monster thread on the new 200 SMKs #2231 if you haven't already committed to them.
https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/new-2231-200gr-smk-for-f-tr.3943063/

qtip said:
Anybody have a picture of their rain gear setup. I am curious about this.
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a section of shower curtain and well placed Velcro to hold the curtain in place

DCRA rulebook
F Class competitors may at any time attach a mirage band over the rifle, and/or a piece of transparent material notexceeding 1 metre square over the scope and action (see also Rule 11.05(5)(a)(ii). The transparent material shall:(a) not interfere with the Range Officer's visibility of whether or not the bolt is open; and(b) be attached to the rifle in such a way as to ensure that the material cannot be blown away by wind gusts or muzzle blast
larry-rain-jpg.971177


rain-shield.jpg

Cheers
Trevor
 
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A trick for a very light sunshade, laugh all you want, but a plastic chips bottle (not pringle, another brand that I do not remember at the moment) makes a nice long sunshade over the scope end, and have next to no weight....
 
MartyK2500 said:
Lot’s of cool info here!
I may be stupid at this yet, won’t attaching a mirage band directly on the barrel affect harmonics?
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not stupid... still learning. A friend once said if your not winning your learning.

Will it affect harmonics no.
- Mirage shields weigh at most a few ounces and the weight is spread out over the length of the barrel. barrels are up to 32" long mirage shields can be 28"
- it is attached by velcro or other means at both ends.

Barrel harmonics are affected either by changing the wave or interrupting.

changing the wave by adding a barrel tuner at the end.
interrupting the wave by the barrel touching the stock ( not free floated) or placing hand pressure on the barrel when shooting PRS stages.

Cheers
Trevor
 
Trevor60 said:
200 smk new gen #2231. Few people have got these bullets to work well in 9 or 10 twists, Jerry is in the minority. Cdn guys up here who test to the nth degree couldn't get the fliers to go away, they eventually abandoned the bullet for Berger which gave better results.

Here is a monster thread on the new 200 SMKs #2231 if you haven't already committed to them.
https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/new-2231-200gr-smk-for-f-tr.3943063/

Cheers
Trevor
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For the warmer months, I don't shoot either the 9 or 10 twist... maybe that is why I never experienced any issues. And I ran them at Rattlesnake under severe wind conditions.

Compared to the Berger 200-20X, the MKs were better.. in several respects.

YMMV

Jerry
 
Mystic Precision said:
For the warmer months, I don't shoot either the 9 or 10 twist... maybe that is why I never experienced any issues. And I ran them at Rattlesnake under severe wind conditions.

Compared to the Berger 200-20X, the MKs were better.. in several respects.

YMMV

Jerry
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I don't doubt your result cheers; but as previously mentioned you are in the minority. Haven't heard Sierra winning any events nationals , eastern ,westerns or US nationals or SWN.

Share you tricks maybe we will all move to the Sierra's:evil:
 
Spin them in an 11 twist barrel and see how that works for you.

Won WA state matches in 2018... haven't been to a westerns or nationals in a very long time and unlikely to do so now.

Jerry
 
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Mystic Precision said:
Spin them in an 11 twist barrel and see how that works for you.

Won several WA state matches including all 1000yd match, Frosty Farky at 900... haven't been to a westerns or nationals in a very long time and unlikely to do so now.

Jerry
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You won all these matches with the Sierra 200 SMK #2231.

Cheers
Trevor
 
Won a combined Club match in April, 18. A 2nd for the 2018 State palma championships (was hoping to 3'pete) in May. A NRA gold for the last palma match of the season in 2018...

I really don't have an issue with the new gen 200gr MK's... but YMMV

Jerry

PS, I was shooting a prototype bullet at the Westerns in 2018... that was a trainwreck. Switched back to the Sierra 200's but the damage was already done.
 
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Jerry,

Who was the other guy in those matches?

Just kidding.

Nice job.

SMKs don't usually have the best BC, but they are not finicky either. If winds are mild, there is little advantage to high BC rounds and raw accuracy takes over.

High BC bullets can often be deceptively difficult to get consistent accuracy with.
 
Wind flags wind flags wind flags mirage mirage, get a 3/4 minute gun go shoot on a range with all flags set up. You can have all the above discussion after a day of shooting with a cold drink in your hand. 12+ yrs of F-class shooting and have seen a lot of 1/4 minute guns get their asses handed to them when the wing is up lol
 
shockman said:
Wind flags wind flags wind flags mirage mirage, get a 3/4 minute gun go shoot on a range with all flags set up. You can have all the above discussion after a day of shooting with a cold drink in your hand. 12+ yrs of F-class shooting and have seen a lot of 1/4 minute guns get their asses handed to them when the WIND is up lol
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fixed it for ya
 
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